The Ultimate Comics Line returns!

[Bruce Wayne]

So WW2 and everything presumably still happened it’s just that maker has been altering events in modern history that slowly led to him consolidating countries?

The one thing that is really realistic is that even in our world conflicts are largely performative and we have went from Cold War with Russia to “War on terror” to China while the rich and powerful slowly consolidated power over the years. I do find that aspect interesting and really contemporary.

I think your vulgar derivation of Marxism ('no war but class war') has done a pretty poor job in understanding that these irl conflicts and wars are very real to the participants and not just performance theatre as you like to believe. For that matter, class identity is not the be-all and end-all, Marxist thought has done a pretty poor job in understanding that these so call "fake identities/false consciousness" such as nationalism are very real and not just something created by elites to divide the working folk and that misintepretation had real life costs in that nationalism ultimately contributed to the breakup of Yugoslavia and the Soviet Union (which lead to the end of the Cold War, but also to the current war in Ukrane).

[Refrax5]

I am pretty frustrated by the whole thing and my enthusiasm for Hickman has been waning for the past few years, but I will say that I liked Howard Stark as Iron Man. He was the only character in the story that I felt any affection for. Of course he seems to be out of the picture now, but I did find him to be pretty likable.

[Username taken]

I know Hickman has great love for the Ultimate universe but this reboot should have probably been called something else.

This isn't really the 1610 universe that Miles Morales and The Maker came from.

But I am curious to see where this universe goes next.

[Username taken]

Because it is not the Ultimate Universe. It is an alternate universe created by Hickman and called Ultimate Universe. You could perfectly call it Hickmanverse and it would be the same. Basically Marvel here is recycling the brand to sell something different. Same as what has been done before with 2099, when they have created different 2099 versions as if were the same.

Exactly this.

It's not really the Ultimate Universe , it's something else that's being called the Ultimate Universe.

[Username taken]

I think there's layers to that, right?

The original Ultimate U in 2000 was, in its eyes, "a good place." Capitalism had won, history was over, democracy was rising up across the world with the US as watchdog/vanguard. Then 9/11 happened, and suddenly the good place was under attack and we had to protect it against "threats." Ultimates working for the US government was seen as a good thing: the all-american monsters to fight the coming threat. So it was the world circa 2000 but with new twists on familiar Capes

The new ultimate U....is a "bad place". It's a madman's project guided by a secret unelected cabal. The job isn't protecting it; it's fixing it so there are checks on power. And the familiar capes? They're guerilla fighters, criminals trying to topple the wretched status quo. They are guests from a better world who can save this one.

Take it from Howard's journal: "I am so tired of this world...I now know that it is a false, fallen world that we paint as 'good enough,' but under its skin, we all know it's rotten to the core...all the things i have made are tainted with a patina of evil...but only innocent eyes can see it for what it could be...it's never too late to change the world around you...you just have to fight...and you have to win."

Yeah, the original Ultimate Universe had a very "militaristic" tone. Even Ultimate FF and Ultimate X-men had some elements of that.

The fear, paranoia, and anger was tangible in all the titles (with the exception of Ultimate Spider-man) that was prevalent in society after 9/11. That approach has really dated a lot of the Ultimate stuff because too much of it was specific to that time period. There was also a little bit of snarky edgelord stuff from guys like Mark Millar that just doesn't work anymore today.

Interestingly, the MCU Avengers had a bit of that (not surprising since the early MCU was heavily reliant on the Ultimates and even the Avengers theme sounds like a military theme) before the universe moved into the "outer space" theme.

[Digifiend]

That preview looks good. Looks like, despite being younger and going by Iron Lad, Tony is still Tony… and Steve Rogers is Captain America, and Thor Odinson is Thor. So I’m encouraged that this may end up being more of an updated version of the Ultimate U after all. Now I just need to see the X-men…

… which, of course, I’m wondering a lot about. Assuming they get pulled together and formed in the present day now too, like these Ultimates, how will it happen? Who will be the initial team? Will it follow a similar lineup of the original Ultimate X-men comic with the “core four” of Cyclops, Storm, Jean and Logan plus a few others? Is there a Weapon X in this universe? Is that where Wolverine has been all this time? Are mutants a naturally occurring phenomenon in this world (like in the 616) or are they a product of mankind’s experiments (like in the 1610)? Inquiring minds want to know.

Unfortunately I don’t even think we’ll hear anything about the UXM book at NYCC in a couple of weeks, as nothing has been teased. At least not yet.

We'll probably only learn the creative team - similar to the Ultimate Spider-Man teaser we've already had.

