Cyborg #1 spoilers/discussion

[Agent Z]

No one cares about Ben Grimm. No one. HeÂ’s not in the same light.

Now that's untrue.

Hulk is a good example. He does look cool. HeÂ’s an ordinary man who transforms into a hulking creature. ThatÂ’s actually cool. HeÂ’s not stuck like that. Hulk is a power fantasy.

He was also abused by his father, has had at least three love interests die, his friends either die, abandon him or turn against him and is regularly hunted by the military.

I would not trade lives with Bruce Banner for anything.

The main issue IÂ’m seeing is the lack of advancement in his appearance. ThereÂ’s no technological growth. This ainÂ’t the 80Â’s. If he was alotted an improved appearance, it would open up new storytelling opportunities.

Again, plenty of cyborgs in the modern day look like this and get bo complaint. Raiden and the Winds of Destruction
from Metal Gear, Maximus from King of Fighters, Cyrax and Sektor from Mortal Kombat and Alita from Battle Angel Alita who even got a movie just four years ago.

[Agent Z]

Ben Grimm

The freak who has a WIFE.
The freak who has a lover in Sharon Ventura-who also looked like him for a time.
1974-1986 had his OWN solo series.
10 trades.

Been a LEAD in a book called Fantastic Four for over 60 years. A book at 700 issues.

Hulk
The FREAK who has a WIFE.
The FREAK who has over 600 solo issues.

While those two may look WORST than Vic-they are LIGHT YEARS ahead of Cyborg in development.

It's not always "WOE is me-I am freak."
"WOE is me I hate (blank)."

Fully developed FOLKS.

It's never WOE is ME stories that keep popping back up.

In this issue, we see kids who respect Victor because of his heroism and several superheroes, including ones he's never even had a conversation with on the page showed for his dad's funeral.

[Iconic]

To be clear, I meant that Ben Grimm isn’t in the same shoes as Cyborg. Cyborg is one of extremely few black superheroes. He’s the highest profile visually. He needs to be a power fantasy. When you have so few and your main one is in a perpetual state of trauma and disfigurement, it’s not a good look.

His visual limitations don’t make sense with his powerset. He should be able to transform back and forth. Visually it would add so much to the character and the visual of the book. It’s like Superman having flight but he rides a bike to where there’s trouble.

And in-universe kids respecting Victor means nothing to real readers who want to see this technological character progress with realistic and in-universe technological times.

To put a bow on it: Vic should be a leading man and treated as such on-page. He’s their highest profile non-legacy black male super. He should be DC’s Black Panther. Not the sidekicks support man.

[Shockingjustice]

You're talking about a comic starring such a character right now. They aren't doing anything to Victor they haven't or wouldn't do with either of those guys. Just looking at Wonder Woman for example, her mother has been killed off twice and their relationship has at times been far worse than Victor and Silas's.

Honestly I too am hungering for a Black man and Woman two stand up with the league in terms of power fantasy, but I've always felt like Cyborg isn't that character for me. I do like him and was a fan during the TT cartoon run (not TTgo). He's also the Black hero I've experienced the most as a kid, second to Static from his cartoon and even more than John from JLU. But something is always holding me back from enjoying him the way I do Static.

[Iconic]

Honestly I too am hungering for a Black man and Woman two stand up with the league in terms of power fantasy, but I've always felt like Cyborg isn't that character for me. I do like him and was a fan during the TT cartoon run (not TTgo). He's also the Black hero I've experienced the most as a kid, second to Static from his cartoon and even more than John from JLU. But something is always holding me back from enjoying him the way I do Static.

It could be because he’s Cyborg at all times. Static had a life away from superheroics. Pretty much all the greatest characters do. I don’t think I’d enjoy Batman as much if he was “the bat” 24/7.

We see Cyborg everywhere. Why can’t they capitalize?

[Factor]

I gotta say im disappointed in the responses in this thread, I get that people want a happier Vic and thats fair but this isn't the same Man vs Machine crap that DC has been feeding us. This feels like actual effort to resolve the issues he has with his Fahter.

This issue is a deccent start, my only real gripe about this issue is the art, its kinda bleh.

My problem is that it seems like EVERY run he gets is about his father issues. And when things look more or less resolved, another writer comes in and decides to try another hand at it because they feel they haven’t been resolved enough.
I’ve read Hampton’s CBR interview about #1 and everything he says about the story he wants to tell AFTER this first mini sounds infinitely more interesting than the father angle:

I'm telling a very grounded story right now with Victor. The goal is to establish that he is a human and how you navigate and overcome a traumatic experience like he has. I think it's a necessary journey for him to go on before he can truly stretch his wings. But after that, if I ever get the chance to write more Cyborg, I want to lean into that powerset and the larger mechanisms that make him Cyborg a bit more and establish him as a frontrunner for DC and make him part of a Quaternity

https://www.cbr.com/cyborg-morgan-hampton-fan-qa/

[skyvolt2000]

You're talking about a comic starring such a character right now. They aren't doing anything to Victor they haven't or wouldn't do with either of those guys. Just looking at Wonder Woman for example, her mother has been killed off twice and their relationship has at times been far worse than Victor and Silas's.

Wonder Woman has over 800 stories about her.

Including issues with her mother.

Including issues where they get along.

With Vic as others have pointed out we KEEP getting this "I hate my Daddy issue" in his solos.

We can't keep having his books play this game every single time.

Wonder Woman and others have books where they don't talk about issues with their parents.


