Hickman interview on the Cerebro pod

[Alex_Of_X]

Okay guys, a big one just dropped.

Hickman was a guest on the (excellent) Cerebro podcast, and dropped knowledge for over 3.5 hours on everything X and beyond. I much recommend you listen yourself, but I'm also happy to drop some snippets I'd written down. Here goes:
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Hickman first pitched Powers idea during his Ultimates

Gillen was approached for the initial team

Soft sales of HoX affected the Dawn of X structure: would've been staggered, soft-piloted thru X-Men

Covid expanded X of swords

~Covid time around when Hickman considered his exit. Asked to stay, loved everyone in the room. Understood the sales benchmarks that editorial set before him, and the wokload required, decided against it.

Life-long fan, started with 1980s Dark Phoenix Saga

First horsemen of Apoc were inspired by the opening scene of the X-Men movie from 2016 movie

Apoc as emissary of Lawful Evil contrasts Xavier and Eric

Helped writers brainstorm stories before his exit

No acrimony with where the story’s gone since then

The crucible is the temptation of Christ moment. Personally considers it abhorrent, but knows it’s a compelling story to tell, an in character for Apoc.

Arakko is a Darwinist hell for mutants, a place too Darwinist for Apoc to fit in

12 issue Imperial Guard was about the phalanx, but it fell thru cause of Hickman leaving

Another book fell through: a Marvel universe book. 50\50% split between X-stuff and avengers stuff. Example given was Sam+Berto in Space

Was gonna do new gods at DC, came back to Marvel instead. Thinks the big two can't crack how to do "Grand Jack Kirby stuff." Thinks its because it needs a singular vision, and not a separate artist\writer combo. Also, due to this Hickman mostly divorced Apoc from the Celestial stuff. Liked what Remender did with Apoc, still.

The Moira/destiny scene changing between HoX and Inferno is a play on Rashomon. As much by design, as caused by the rigors of accelerated comics shipping. The Inferno scene is how it actually transpired

Hates the “give the audience what the want” mode that writer fall into. Never works. You can never please everyone. Two bad examples is a sudden power ups to a character, and shipping characters. The omega list was a way to tackle this. The polyamory thing was another. Goal was to get rid of “book X is bad, because character A and character B are together”

Another thing that didn’t stick is clothes changing issue to issue

“Relationships not in wartime” were a priority

On IP Stuff/Contract/Movie rights front, things have changed monumentally in the last ~15 years, for the better

Bendis’s run was constrained on X-men because the company decided the books weren’t a priority

G.O.D.S. Is an acronym. It's more Saga than Sandman, per Breevort

Thinks there’s still meat on the bone of the Marvel comics Universe

Arakko mutants developed different mutations because of different conditions

On Penance/Monet, he tried to rehab her and clear away convoluted history

Loves Gen x

Loves Hordeculture, based them on her Grandmothers and her wives’s grandmothers. The pun in the name is absolutely on purpose

Canon is not what’s on page, it’s what sticks in memory

Regrets that the x-office lost Bryan Edward Hill after Fallen Angels flopped. Marvel failed to onboard him as they have Duggar, Howard and Percy, and so he went to DC

More stuff from him coming. He's been hard at work since Inferno

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That's all I got in my noggin, folks. Excited to talk thru it w y'all!

[JB]

Woohoo I'm going to be listening to this very soon as I make my way to the comic shop. I'm excited!

[yellow cyclone]

12 issue Imperial Guard was about the phalanx, but it fell thru cause of Hickman leaving

this one hurts the most

[CGAR]

The fact that he wanted to write otherwold stuff but was too busy bummed me out so much. He didnt want to tell other writers what to write or do because he wouldnt want that done to him.

But Marvel did kind of hire him to do that he just didnt like that approach so he didnt. I think he should have to some of the writers.

But Hickman Otherworld stuff?!?!?

I mean come on.

And he said he loved Jerome Opena work.

Imagine Hickman/Opena Otherworld book.

[Mungho]

Canon is not what’s on page, it’s what sticks in memory

Huh? What does this mean? You're obviously going to remember horrible stories you'd rather forget because they stick in your mind.

Loves Hordeculture, based them on her Grandmothers and her wives’s grandmothers. The pun in the name is absolutely on purpose.

Maybe I'm slow, but what is the pun?

[Kingdom X]

Understood the sales benchmarks that editorial set before him, and the wokload required, decided against it.

The workload seems like a huge one. Most "flagship writers" just have to worry about the story they're telling and everyone else bends to fit that, but Hickman was advising the entire writer's room and office to the point that they're STILL using some of his plans and ideas.

12 issue Imperial Guard was about the phalanx, but it fell thru cause of Hickman leaving

Even if this book doesn't happen I desperately need them to actually explore the Phalanx. That throw away stuff Spurrier did isn't gonna cut it, so once again I look to Ewing.

Bendis’s run was constrained on X-men because the company decided the books weren’t a priority

This is very interesting because on the Battle of the Atom podcast a couple weeks ago, Bendis seemed to indicate that he wasn't rushed and that he "felt it was time" to leave, even though there was clearly something wonky going on with the end of his X-Men run and the forced transition to the Terrigen Cloud era.

