Son Goku vs Wonder Woman

[Jcogginsa]

Son Goku, the Saiyan from Earth, takes on Diana Prince, the Princess of the Amazons

This bout will be run in two ways.

1. Original Manga Goku vs Post-Crisis Wonder Woman

2. In the vein of my Purely Human threads, both fighters will do battle with no access to any superhuman abilities. They will only be able to do things that real life humans can do. . It will also be a purely hand to hand fight.

The first battle will be a standard bloodlusted arena match. The Second battle will be non-bloodlusted and be fought under UFC regulations (Except for any rules which would bar intergender matches.)

For the second match, here are the heights and weights given by the respective wikis

Son Goku: 5’9”/137 pounds
Wonder Woman: 6’0”/165 pounds

[The Arbiter]

No way Goku was only 137lbs. Is he!?

[Jcogginsa]

No way Goku was only 137lbs. Is he!?

Per a guide book Goku is 62 kilograms, which the Wiki converts to 137 pounds.

[Postmania]

Japanese measurements can be suspect at times like how sagat at one point was listed as like 200 lbs or something

[Rightoya]

What do you expect Goku to do? Even if we ignore his comically low weight, Post-Crisis Wonder Woman becomes a straight up Street level hero right at home in Gotham if depowered:




Goku on the other hand has never truly learned how to fight without superhuman abilities.

No way Goku was only 137lbs. Is he!?

https://www.esportstales.com/dragon-...ts-and-weights

But even Wonder Woman's stats look off to very off depending on the artist.

[Sharpandpointies]

Honestly, I don't know enough about 'Original Manga Goku', or at what point in his career we're discussing. Can't speak to the first fight.

#2 fight. Okay, so the 'official' weight for Goku is considerably less than what I found on my own search. And rather ridiculous, given Goku's build.

I mean, the guy is edit: officially the same height as me? and 20 lbs lighter. Edit: Wth? I'm not exactly a big guy, in terms of build - I'm not 'unathletic', and have very low body fat, but I'm not all muscular like him. And the 'ideal' weight (take with grain of salt) for a 5'9" man...Goku is BELOW that supposedly ideal weight, and he's built like a truck.

Him being 137 lbs is ludicrous. There is no way he is not at the least heavier than me, a LOT heavier.

But if that's the mass we're using here, cool. Scrawny Goku it is.

I feel Goku loses. We've pinned the characters down to nothing more than real-world human capability, so....

1. Skill: I feel this is pretty close - too close to call. Both of them are supposedly really good fighters, both of them have a lot of physical fighting. Sure, there's an argument that each of them leans heavily on their powers, but I feel (based on what I've seen) that both use actual skill for 'hitting people' enough. They also each have a ton of experience in fights. I don't feel that Goku has an advantage, though, and that's what he needs to cover his shortfalls (haha).
2. Size: For the purpose of this thread, Diana is taller, has more reach and more mass. We can argue 'man versus woman re: muscle power pound for pound', but she has ~30 lbs on him, so I don't think anyone can realistically argue that she isn't stronger than Goku.
3. Speed: Both characters are limited to real-world human, speed isn't an issue.
4. Soak/Durability: Real world human, this pretty much goes to the bigger fighter when both are experienced fighters.

So I feel that Diana - for this thread - has the advantage in reach, strength, overall capacity to eat damage, and doesn't really give up anything in skill.

Given the above, and barring people coming in with some stellar arguments otherwise, Diana takes a big majority if not a sweep.

Mileage may vary.

[Sharpandpointies]

I'm still boggling at Goku being 5'9" and 137 lbs, officially. Maybe the gravity on his world is actually less than ours?

[Nik Hasta]

No earthly way that I am a full 60lbs heavier than Goku. That's absolutely insane.

I'm only like... ~3 inches taller than him and much less built.

[Sharpandpointies]

No earthly way that I am a full 60lbs heavier than Goku. That's absolutely insane.

I'm only like... ~3 inches taller than him and much less built.

