The Gotham War: Batman vs. Catwoman Crossover

[exile001]

I didn't think Williamson had a connection to Gotham War . . .

Or batman v Robin

I think on that they mean the new Batman & Robin (apparently ties to GW, haven't read it yet) and Robin was the build up to Batman v Robin.

Personally, looking through that list I think it's an indictment of how much DC is leaning on one guy (AGAIN) and the quality of work is really not living up to the level of output or responsibility.

[Frontier]

I mean, is it any worse than Bruce seemingly throwing a temper tantrum? He practically makes Damien look mature.

At least he has the excuse he's genuinely mentally compromised. What's Selina's? Selective memory?

As Jason himself pointed out, Bruce deeming himself the arbiter of what is and isn't acceptable in Gotham isn't necessarily one of his more admirable qualities.

Hard to really buy into from Jason's perspective when he's acting like he's only against him because he wants to mess with Bruce. It also felt like the pot calling the kettle black and undermined by Jason's attitude/actions.

Or maybe she understands better than most people. In fact, I think she does considering studies have shown that the death penalty does absolutely nothing to deter crime.

I don't think that was the point of the story though. I haven't re-read it in a while but I don't think that was the message of that story.

Unsurprisingly, we're on opposite sides on this one, too.

I think the real question is if DC is doing it deliberately.

Because with the wealth and influence he had (when he was on the wealthier side, anyway), he could've done more. He could've actually attacked the systemic roots that make people feel like the have to turn to crime rather than attack them with the fancy new car he just built.

How has he not done more? We've seen him set up numerous charities to help the disenfranchised, give criminals or people on the streets employment, actively try to improve the cities' infrastructure and business to give people more jobs/opportunities...that's why Selina's critique that he wasted all his money on Batman stuff rings hollow, because it was absolutely not true.

Saving people's lives, I'm down with. Protecting rich people's property when they could be using that time to save more lives just seems like a waste.

But then you're basically saying it's okay to rob people and let people get away with robbing said people because of a wage gap. And expecting heroes to ignore crimes right in front of them.

I mean, if someone died in the middle of them stopping a robbery, that's one thing, but they can't be everywhere all at once anyways.

Wait, I thought all crimes were equal

DCU vigilantism doesn't quite work like IRL vigilantism .

[Rac7d*]

I didn't think Williamson had a connection to Gotham War . . .

Or batman v Robin

I know he didnt write those two but since hes kinda directing the general direction of the DC at the moment im putting it on him

[MAR420X]

got 2 read batman 138 over the weekend.

its going to be one of the most controversial bat issues' in a long time especially with what happens to a certain character.

also picks up one of my favorite sub plots from Scott's new 52 Bat run.

The last pages of this book sets up the real war in Gotham.

[Hypo]

Catwoman #58 Variant by Joshua "Sway" Swaby

[Felipe Silveira]

got 2 read batman 138 over the weekend.

its going to be one of the most controversial bat issues' in a long time especially with what happens to a certain character.

also picks up one of my favorite sub plots from Scott's new 52 Bat run.

The last pages of this book sets up the real war in Gotham.

Well, on the cover we have Batman and Nightwing, including Dick taking the oath............so
If it is something new, it's been months since Nightwing has been limited to butt jokes from the terribly bad Harley show.

[Drako]

got 2 read batman 138 over the weekend.

its going to be one of the most controversial bat issues' in a long time especially with what happens to a certain character.

also picks up one of my favorite sub plots from Scott's new 52 Bat run.

The last pages of this book sets up the real war in Gotham.

Prepare yourself for the jobbing section, boys! Who could've seen that coming??!?!

