ASM #26 Preview

[themasething]

Wait till they' get to Felicia. You'll wish she was never is asm again. it will be glorious and an awful read

I'll stick with Felicia solo stories, or the team up with Mary Jane. I don't expect much, or anything good, out of ASM writers anymore.

Consider dropping it from your list for a while. I understand you probably have a pretty substantial collection at this point, and this is a hard thing to consider, but they're overprinting every issue due to variant spam. These issues WILL be cheaper in a year than they are today when the next guy comes in and pulls a Spencer to negate it all. Instead of buying it today for cover price, tell Marvel no, then once they do better you can pick it up as a back issue to keep your collection complete.

Yeah, that's going to be a no on that one. I'm OCD about my collection these days, and I dropped ASM once before and it cost me a fortune to get those issues later on to fill the gaps. Easier to just buy them and archive them. Considering I don't buy many books anymore via Marvel or DC, I've already made my statement. Going from spending $200+ a month on comics to less than $20 a month is my statement.

[exile001]

So, your statement is nothing, no matter how bad, will stop you giving Marvel money for Amazing Spider-Man (because back issues were still a sale to the comic shop, you just paid inflated prices)?

Like, I get having a hobby/habit and loving a character but if you'll pay for the book no matter what it just sends the message that they can put out anything, regardless of quality. And to be clear, I used to be right there with you until about 2007ish.

But then again, one person dropping the book isn't even a statistic for them so why bother if it'll still be their best selling book?

It's the catch 22 of being a fan.

There's no way to get, say, 20,000 people to not buy an issue in protest (and ASM #26 would have been the one to go for) to force marvel to a change, yet numbers keep slowly dwindling away over the decades and the hobby gets more and more niche while publishers just see it as a trend rather than a reflection of the poor job the big two in particular have been doing in keeping comics relevant.

I've said it before and I'll say it again, for over a decade Marvel Comics' brand was the biggest thing in cinemas and Marvel couldn't increase their core reader base by any substantial degree. If I were Disney I'd be furious at that failure but they apparently don't care, because it's just an IP farm, and keep trusting the same failing business models and management. It's baffling to me.

[Lee]

Yeah, that's going to be a no on that one. I'm OCD about my collection these days, and I dropped ASM once before and it cost me a fortune to get those issues later on to fill the gaps. Easier to just buy them and archive them. Considering I don't buy many books anymore via Marvel or DC, I've already made my statement. Going from spending $200+ a month on comics to less than $20 a month is my statement.

If Amazing Spider-Man is the only Marvel comic you're buying, then the message you're sending Marvel is that it's their best comic. All the other titles you were buying, their sales dropped by 1 when you stopped, but Amazing Spider-Man held strong.

You're free to buy whatever comic you want for whatever reason you want. But dropping X-Men isn't a vote against Amazing Spider-Man. And buying Amazing Spider-Man is a vote for Amazing Spider-Man.

[Morgoth]

I've said it before and I'll say it again, for over a decade Marvel Comics' brand was the biggest thing in cinemas and Marvel couldn't increase their core reader base by any substantial degree.

Because Big Two comics are very hard to get into, at least without a bunch of guides. That's where manga wins - if someone wants to read Attack on Titan, Ghost in Shell, Bakuman, Berserk or Chainsaw Man, they can just start with the first chapter and that's it, they can follow the story. With Big Two there are tons of series, issues, events, retcons, continuity mess, etc. And it's even worse with DC. That's why they couldn't increase their readership.

[Xenon]

Because Big Two comics are very hard to get into, at least without a bunch of guides. That's where manga wins - if someone wants to read Attack on Titan, Ghost in Shell, Bakuman, Berserk or Chainsaw Man, they can just start with the first chapter and that's it, they can follow the story. With Big Two there are tons of series, issues, events, retcons, continuity mess, etc. And it's even worse with DC. That's why they couldn't increase their readership.

This is true but it's unnncessarily true. I got into comics in 2010 thanks to a free trial of Marvel Unlimited that was included with Marvel vs. Captcom 3. It had the first 100 issue sof Amazing, and the thing that had stopped me from getting into comcis was I wanted to start at the beginning. So I did, and I loved it, and so I wanted more. And for a while I tried to stay legitimate and stupid. I bought a backissue that was slabbed accidentally. I bought Marvel Masterworks to get me through 122 because I knew what was coming. I bought Marvel Essentials and did what I could. But Ultimately there just was no way to get a TON of those older comics. Like even ASM had this huge gap between the 70s and 00s where what was available was random and scattershot, to say nothing of Spectacular, Marvel Team-Up, Web, Freidnly Neighborhood....the whole thing was a nightmare. And...I just dont' understand why. Now perhaps in the ensuing ten years they've gotten better with Unlimited (god I hope so), but the fact that they don't have those comics available in an easy to get format is somewhat baffling to me. Yeah, I get that they can't really compete with the tankoban format due to lower circulation and higher costs (Color!), but the idea should have been copies years ago. Just easy, numbered, $20 books from teh start of the run onwards. They already basically do this for all their modern comics (Quesada's positive contribution to the company). They just need to reach into the archives and start putting these out in accessible formats.