As for the X-Men roster... Xavier, Cyclops, Wolverine, Marvel Girl, Iceman, Shadowkat, Nightcrawler, Storm, and Ms. Marvel? I think we can safely rule out Magik and Colossus because of how they've already appeared. Most of the team I've listed is the big names. And it's an opportunity to have a fully movie synergised Kamala, without her Inhuman history.

[Frontier]

I know Hickman has great love for the Ultimate universe but this reboot should have probably been called something else.

This isn't really the 1610 universe that Miles Morales and The Maker came from.

But I am curious to see where this universe goes next.

They just needed it for branding because the likelihood people would have checked it out otherwise even with Hickman's name wouldn't be that high.

[D.Z]

Anyway shitposting aside, there should be a new thread made for Ultimate Universe no 1. This one is too long and old.

[Wally West]

Anyway shitposting aside, there should be a new thread made for Ultimate Universe no 1. This one is too long and old.

They should just bring back the Ultimate Marvel forum section!

[Username taken]

They just needed it for branding because the likelihood people would have checked it out otherwise even with Hickman's name wouldn't be that high.

Exactly.

The last time Hickman tried relaunching the Ultimate Universe, he said it was "swallowed alive by the nu52" (his exact words).

[D.Z]

They should just bring back the Ultimate Marvel forum section!

I agree. The admins may not however.

[Spider-Ham]

They should just bring back the Ultimate Marvel forum section!

Good times. I also remember when we launched a brand new forum, just to talk about Ultimate Spider-Man #200.

[lefthanded]

I don't think people should get too hung up on the fact that this isn't a continuation of the OG Ultimate universe.

Did Marvel's team overstate the connection? Yes.

But otherwise, it adheres to the spirit of the Ultimate line - characters that are recognizable but different from their 616 counterparts, that is free of the tangled continuity of the 616 universe.
Down to having Bryan Hitch penciling the miniseries, I felt like it captured the spirit.

Even Hickman's original Ultimates comic way back in the early 2010s, seemed largely unconcerned with continuing the Ultimate universe. It was a new story of the Maker's city of tomorrow, that an Avengers team has to counteract. Outside of the character designs and a few character beats, it could have been an entirely new universe for all intents and purposes.

My main criticism of this 2023 Ultimate relaunch is that, like others have said, it is retreading well covered ground (Hickman's own City of Tomorrow in the Ultimates a decade ago) with well explored characters (Reed, Tony). I get that the miniseries is setting everything up from the big picture, architecture point of view, and that would involve Illuminati type characters.

But hopefully with Hickman's Ultimate Spider-man, it will be something completely new since Peter Parker never got bit, and Miles Morales was not interested. A brand new character would be fantastic to explore in an Ultimate comic.

[Ultimate Captain America]

But otherwise, it adheres to the spirit of the Ultimate line - characters that are recognizable but different from their 616 counterparts, that is free of the tangled continuity of the 616 universe.

I wouldn't say so. All characters except the Maker are new, we have seen them for just 3 issues so far (the first one did not have them), and the continuity is already a convoluted mess.

[Thor-Ul]

I don't think people should get too hung up on the fact that this isn't a continuation of the OG Ultimate universe.

Then Marvel shouldn't hope to have the same results as the original Ultimate series had. Using Brian Hitch designs was also hoping to appeal to the readers of those comics in particular.

Did Marvel's team overstate the connection? Yes.

But otherwise, it adheres to the spirit of the Ultimate line - characters that are recognizable but different from their 616 counterparts, that is free of the tangled continuity of the 616 universe.
Down to having Bryan Hitch penciling the miniseries, I felt like it captured the spirit.

It could be the same from any other alternate universe variant: "characters that are recognizable but different from their 616 counterparts". Also, isn't like this Hickmanverse is free of mangled continuity. Tangled continuity is what it makes it exist.

Even Hickman's original Ultimates comic way back in the early 2010s, seemed largely unconcerned with continuing the Ultimate universe. It was a new story of the Maker's city of tomorrow, that an Avengers team has to counteract. Outside of the character designs and a few character beats, it could have been an entirely new universe for all intents and purposes.

And this only have the name to be called "Ultimate". Marvel also used the 2099 name to create at least other three alternate universes, but which one is always the one more referenced? The OG.

My main criticism of this 2023 Ultimate relaunch is that, like others have said, it is retreading well covered ground (Hickman's own City of Tomorrow in the Ultimates a decade ago) with well explored characters (Reed, Tony). I get that the miniseries is setting everything up from the big picture, architecture point of view, and that would involve Illuminati type characters.

Hickmanverse. That is the name should be used then.

But hopefully with Hickman's Ultimate Spider-man, it will be something completely new since Peter Parker never got bit, and Miles Morales was not interested. A brand new character would be fantastic to explore in an Ultimate comic.

And in two months will appear in Slott new Spider-Verse saga.