I'm using the word 'scrawny' because he's my height and my own body has been described as 'wiry'. I outweigh the dude by 15+ lbs.

[StupidMoniker]

I'm using the word 'scrawny' because he's my height and my own body has been described as 'wiry'. I outweigh the dude by 15+ lbs.

https://youtu.be/sN7r7nk0-zc

[Postmania]

137 is ludicrous. He's barely 10 pounds heavier than I was in high school days when I was unable to gain any weight no matter what I ate and was skin and bones lol

[Sharpandpointies]

https://youtu.be/sN7r7nk0-zc

^_^

That guy weighs more than me. Granted, in part because he's taller, but still.

[The Arbiter]

My personal opinion on DB martial arts is that they are actually fairly basic. The most brilliant examples of skill we see in the show are usually applications of qi (chi?). That's where the creative fighting genius is most prominently shown.

The mines Goku planted in the TOP or the crafty use of destructo discs and so forth. The evil containment wave. Etc.

Punching and kicking? They are clearly VERY good at these things but the formal training we observe in the series is almost entirely based on free style sparring, physical strength/speed and endurance training or the expanding of energy techniques. I cannot recall a single instance of formal striking or grappling training from a teacher to Goku.

Roshi made them deliver milk, push boulders and carry weights. Kami and Popo did aggressive free sparring and sensory training. King Kai again focused on strength training and chi techniques. Whis did the same.

No good examples of say, pressure points or grappling techniques or any other traditional "styles" as we know them come to mind.

[Sharpandpointies]

My personal opinion on DB martial arts is that they are actually fairly basic. The most brilliant examples of skill we see in the show are usually applications of qi (chi?). That's where the creative fighting genius is most prominently shown.

The mines Goku planted in the TOP or the crafty use of destructo discs and so forth. The evil containment wave. Etc.

Punching and kicking? They are clearly VERY good at these things but the formal training we observe in the series is almost entirely based on free style sparring, physical strength/speed and endurance training or the expanding of energy techniques. I cannot recall a single instance of formal striking or grappling training from a teacher to Goku.

Roshi made them deliver milk, push boulders and carry weights. Kami and Popo did aggressive free sparring and sensory training. King Kai again focused on strength training and chi techniques. Whis did the same.

No good examples of say, pressure points or grappling techniques or any other traditional "styles" as we know them come to mind.

I totally get that. ^_^ And they are fairly basic, which makes a certain amount of sense when it comes to 'we can also learn to blow **** up'. THAT'S the advanced training.

Now, I'm a big fan of 'can deliver blows and protect from same' being a good qualifier of skill, and the DB people have that in spades. And they've had training. Even free-sparring - when done as training - is solid, real practice in practical stuff, more important than a whole lot of theoretical stuff. Especially when done in an environment where it's practice, not 'fight for your life'.

A couple of things worth discussing:

1. I do recall Goku pulling off shoulder throws and such once in a while, so there's something more there than just 'hitting stuff';
2. We could honestly say the same thing about Wonder Woman's skill. She mostly operates on 'hitting stuff' without pressure pointing or anything the same as that. Granted, she does have a brief period a looooong way ago where she was pulling off 'fighting blind' because Medusa blinded her. But. How often does she pull off some great techniques, not stuff like occasionally getting Powergirl in a full-nelson (not...exactly a solid grappling thing in MMA)?
3. We're reduced down to 'real world stuff' in this fight anyway, so barring Diana having showings for ridiculously good grappling or the like and Goku having none of that, we're back to 'can they hit and protect themselves' which they both can do. In the real world, actual fight experience and fight training in the basics tends to trump advanced martial art techniques, unless someone has training the other person doesn't (ie grappling).

[Jackalope89]

Another thing for Goku (I knew his height, but the guy should be pushing 200lbs with his muscles, realistically) is that he is an expert at learning on the fly. Midfight, he learns patterns and openings and figures out ways to exploit those. Only when he is badly outmatched, do these not work.