[exile001]

Because Big Two comics are very hard to get into, at least without a bunch of guides. That's where manga wins - if someone wants to read Attack on Titan, Ghost in Shell, Bakuman, Berserk or Chainsaw Man, they can just start with the first chapter and that's it, they can follow the story. With Big Two there are tons of series, issues, events, retcons, continuity mess, etc. And it's even worse with DC. That's why they couldn't increase their readership.

Sure, but that's what I'm saying. Marvel and DC have literally made this problem for themselves.

There's absolutely no reason they couldn't have changed their models over the last few decades. They could do it tomorrow. But they won't. They'll continue to publish in the same way to ever shrinking numbers until it is unviable to publish comics, at which point they'll all go digital and/or another change is forced.

The problem is that fewer and fewer people are interested in buying Marvel and DC in the way that they're being presented, and it was trending this way long before Manga exploded in popularity.

Part of the problem is that the existing readers don't like change, and Marvel/DC are terrified of losing the readers they have, but that's a whole other problem.

This is true but it's unnncessarily true. I got into comics in 2010 thanks to a free trial of Marvel Unlimited that was included with Marvel vs. Captcom 3. It had the first 100 issue sof Amazing, and the thing that had stopped me from getting into comcis was I wanted to start at the beginning. So I did, and I loved it, and so I wanted more. And for a while I tried to stay legitimate and stupid. I bought a backissue that was slabbed accidentally. I bought Marvel Masterworks to get me through 122 because I knew what was coming. I bought Marvel Essentials and did what I could. But Ultimately there just was no way to get a TON of those older comics. Like even ASM had this huge gap between the 70s and 00s where what was available was random and scattershot, to say nothing of Spectacular, Marvel Team-Up, Web, Freidnly Neighborhood....the whole thing was a nightmare. And...I just dont' understand why. Now perhaps in the ensuing ten years they've gotten better with Unlimited (god I hope so), but the fact that they don't have those comics available in an easy to get format is somewhat baffling to me. Yeah, I get that they can't really compete with the tankoban format due to lower circulation and higher costs (Color!), but the idea should have been copies years ago. Just easy, numbered, $20 books from teh start of the run onwards. They already basically do this for all their modern comics (Quesada's positive contribution to the company). They just need to reach into the archives and start putting these out in accessible formats.

100% this.

[Xenon]

If Amazing Spider-Man is the only Marvel comic you're buying, then the message you're sending Marvel is that it's their best comic. All the other titles you were buying, their sales dropped by 1 when you stopped, but Amazing Spider-Man held strong.

You're free to buy whatever comic you want for whatever reason you want. But dropping X-Men isn't a vote against Amazing Spider-Man. And buying Amazing Spider-Man is a vote for Amazing Spider-Man.

I am endorsing this post.

I never want to harass people for their own decisions and the pursuit of their own happiness and I completely understand his fears, even if I dont' think they're going to be much of an issue ultimately, so I will go no further, but Lee is correct here.

[Spidey_Legend]

I somehow wish internet existed when MJ became more popular than Gwen Stacy and Marvel tried and changed Gwen so she looked more like MJ.
Meltdown from fans would have been nuclear. ^^

As I said earlier we are passionnante about MJ because she always was a compelling character with or without Peter. People wouldn't react so badly if the managed to create another love interest which worked organically.

Gerry Conway receive letters with death threats for killing Gwen.Althought Mary Jane become the most popular character I think that became much later. Neither both Gwen or Mary Jane were too much developed under Stan Lee. He was not exactly a paragon of female character being utterly developed.

[Venomsaurus]

This is the most depressing arc in all of Spider-man. It hurts worse than Sins Past, OMD, OMIT, Superior, all of it. It just really hurts to be a Spidey fan right now.

[Xenon]

This is the most depressing arc in all of Spider-man. It hurts worse than Sins Past, OMD, OMIT, Superior, all of it. It just really hurts to be a Spidey fan right now.

I was going to call this recency bias but having Spider-Man's wife choose another man is...pretty low. I can actually see how you would feel this way.

Just gotta hope a future issue recontextualizes it.

[Garlador]

I was going to call this recency bias but having Spider-Man's wife choose another man is...pretty low. I can actually see how you would feel this way.

Just gotta hope a future issue recontextualizes it.

See, it would still suck but be maybe understandable post-OMD if she met some nice guy at the coffee shop or sometime.

