X-Men Monday #203 – Ewing, Gillen & Spurrier Reflect on Sins of Sinister

[Celestialbodies]

But, Selene Gallio was born during the Hyborean Age (circa 14,000 - 10,000 BC), and En Sabah Nur was born during the Middle Bronze Age (circa 3000 - 2001) making Selene older than him ergo, Selene had brought magic to the land before him. Not to mention Selene argued to the Quiet Council that her powers, experience, immortality, and intimate knowledge of magic would make her a qualified replacement for Apocalypse. So, even though she died recently in Immortal X-Men v1 #2 she was on the planet first and brought magic to the modern era with her...

Selene never gets her due respect as mothern of the mutants, certainly not now nor in the past!

[Micabe]

Selene never gets her due respect as mothern of the mutants, certainly not now nor in the past!

Fortunately, Selene has devoted worshippers and has no need for Krakoan Resurrection

[JB]

But, Selene Gallio was born during the Hyborean Age (circa 14,000 - 10,000 BC), and En Sabah Nur was born during the Middle Bronze Age (circa 3000 - 2001) making Selene older than him ergo, Selene had brought magic to the land before him. Not to mention Selene argued to the Quiet Council that her powers, experience, immortality, and intimate knowledge of magic would make her a qualified replacement for Apocalypse. So, even though she died recently in Immortal X-Men v1 #2 she was on the planet first and brought magic to the modern era with her...

A mutant who performs magic is not the "mutant magic" idea introduced by Apocalypse, what he believes is superior magic that doesn't require promises, bargains, sacrifices, etc. He believes mutants do not have to "pay" for their innate magic. A magic that increases in power through community, especially in groups of five, with four active participants and a stabilizer. Forming an X, specific to mutants and their combined gifts. Selene has never spoken about this before because it was introduced via Apocalypse. We're talking about two different things and you'll find more about it in early issues Excalibur (2019) up until about #15 when Apocalypse leaves with his family to Amenth. (Rictor attempts to use it later but not as successfully).

[Micabe]

A mutant who performs magic is not the "mutant magic" idea introduced by Apocalypse, what he believes is superior magic that doesn't require promises, bargains, sacrifices, etc. He believes mutants do not have to "pay" for their innate magic. A magic that increases in power through community, especially in groups of five, with four active participants and a stabilizer. Forming an X, specific to mutants and their combined gifts. Selene has never spoken about this before because it was introduced via Apocalypse. We're talking about two different things and you'll find more about it in early issues Excalibur (2019) up until about #15 when Apocalypse leaves with his family to Amenth. (Rictor attempts to use it later but not as successfully).

Yeah, whatever

[cranger]

Yeah, whatever

This is how I feel every time I see someone write about 'mutant circuits' with a straight face. I remember making 'circuits' with the fusion system in Marvel Ultimate Alliance 2 (and even that was not new, stuff like that happened in comics all the time).

[Grunty]

This is how I feel every time I see someone write about 'mutant circuits' with a straight face. I remember making 'circuits' with the fusion system in Marvel Ultimate Alliance 2 (and even that was not new, stuff like that happened in comics all the time).

The whole "mutant circuits" and "mutant technology" thing seems to me, like it was there and made a big deal to hint at the idea that the mutants are on the dark path to self machination and hive society with Krakoa, essentialy becomming like the Children of Tomorrow.

But with Hickman gone it now seems to be mainly another "big deal" concept that just exist with little actual pay off or major usage. Just like mutant magic.

While on the subject. It's quite notable that in various adaptations it seems the creators try to side step or alter the presence of functional magic in the Marvel Universe, likely because it's a dominantly "super science" based setting.

Super soldier serums, lab accidents, experiments gone, special genes, alien heritage, alien technology and so on. The vast majority of Marvel Heros have super powers based on science inspired ideas.

And because for most viewers the concept of super science and magic being real don't mix well (or science ends up dominanting magic), the magical elements will usualy get explained into scientific ways or avoided all together. Often along the line of Clarke's third law.

As such the very idea of trying to introduce magic into the mutant mythos on a large scale might be too much like pouring oil into water and not mix very well in the long run.

[Nicoclaws]

The whole "mutant circuits" and "mutant technology" thing seems to me, like it was there and made a big deal to hint at the idea that the mutants are on the dark path to self machination and hive society with Krakoa, essentialy becomming like the Children of Tomorrow.

But with Hickman gone it now seems to be mainly another "big deal" concept that just exist with little actual pay off or major usage. Just like mutant magic.

While on the subject. It's quite notable that in various adaptations it seems the creators try to side step or alter the presence of functional magic in the Marvel Universe, likely because it's a dominantly "super science" based setting.

Super soldier serums, lab accidents, experiments gone, special genes, alien heritage, alien technology and so on. The vast majority of Marvel Heros have super powers based on science inspired ideas.

