ASM #26 Preview

[Lee]

I agree it's up to the writer. But if you agree with that, you also agree it was Slott who kept them apart for 10 years, right? That it was him who, in your words, did not want to write them together.

For 10 years? No. He was one of a group of writers for his first few years on the title. He probably could have had them together as an unmarried couple during his solo run, but I'm glad he didn't.

He wrote Renew Your Vows for the people invested in that relationship, which was successful enough to get spun off into an ongoing series (which eventually people stopped buying).

[marvelprince]

For 10 years? No. He was one of a group of writers for his first few years on the title. He probably could have had them together as an unmarried couple during his solo run, but I'm glad he didn't.

He wrote Renew Your Vows for the people invested in that relationship, which was successful enough to get spun off into an ongoing series (which eventually people stopped buying).

I think too many people who clamor for married Spider-Man or Peter to settle down with a family don’t appreciate that those books may start off with interest but it tends to Peter out. Pun intended. Renew your vows is one, but Spider-Girl is probably my favorite example. On the old comic boards everyone and their mother would talk about how it’s so good, it’s finally got a adult Peter etc etc but the book sold so poorly it was cancelled several times before eventually being put to rest.

[clonegeek]

For 10 years? No. He was one of a group of writers for his first few years on the title. He probably could have had them together as an unmarried couple during his solo run, but I'm glad he didn't.

He wrote Renew Your Vows for the people invested in that relationship, which was successful enough to get spun off into an ongoing series (which eventually people stopped buying).

Because RYV was a secondary title that lead to Marvel not marketing again

[exile001]

Renew your vows is one, but Spider-Girl is probably my favorite example. On the old comic boards everyone and their mother would talk about how it’s so good, it’s finally got a adult Peter etc etc but the book sold so poorly it was cancelled several times before eventually being put to rest.

That's not a great argument, as the same can pretty much be said for any spin-off regardless of quality. Heck, that can pretty much be said about anything outside of Amazing Spider-Man and a handful of other books Marvel publishes.

[Triniking1234]

I think too many people who clamor for married Spider-Man or Peter to settle down with a family don’t appreciate that those books may start off with interest but it tends to Peter out. Pun intended. Renew your vows is one, but Spider-Girl is probably my favorite example. On the old comic boards everyone and their mother would talk about how it’s so good, it’s finally got a adult Peter etc etc but the book sold so poorly it was cancelled several times before eventually being put to rest.

A lot of spin-off books do poorly. Even Spider-Man/Deadpool which was talked about a lot here dropped to cancellation numbers. You can even see it now with the X-Men books.

[Garlador]

That's not a great argument, as the same can pretty much be said for any spin-off regardless of quality. Heck, that can pretty much be said about anything outside of Amazing Spider-Man and a handful of other books Marvel publishes.

Yeah. She-Hulk has been canceled countless times and always relaunches.

Pointing to Spider-Girl is also a pretty bad example given it remains the longest-running female-led superhero book in Marvel’s entire history.

ALL books lose momentum after a period of time or with creative team change-over. Nightwing was almost cancelled after the hated “Ric Grayson” era (now back to a best-seller with a new team). Spin-off, alternate universe books will also always struggle since they lack the ability to properly integrate with that “main” 616 universe (you won’t see Krakoa in RYV or The Midnight Mission in Spider-Girl, etc).

I would absolutely still be reading Spider-Girl and RYV right now if they were putting out a quality book. On the reverse side, Marvel’s main Spidey book is a dumpster fire and a torrent of readers are asking for change. If RYV and Spider-Girl has stories this bad, Marvel would have just pulled the plug instead of relaunching with a new creative team eventually. It’s a double-standard because the main book at its worst has a higher sales floor than most amazing books’ sales ceilings.

[Kevinroc]

Yeah. She-Hulk has been canceled countless times and always relaunches.

Pointing to Spider-Girl is also a pretty bad example given it remains the longest-running female-led book in Marvel’s entire history.

ALL books lose momentum after a period of time or with creative team change-over. Nightwing was almost cancelled after the hated “Ric Grayson” era (now back to a best-seller with a new team). Spin-off, alternate universe books will also always struggle since they lack the ability to properly integrate with that “main” 616 universe (you won’t see Krakoa in RYV or The Midnight Mission in Spider-Girl, etc).

I would absolutely still be reading Spider-Girl and RYV right now if they were putting out a quality book. On the reverse side, Marvel’s main Spidey book is a dumpster fire and a torrent of readers are asking for change. If RYV and Spider-Girl has stories this bad, Marvel would have just pulled the plug instead of relaunching with a new creative team eventually. It’s a double-standard because the main book at its worst has a higher sales floor than most amazing books’ sales ceilings.

Spider-Girl is Marvel's longest-running superhero title with a female lead in Marvel's publishing history.

Millie the Model Comics (which was later renamed to just Millie the Model but kept the original numbering) had over 200 consecutive issues.

[clonegeek]

Spider-Girl is Marvel's longest-running superhero title with a female lead in Marvel's publishing history.