But the guy she picked over Peter? He’s a dude who was complicit in GENOCIDE, committed patricide, was partially responsible for blowing up a city AND trapping her in a hellscape for 4 years of her life, lying to her and keeping things from her most of the time until he finally spilled the beans months later, and telling her Peter wouldn’t come and get her, and who punched her ex for rightly calling him out. And then she defends him fully and compares his crimes to Peter’s guilt, as if billions dead are equal to Uncle Ben.

It’s INSANE.

[clonegeek]

See, it would still suck but be maybe understandable post-OMD if she met some nice guy at the coffee shop or sometime.

But the guy she picked over Peter? He’s a dude who was complicit in GENOCIDE, committed patricide, was partially responsible for blowing up a city AND trapping her in a hellscape for 4 years of her life, lying to her and keeping things from her most of they time and telling her Peter would come and get her, and who punched her ex for rightly calling him out. And then she defends him fully and compares his crimes to Peter’s guilt, as if billions dead are equal to Uncle Ben.

It’s INSANE.

And this all gets retconed away as a bad dream or something

[Venomsaurus]

I was going to call this recency bias but having Spider-Man's wife choose another man is...pretty low. I can actually see how you would feel this way.

Just gotta hope a future issue recontextualizes it.

I want to hope, but I just don't think that moment is coming. Unless it gets retconned, which even that isn't a guarantee it would be anytime soon, I feel like this is the status quo going forward. We're just supposed to accept that she chose another man, one she'd known not even a third as long as Peter, and that's that.

[Xenon]

See, it would still suck but be maybe understandable post-OMD if she met some nice guy at the coffee shop or sometime.

But the guy she picked over Peter? He’s a dude who was complicit in GENOCIDE, committed patricide, was partially responsible for blowing up a city AND trapping her in a hellscape for 4 years of her life, lying to her and keeping things from her most of the time until he finally spilled the months later, and telling her Peter wouldn’t come and get her, and who punched her ex for rightly calling him out. And then she defends him fully and compares his crimes to Peter’s guilt, as if billions dead are equal to Uncle Ben.

It’s INSANE.

This is one of those hard things, because there's this impulse to feel reasonable and give concessions but this situation isn't really one where concessions are deserved.

You're right that, if they had wanted to, when they brought back MJ post OMD, they could have had her in some relationship with a random dude. If this whole Paul situation came up thirteen years ago when she came back, no one would complain that MJ dating other guys after breaking up with Peter was out of character. It's not. But you need that break up. Without it it's unteneble. And there in lies the rub. MJ...just wouldn't actualy leave Peter at this point in their lives. That was the whole trouble they had that led to OMD being so terrible. After everything they had put the coupel through in the 90s and after JMS's reconciliation issues, there just wasn't something they could do believably. Someone mocked this idea earlier, but MJ was very much decided on Peter Parker and very much ride or die for him. That's why the guy doens't matter to me. It's not about what guy I think would be best for Mary Jane, anymore than it's what i think would be best for Peter. Like this is a concept I got comfortable with regarding Spider-Man as a kid. I was a Felicia guy when I watched the 90s show. Despite her standoffishness she was deep down a very caring girl, serious and sweet, she just had her guard up. When he married Mary Jane I was disappointed, her style was not my type. But I didn't think it was a mistake in the show, it was the choice that Peter Parker made. It was what the character wanted. And so, like, Paul's characteristics dont' really matter. It's not about whether or not she could love Paul, it never has been. It's always been about whethre or not she loved Peter and the fact that Peter was who she basically always wanted. But we fail to take her preferences into account, and so the writers make her do stupid things that we know aren't true to her character. they did it in Annual 2001, they did it in OMIT. Slott did it after Superior. That's why all the breakups suck. Because it's always them making Mary Jane want something she never wanted before.

And actually, speaking of Slott, I'll give him kudos, even in the contrived scene where he makes up an excuse for why MJ won't come back to Peter, the excuse is about Peter and his life, it has nothing to do with Pedro, really. Like the way that speech is given she isn't choosing Pedro over Peter, she's rejecting Peter because there's an aspect of his life she can't tolerate. Considering that Ock as Peter dumped her, she'd be totaly justified in stating that she's seeing someone else. But even Slott knows that won't fly. Even he knew he had to make something wrong with Peter to make it work, even if, ultimately, he failed at that goal.

[Xenon]

I want to hope, but I just don't think that moment is coming. Unless it gets retconned, which even that isn't a guarantee it would be anytime soon, I feel like this is the status quo going forward. We're just supposed to accept that she chose another man, one she'd known not even a third as long as Peter, and that's that.

Hey I feel ya, that fear is why I won't be reading for the time being. Saps any enjoyment I could get out of the book. That said, good wins because Good is usually better. And people want things to be better. So I always have some hope.