On Penance/Monet, he tried to rehab her and clear away convoluted history
Loves Gen x

I'm giving him a bit of an eye roll because why did he only give her roles were she gave a fun one-longer, punched something, and then dipped? Out of his top 5 mutants she was the only one he didn't give a prominent or consistent role to. He could have had her he be a more consistent player in X-Men, feature in his NM, or shoot put her on the Council. She easily could have taken a Hellfire spot.

Regrets that the x-office lost Bryan Edward Hill after Fallen Angels flopped. Marvel failed to onboard him as they have Duggar, Howard and Percy, and so he went to DC

Not surprising. I'm not gonna pretend like Fallen Angels was a secret gem, but out of the Dawn of X books Fallen Angels got the WORST art by far which put it at a huge disadvantage. Again, it's become clear who gets unlimited chances in this office and who doesn't, and I'm giving a massive side-eye to how this office treats it's writers of color.

[Nicoclaws]

Thank you so much for the notes, as I cannot listen to a full podcast XD

"On Penance/Monet, he tried to rehab her and clear away convoluted history"

Welp, it did NOT help, Jonathan !

[Nicoclaws]

This is very interesting because on the Battle of the Atom podcast a couple weeks ago, Bendis seemed to indicate that he wasn't rushed and that he "felt it was time" to leave, even though there was clearly something wonky going on with the end of his X-Men run and the forced transition to the Terrigen Cloud era.

I think (but I didn't listen to the podcast) that it means that Bendis's run was limited in scale. I felt it too, notably with the "Summers revolution" that Gillen set up, Bendis was probably told to tone it down.

[Omega Alpha]

One thing to keep in mind is that Hox sold less than expected at the time,.even though reception was overwhelmingly positive, because Marvel wasted more than 6 months promoting the Age of X-Man, Extermination, Rosenberg's Uncanny, etc ,as the next big era When it became clear it wasn't, many retailers and readers simply didn't bother with HoX thinking it was another scam. Plus, the poor quality of most of these books didn't help.

[DarkMagnus]

I want to know his original Inferno Pitch

Where mah Darling Rogue brings back his mom. and Why Marvel cut that storyline. who could connect Emma to Rogue to Raven and Irene and etc.

[RAWRlrus]

Haven't had time to listen, and probably won't with it being so long, but I gotta say I'm kinda disagree with the some of the ideas here. The crucible was stupid and made worse because (IIRC) everyone sort of went a long with it. It was a secret Apocalypse was doing and makes no sense that so many of the other mutants were fine with it. The Omega level ranking I liked (unless I misunderstood it) because it felt like less to do with actual power levels and more with potential power levels, but I think people have been using Omega level as current power level for so long that it didn't necessarily work. The poly/open relationship stuff I think also falls flat because people are gonna ship regardless. Only way I see this idea working is to be more explicit with open relationships/polyamory rather than a few teases and only a few writers dealing with it.

Maybe I'm slow, but what is the pun?

The pun I believe is on horticulture, which is gardening basically.

This is very interesting because on the Battle of the Atom podcast a couple weeks ago, Bendis seemed to indicate that he wasn't rushed and that he "felt it was time" to leave, even though there was clearly something wonky going on with the end of his X-Men run and the forced transition to the Terrigen Cloud era.

I wonder if this is less of a time constraint and more of a creative constraint. Full consipracy here, but AvX coincided with the the Avengers movie (give the current kings of the tv/movie Marvel Universe a boost while making the former dominant ones the villains). Bendis' run is during the second phase, but it might have to do more with keeping some of the bigger names in the former era for the X-men down/the bad guys to set up DoX/IvX and tv/movie Inhumans.

[Master of Sound]

12 issue Imperial Guard was about the phalanx, but it fell thru cause of Hickman leaving

Another book fell through: a Marvel universe book. 50\50% split between X-stuff and avengers stuff. Example given was Sam+Berto in Space

I would have LOVED both series to have happened.

[DarkMagnus]

I would have LOVED both series to have happened.

Me Too.

A Earlier Uncanny Vengers would be a success.

[Bruce Wayne]

Bendis’s run was constrained on X-men because the company decided the books weren’t a priority

Just further confirmation. We have known that Mike Marts left the X-Office and felt frustrated after being constrained after coming back to the X-office from a successful showing on the Batbooks and (bringing Katie Kubert with him and both of them left) and b) Mark Paniccia got the X-office job and from all accounts he gets the editorial ssignments that are low priority at Marvel.

Bendis' run is during the second phase, but it might have to do more with keeping some of the bigger names in the former era for the X-men down/the bad guys to set up DoX/IvX and tv/movie Inhumans.

The scuttlebutt has always been that it was more due to the movie rights issues with Fox. Ditto for axing Fantastic Four (after concluding the book with Paniccia as editor iirc). Similarly for promoting the Inhumans (since that apparently that was to a) replace X-Men and b) it was a personal project of the head of Marvel Corporate)).

[Celestialbodies]

I need answers on why X of Swords was so tonally disjointed, it felt like a series of inconsistent ideas thrown together. For what should have been imo a "summer blockbuster" event, something designed to show off the strength of Krakoa! What we got stunted some of the momentum coming off POX/HOX, and I don't think it has been regained!