Millie the Model Comics (which was later renamed to just Millie the Model but kept the original numbering) had over 200 consecutive issues.

Spider-Girl made it to 100 issues without a relaunch.

[Kevinroc]

Spider-Girl made it to 100 issues without a relaunch.

Millie the Model Comics made it to issue #143. Issue #144 was just called Millie the Model, where it continued on until #207.

Spider-Girl is Marvel's longest-running female led superhero title.

[Garlador]

Spider-Girl made it to 100 issues without a relaunch.

Distinction still made. Spider-Girl is the longest-running female hero book Marvel ever did without a relaunch.

I do know it often teetered on the edge of cancellation a few times, but given the entire MC2 universe failed, it’s a miracle it lasted as long as it did, and readers constantly campaigned to ensure it stayed above the cancellation numbers. Again, given the book was an alternate reality spin-off, I think that says a ton about how much fans wanted a Spider-family book and stories with Mayday, and this was before OMD really pissed those readers off.

[clonegeek]

Millie the Model Comics made it to issue #143. Issue #144 was just called Millie the Model, where it continued on until #207.

Spider-Girl is Marvel's longest-running female led superhero title.

Yeah, it just sad how Marvel doesn't really give their female characters the chance to get to that point without a relaunch

[Spider-Tiger]

RYV sold very well when it was in the main title. It's when it was spun off as an au that interest fizzled. As most spin offs do. (And it could be argued that interest really fizzled when they aged up Annie. It made RYV seem like a Spider-girl copycat)

And as others have mentioned, Spider-Girl even lasting for as long as it did as another spin off au is actually quite the achievement.

[Xenon]

It's been less than one year since they've been together. They were constantly on-again off-again many many many times post OMD and there has been PLENTY of Peter/MJ stuff and times they've been a couple since then. It ain't like they've been separated/just friends for 15 years post OMD, far FAR from it.

Becuase they're only apart due to a horrible executive meddling event any time they split them up is going to just harken back to that original time. That Spencer was fixing it but they reversed course doesn't give thme more credit it just makes people more upset.

Considering this is Slott's own view, what Spidey is saying isn't meant to be wrong.

Also the change of mind post-Superior, I can understand why, she got fucked over because of Superior's events and is now butthurt at the Spider-Man side, so at least there is a reason for her to change her mind, unlike other times in Slott's run where characters change their own damn mind about **** for the most random reasons (Such as in Superior where JJ is supportive of Spider-Otto's actions).

It would have been pretty easy to turn the fact that Doc Ock almost violated her into a reason they should try and stay away from each other. But Slott made the same mistake that Wells in making now, which is trying too hard to sell the idea that she's moved past him. It can't just be that they want to be together but they're scared about some of the crazy things, it has to be that MJ can't handle the crazy things anymore. It can't be that Mary Jane feels a responsibility to the kids and keeping them with who they think of as their father, it has to be that she doesn't love PEter and doesn't have the time of day for him. And it's especially stupid at this point, because everyone even Marvel editorial acknowledges she's the goal and endgame. No one is even pretending anymore there will be some new great love interest for single Spider-Man, but the book is written as they this is the impression they have to give. Like it's not 1978 anymore guys, no one thinks when MJ leaves town its for good anymore.

Stop with the Avengers 200 nonsense. In that storyline, Carol Danvers gave birth to the man who raped her.
Let me say that again…

Carol
Gave birth
To her rapist

She was raped, impregnated, and gave birth to the very man who raped her just days before.

Can I say it any other way? Just let that sink in a bit.

While I concur that this Spider-man arc has been terrible, it doesn’t come close to being as bad as avengers 200.

It's not an identical situation but it's hard not to draw strong paralells. CArol is trapped in an alternative dimension with a dude who when she comes back she claims to love is pretty much the exact same scenario. Now, 200 is much worse because Marcus uses machins to brainwash Carol, so it's different, but that also ignores a lot of issue that naturally arise from the situation that MJ was put in. Like even if we were to accept that it was in character for her to give up on Peter, that woudl still leave the Paul relationship as problematic. She's alone, in danger, and only has this one man to help her. She has no choice outside of 'be alone or be with him'. Whiel that's not entirely Paul's fault (though actually it kind of is considering he helped Rabin unknowingly), it still makes the entire situation problematic.

How often were MJ and Peter together after OMD? Cuz I remember the Jackpot tease era when it wasn't her. Then it was Dark Reign so Peter was single for all of that. Then he was with Michelle then Carlie then Doc Ock was in his body with Anna then Mockingbird.

They're only together during the spencer run. Slott would tease it a couple of times but always subverted it.

For 10 years? No. He was one of a group of writers for his first few years on the title. He probably could have had them together as an unmarried couple during his solo run, but I'm glad he didn't.

He wrote Renew Your Vows for the people invested in that relationship, which was successful enough to get spun off into an ongoing series (which eventually people stopped buying).