And because for most viewers the concept of super science and magic being real don't mix well (or science ends up dominanting magic), the magical elements will usualy get explained into scientific ways or avoided all together. Often along the line of Clarke's third law.

As such the very idea of trying to introduce magic into the mutant mythos on a large scale might be too much like pouring oil into water and not mix very well in the long run.

Totally agree with you about magic and science in media, and that it generally mixes weirdly with the concept of mutants. If magic is linked to spirituality, does it mean that mutants have another spirituality than humans, just because of a gene ?
Personnally I LOVE the idea of mutant culture and even the Spark, now that I thought about it. But what I like about Krakoa is they're finding new ways because they're TRYING, not because it's innate in the X-genome.

I like your idea for circuits as biomachinery, and it could be/have been Hickman's endgame indeed BUT.
I also like to think metatextually that mutants DO work better has a team (book) and they put that into a word/concept and expanded it to a community level. Like they thought "oh, why do X-solos kinda feel weird ? Oh because they work together way better !"

[JB]

We'll see what elements Ewing will keep or not keep as he builds on the idea. Apocalypse has had some time to practice while in Amenth so he may have updated his material. I do like that Ewing brought the External Gate back as that was A's brainchild and it allowed Jean and Exodus to move the entirety of Arakko to Mars with Lactuca's mapping.

[king of hybrids]

The only two gangstas who are threats to a Dominion are Galactus and Phoenix...

I think that only really applies to Dominions that are formed from Titans (the AIs so advanced they collapse into literal singularities) via attacking their constituent black holes. The Sinister Dominion seems to have skipped those parts and may not have any such weak spots (probably requiring intervention from the Ivory or Onyx Kings)

[ZephyrSurf]

I think the best expression of Mutant Circuits still exists in the Reis/Ayala run of New Mutants.

That was stuff that genuinely had completely different effects from just adding 1+1. I don't think any other writer was doing anything as interesting before and definitely hasn't since.

Mutant Magic has always been incredibly hollow in expression or distinction from regular magic and I could totally do without it.

[Micabe]

The whole "mutant circuits" and "mutant technology" thing seems to me, like it was there and made a big deal to hint at the idea that the mutants are on the dark path to self machination and hive society with Krakoa, essentialy becomming like the Children of Tomorrow.

But with Hickman gone it now seems to be mainly another "big deal" concept that just exist with little actual pay off or major usage. Just like mutant magic.

While on the subject. It's quite notable that in various adaptations it seems the creators try to side step or alter the presence of functional magic in the Marvel Universe, likely because it's a dominantly "super science" based setting.

Super soldier serums, lab accidents, experiments gone, special genes, alien heritage, alien technology and so on. The vast majority of Marvel Heros have super powers based on science inspired ideas.

And because for most viewers the concept of super science and magic being real don't mix well (or science ends up dominanting magic), the magical elements will usualy get explained into scientific ways or avoided all together. Often along the line of Clarke's third law.

As such the very idea of trying to introduce magic into the mutant mythos on a large scale might be too much like pouring oil into water and not mix very well in the long run.

Anyone else notice that the evolution technique used for the Children of Tomorrow is nearly identical to the technique used for the Children of the Vault?

[ZephyrSurf]

Anyone else notice that the evolution technique used for the Children of Tomorrow is nearly identical to the technique used for the Children of the Vault?

yes, hickman has a lot of standbys he comes back to and dresses up as other things.

It's like how the Horsemen are no different from the Black Order, who are no different from the Horsemen of East of West

And Orchis is just a retread of Leviathan from Secret Warriors.

[anyajenkins]

I think the best expression of Mutant Circuits still exists in the Reis/Ayala run of New Mutants.

That was stuff that genuinely had completely different effects from just adding 1+1. I don't think any other writer was doing anything as interesting before and definitely hasn't since.

Mutant Magic has always been incredibly hollow in expression or distinction from regular magic and I could totally do without it.

Yeah, some of the ‘circuits’ are just huh? Like during the whatever the evil plants crossover story was. Magma brought up lave, iceman froze it and magneto used the frozen lava to hit the plants. First how is that a circuit, really? Second, iceman just freezing the all the plants would have worked better anyway. What kills the plants in the yard, throwing rocks at them or winter?

[ZephyrSurf]

Like if we're gonna do the mutant circuit thing. We need more **** like this that makes you go "What the **** is that? That's dope and unexpected"

[Kingdom X]

Yeah, whatever

So now y’all just being rude when someone literally points to exactly what was in the text? The points each of you were making weren’t even opposing so there was no reason to correct anyone. Selene can be the first mutant who used magic and Apocalypse can be the one who tried to get other mutants to use it collaboratively during the Krakoa era. Those things aren’t mutually exclusive.

Like if we're gonna do the mutant circuit thing. We need more **** like this that makes you go "What the **** is that? That's dope and unexpected"

I MISS THIS BOOK *sob*