You keep brining that up and guess what happens to that book???

You won't have a book. See Black Panther. Folks TIRED of the black male bashing that book has done the last 8 years.

Here we got the same issue of "I hate Daddy".

[Frontier]

Wolfman showed Vic out and about pretty often in the New Teen Titans.

[BohemiaDrinker]

Wonder Woman has over 800 stories about her.

Including issues with her mother.

Including issues where they get along.

With Vic as others have pointed out we KEEP getting this "I hate my Daddy issue" in his solos.

We can't keep having his books play this game every single time.

Wonder Woman and others have books where they don't talk about issues with their parents.


You keep brining that up and guess what happens to that book???

You won't have a book. See Black Panther. Folks TIRED of the black male bashing that book has done the last 8 years.

Here we got the same issue of "I hate Daddy".

That's fair, however, since every attempt to elevate Vic so far has been botched by one reason or another, these issues need to be dealt with in offer for the character to move on from them. And from what I'be seen (not much, I'll admit) that's exactly the intent of the aurhor here. So I think folks might be jumping the gun a little by declaring "same old, same old" based on this first issue alone.

[skyvolt2000]

That's fair, however, since every attempt to elevate Vic so far has been botched by one reason or another, these issues need to be dealt with in offer for the character to move on from them. And from what I'be seen (not much, I'll admit) that's exactly the intent of the aurhor here. So I think folks might be jumping the gun a little by declaring "same old, same old" based on this first issue alone.

Seeing what his Dad is like now might have something to do with that. That has Cyborg dealing with that robot-so we got man vs machine again in different form.

And there is no excuse for that when the toxic editor of the previous runs are no longer at DC and you had the ear of Marv Wolfman working with you.

WHo probably should have told him to NOT use the fake Candance Owens-who SEEMS to forget while Cyborg is from Detroit. There was a Justice League team there once and Star Labs is there. As is Michael Holt's company. Why not call those folks out as well?

Cyborg was saving the world-I think that is more important that Detroit.

He has moved on from this so many other times yet almost every writer wants to bring it back up.

It's final order cutoff this weekend for issue 2. I have seen too many folks say they are DONE with this book.

[BohemiaDrinker]

He has moved on from this so many other times yet almost every writer wants to bring it back

I don't think he has. Sure, there were creatives who tried. But they were hit with cancelings or edicts or Geoff Johns writting the character at the same time or whatever other reason that pretty much canceled any advance. Vic is stuck there and if there isn't one story to which folks can point out and say "here's is where the character left those issues behind", he'll remain there. This book seems like a sincere attempt to elevate Cyborg, unlike the previous ones. But if people don't go along with it, they're gonna reset Vic to the same status quo again.

[Customizer]

Seeing what his Dad is like now might have something to do with that. That has Cyborg dealing with that robot-so we got man vs machine again in different form.

And there is no excuse for that when the toxic editor of the previous runs are no longer at DC and you had the ear of Marv Wolfman working with you.

WHo probably should have told him to NOT use the fake Candance Owens-who SEEMS to forget while Cyborg is from Detroit. There was a Justice League team there once and Star Labs is there. As is Michael Holt's company. Why not call those folks out as well?

Cyborg was saving the world-I think that is more important that Detroit.

He has moved on from this so many other times yet almost every writer wants to bring it back up.

It's final order cutoff this weekend for issue 2. I have seen too many folks say they are DONE with this book.

Interesting.

I'll withhold my thoughts regarding the run until issue #3. I'll decide whether to continue or drop the title then. With that said ...... based upon your quote and comments in this thread the tolerance for what DC has tried to establish as the status quo for this character is *low*. That's wonderful to read. It's great hearing about people opting not to pay money for the exact opposite of content they're asking for as a paying customer.



Without commenting on the content I will say that the writer isn't bad and I don't have any problem with him. I sincerely get the impression that the energy, creativity and enthusiasm he has is ready to explode if he's given a bit more creative freedom from DC.

[Agent Z]

Wonder Woman has over 800 stories about her.

Including issues with her mother.

Including issues where they get along.

With Vic as others have pointed out we KEEP getting this "I hate my Daddy issue" in his solos.

We can't keep having his books play this game every single time.

Wonder Woman and others have books where they don't talk about issues with their parents.


You keep brining that up and guess what happens to that book???

You won't have a book. See Black Panther. Folks TIRED of the black male bashing that book has done the last 8 years.

Here we got the same issue of "I hate Daddy".

Victor and Silas have also reconciled and had a better relationship over the years. And there is no male bashing in this book.

[Agent Z]

Seeing what his Dad is like now might have something to do with that. That has Cyborg dealing with that robot-so we got man vs machine again in different form.

How are you getting this idea? We don't even know if that's really his dad.

WHo probably should have told him to NOT use the fake Candance Owens-who SEEMS to forget while Cyborg is from Detroit. There was a Justice League team there once and Star Labs is there. As is Michael Holt's company. Why not call those folks out as well?

That blogger barely talked about Victor and spent more time bashing the CEO of the company that was leading Detroit's gentrification.

[Rac7d*]

Also…it be nice to have a black male character who isn’t a backup, sidekick or legacy character who can be seen as a power fantasy similar to Batman, Superman, Flash, Wonder Woman, Aquaman, etc.

Power Fantasy ? Cyborg is treated to expendable for me to ever feel that. I can’t think of an animated adaptation of him not being mauled horrifically