[Frontier]

Let me guess:

spoilers:

Bruce beats up Dick and really hurts him or something to that effect.

end of spoilers

[MajorHoy]

Let me guess:

spoilers:

Bruce beats up Dick and really hurts him or something to that effect.

end of spoilers

Well, I'm assuming at least spoilers:

Bruce won't shoot Dick in the head with a gun

end of spoilers

[TheKryptonMan]

Catwoman #58 Variant by Joshua "Sway" Swaby

That's a very cool cover with Catwoman & I can't tell if that's Riddler or Joker , I'm leaning towards Riddler .

[Hypo]

Catwoman #57 Preview
Writer: Tini Howard
Artist: Nico Leon

[phonogram12]

If Selina wanted to actually rob the villains of Gotham of their henchman and reform them, she'd set up a way to teach them normal, non-crime jobs, like actual programs for this.

She's never known that sort of life, though. And being a criminal so far has worked out pretty decently, so it's not surprising really that she would take this approach.

This story feels like it's actively taking the piss out of actual criminal reform programs by comparing them to "Just do crime against the right targets and you're reformed enough"

The US has the second highest number of detainees in the world. Tell me how well those programs are working.

[phonogram12]

At least he has the excuse he's genuinely mentally compromised. What's Selina's? Selective memory?

Mentally compromised by his own doing. Also, Selina really doesn't come off as a bitter ex to me. She just seems like someone sick of a system punishing the same people they put in bad situations to being with.

Hard to really buy into from Jason's perspective when he's acting like he's only against him because he wants to mess with Bruce. It also felt like the pot calling the kettle black and undermined by Jason's attitude/actions.

That could be a part of it. But I don't think he was lying when he said that he thought that Batman helps pushes these relatively small-time and (in the big picture) harmless guys to work for the likes of Joker and Bane where they are undoubtedly forced to do more damage.

I don't think that was the point of the story though. I haven't re-read it in a while but I don't think that was the message of that story.

Maybe not. Still doesn't mean it's not true, though.

I think the real question is if DC is doing it deliberately.

*shrugs*

I don't see why that's such a bad thing.

How has he not done more? We've seen him set up numerous charities to help the disenfranchised, give criminals or people on the streets employment, actively try to improve the cities' infrastructure and business to give people more jobs/opportunities...that's why Selina's critique that he wasted all his money on Batman stuff rings hollow, because it was absolutely not true.

I would never say that Gotham doesn't need a Batman. But what I would say is that Bruce could've used his influence to help influence public policy more so people wouldn't have to turn to crime to begin with. We haven't seen this since NML and I think it's high time that we see this sort of story again.

But then you're basically saying it's okay to rob people and let people get away with robbing said people because of a wage gap. And expecting heroes to ignore crimes right in front of them.

I mean, if someone died in the middle of them stopping a robbery, that's one thing, but they can't be everywhere all at once anyways.

All I'm saying is prioritize. People over property.

DCU vigilantism doesn't quite work like IRL vigilantism .

But...but...I thought Batman feels that all laws are laws?!? lol

[Saithor]

She's never known that sort of life, though. And being a criminal so far has worked out pretty decently, so it's not surprising really that she would take this approach.



The US has the second highest number of detainees in the world. Tell me how well those programs are working.

Wow I guess criminal reform and reintegration into society systems only exist in the US. I guess in France they just put a cap in the back of their heads, dump in a pit and call it done. But thanks for telling us your views on systems meant to be an alternative to locking people in prison for non-violent crimes.

[thwhtGuardian]

She's never known that sort of life, though. And being a criminal so far has worked out pretty decently, so it's not surprising really that she would take this approach.



The US has the second highest number of detainees in the world. Tell me how well those programs are working.

When I say that Selina's plan was a sophomoric idea this kind of reaction is exactly what I meant. Yes, the criminal justice system in the US is deeply flawed and has failed multitudes of people...but the solution is to teach those people that crime is okay if directed at a different population?

Why not focus on better education? Better job training programs? Comprehensive reform of the affordable housing market ? Higher minimum wage? Free healthcare? Getting rid of minimum sentencing?

Nah, just tell them robbing the rich is okay.