Again, this is a misunderstanding of the situation. I'm more invested in the story of spider-Man, which is the 616 story told in ASM. It should be restored there because it was a part of hist story they poorly and unjustly removed for no benefit.

I think too many people who clamor for married Spider-Man or Peter to settle down with a family don’t appreciate that those books may start off with interest but it tends to Peter out. Pun intended. Renew your vows is one, but Spider-Girl is probably my favorite example. On the old comic boards everyone and their mother would talk about how it’s so good, it’s finally got a adult Peter etc etc but the book sold so poorly it was cancelled several times before eventually being put to rest.

This is a misguided idea. "Married" Spider-Man books sold more than any Spider-Man book has sold sinse, because again this is red herring. It's not rreally about his marital status. No spin-off book sells like the main book. Regardless of the cirucmstance. Even then RYV has pretty much been close to the most successful spin off title since the OMD era began. It lasted as long as The Zdarsky run of Spectacular and just slightly less than Jed McKay's various Black Cat series (though to be fair BC got 2 #1s and some event tie ins to reach that).

[Nightwing96]

There is no real acceptable answer to give Peter, because it has been already established in throughout prior run that she had relearned how to accept him being Spider-Man. If it was about simply being done with Peter, why ask him to move in upon his recovery from the nuclear radiation in the ending of Amazing Spider-Man(2018). There isn't a single moment where she says "I'm done" in the current run, its more implied I kind of cheated on you and moved on with a year with a dude who assisted in planetary genocide and committed patricide(but its okay "he's a good guy", despite literally doing nothing good other than helping with the two kids and clearly doesn't really feel all that guilty, because who in their right mind would a person who is complicit in planetary genocide who alleged feels guilt and pain because of it feel that it would be ok to walk around like a normal person), and with pretty much saying "I want you to get of my face and that I completely gave up on you" with a seemingly half-hearted "I'm Sorry" and "Thank You". The run even lacks consistency because if we go back to earlier in the run its shown that MJ feels some level of guilt, but the idea was clearly scrapped by issue 19 with her anger at Peter, and gets worse by issue 25 and 26 because its shown that this version of MJ lacks any sort of empathy towards her supposed greatest love. Considering Marvel has always called them each other's greatest loves it feels quite out of both the brand and the character to have her kind of cheat and her dating another guy before actually ever breaking up with Peter(I would like to note that yes, it is acceptable to move on but waiting only a year despite knowing he's recovering from radiation poisoning, shoving him through an otherwise untested portal and that he would do anything to save her is vaguely sickening).

Also who the hell would pick to date someone complicit in planetary genocide who is the son of a villain who is attempting to be a god, over a person who is literally only ever trying to do the right thing. Frankly Peter's guilt or pain is not caused him committing by mass murder, its caused by his mistakes and his mistakes are extremely minor compared to the sheer scale of the death Paul has directly caused. Guilt or pain doesn't absolve him of his actions(assisting in genocide or even planetary genocide because of "trust" is beyond forgiveness); I specifically think its stupid compare someone who knowingly refuses to acknowledge his responsibility for killing a planet(in the 616 there is at least one organisation that would throw him prison for such actions).

Other than that does anyone have any clue what the hell happened to the wedding ring from ASM(2018) #29 or what Peter was going to say before she hung up on him in issue #1 of the current run.

I love how Nick Spencer got both Peter and MJ into such a good place and worked past MJ's worries about having both Peter and Spider-Man in her life (thereby voiding the previous reason for them being apart for the future) just for Zeb Wells to have to throw a curve ball in the form of an apocalyptic dimension and time dilation to keep them apart. Superb Writing on his part :/ . I still think given the way way MJ and Paul have been written that I expect the relationship isn't what it really seems. I think its more about MJ feeling a sense of responsibility towards her new family rather than romantic love born in that dimension. I guess if we find out for sure it will be much later in Zeb's run. I assume the wedding ring is just something that was dropped and won't be referenced again. The idea of Peter and MJ moving in together is the closest I think Marvel will ever go towards getting Peter and MJ in a pre-OMD status quo which is why it sucked so much for them to be broken up immediately in the new run as it felt like they were getting back to where fans wanted them to be, especially since it had been around a decade or so since they were together in the main 616 universe.

[Spider-Tiger]

I think too many people who clamor for married Spider-Man or Peter to settle down with a family don’t appreciate that those books may start off with interest but it tends to Peter out. Pun intended. Renew your vows is one, but Spider-Girl is probably my favorite example. On the old comic boards everyone and their mother would talk about how it’s so good, it’s finally got a adult Peter etc etc but the book sold so poorly it was cancelled several times before eventually being put to rest.

On the flipside, RYV lasted about as long as Untold Tales: a 616 spin-off involving a single teenage Spider-man when his 616 counterpart was married. (And this one is actually in-continuity unlike RYV.) And Spider-girl outlasted Untold Tales by a country mile.

People just arent as interested in spin-offs. That doesnt speak to how that concept would perform in the main book.