Why hasn’t DC’s attempt to incorporate Wildstorm characters worked?

[Factor]

There are many reasons. The three biggest ones for me are:
1) Many of the characters are derivative of famous DCU characters, so they end up feeling like third stringers when in-universe they used to be the top dogs.
2) Wildstorm took A LOT of risks and some stories had huge scopes that do not allow them to easily fit into the DCU. You’d have to change a lot about some characters and how they operate so they can have a niche in the DCU without stepping on the toes of the existing DC heroes.
3) They haven’t made a true effort at integrating WS history into the DCU. Superman & the Authority makes mention of the Authority’s original run as having take place in the DCU, but it feels very unrealistic. And now they are basically rebooting Wildcats. Things don’t fit together well because there was no real effort.

I think you either need to make the Wildstorm character AU refugees that are now stuck in the DCU if you want to keep their classic tales as they were or you just disregard the WS stories and reintroduce them properly to the DCU, making significant changes.

[Ascended]

I agree with what a lot of others are saying.

Most of WS' big names are just proxies of DC heroes. Hard for Mr. Majestic to find a viable spot in the DC lineup when Superman, Shazam, Diana, J'onn, etc., are already around. And one of the biggest elements of WS, the Daemonite and Kherb war and their centuries-long occupation of earth, doesn't really gel with DC's history either.

The morality of WS doesn't mesh. DC is a binary; heroes do good things, villains do bad things, and there isn't much in between. But WS dealt with people who worked in grays; hard to do something like Authority when the structure of the DCU doesn't have (much) room for such a thing. DC's made it work with the Squad and a few other characters, but they're typically fringe players in the wider narrative; global economics aren't going to be upended because of the Squad, but the Authority is another matter, y'know?

WS made its name, originally, by being cutting edge and telling stories other publishers were too restrained to. But that was thirty years ago and the industry has caught up. The thing that made WS stand out is now industry standard. Rooftop sex scenes, gay characters, excessive gore and violence....what was WS-specific shock value back then is normal today.

And there hasn't been a consistent push for WS, nor has there been a consistent continuity. Hard for WS to find a niche when DC gets bored with the effort after a few months, and the entire DCU keeps being changed, rebooted, or de-booted.

But I also gotta question the claim that other publishers were 'successfully' folded into DC. The only successful Fawcett character is Shazam, and Billy doesn't even have book most of the time. Ibis, Spy Smasher, Bulletman/girl, etc., none of them have flourished at DC. Charlton's library of characters have been slightly more successful, but none of them typically carry titles or have consistent roles with major teams either.

[HsssH]

Billy has went thru like 6 reboots at this point.

[Bruce Wayne]

Especially when you compare it to the Charlton Comics characters or the Fawcett Comics characters.

Why did DC do better with Fawcett/Charlton? Because post-Crisis DC could muster better talent back then to achieve those ends back in the day. For example the Denny O'Neil Question, Cary Bates/Weisman Captain Atom, Ordway Power of Shazam and Giffen/Dematteis Justice League for Blue Beetle. Not to mentio iconic groundbreaking stuff like Watchmen which were based on Charlton characters.

Post-New 52, DC simply didn't have that. You had guys from 90s Marvel like Mackie-Lobdell doing stuff who were already out of fashion in the 2000s. And frankly New 52 was creative chaos with a revolving door of writers for various reasons.

One could argue that post-Crisis DC had a better environment for writers/creators to integrate these characters into the DCU while New 52 simply didn't. The fact that New 52 went the way of the dodo after 5 years speaks to its "success".

[Odd Rödney]

Why did DC do better with Fawcett/Charlton? Because post-Crisis DC could muster better talent back then to achieve those ends back in the day. For example the Denny O'Neil Question, Cary Bates/Weisman Captain Atom, Ordway Power of Shazam and Giffen/Dematteis Justice League for Blue Beetle. Not to mentio iconic groundbreaking stuff like Watchmen which were based on Charlton characters.

Post-New 52, DC simply didn't have that. You had guys from 90s Marvel like Mackie-Lobdell doing stuff who were already out of fashion in the 2000s. And frankly New 52 was creative chaos with a revolving door of writers for various reasons.

One could argue that post-Crisis DC had a better environment for writers/creators to integrate these characters into the DCU while New 52 simply didn't. The fact that New 52 went the way of the dodo after 5 years speaks to its "success".

Yeah, I think this sums it all up well. A better time for integration due to better writers.

And New 52 was such a mess. Rebooting everything except Batman and Green Lantern and expecting it all to gel and make sense was never going to work. Madness.

I will never understand why DC does such clumsy reboots, as long as I live.

[HsssH]

Captain Atom is walking bomb and last big thing that Question did since O'Neil series ended is dying and getting replaced. I'm not sure that I'd call that a succesfull integration.

[Garlador]

I think, even now, if you asked if Wildstorm characters would work better at DC or under Image - knowing NOTHING else about them other than what kind of stories they wanted to tell - they'd still fit better at Image.

But I think it's been covered. They existed in an edge, gritty 90s world with loaded, dark history that doesn't mesh well with most of the DC universe. Like, WildCATs were the "X-Men" and "Justice League" for Image comics, but seen through a dark lens. Teammates that were killers, strippers, shady government agents... meshed with stories of sex and violence on a global/universal landscape. Gen13 was their "Teen Titans".

I actually still find "that" team fascinating, if a clear product of the 90s. I would love a MAX book about them, outside of "main" canon, that just returned to the kind of storytelling that made them popular in the first place.

[Forlorn]

I think another thing not mentioned yet is character fatigue, in the sense that DC is always adding new characters. While Wildstorm being integrated might not be “new”, DC already has a huge bench of underused characters and unless one keeps up with behind the scenes info, it’s hard to understand why these characters are getting pushed.

[The Cool Thatguy]

Because Mathew Rosenberg makes Chuck Austen look like Alan Moore.

[Bruce Wayne]

Can't argue with that.

[Timber Wolf-By-Night]

I'm probably going to regret asking, but who is Mathew Rosenberg?

[HsssH]

Current Wildcats writer.

[Uncanny X-Man]

I think it's all a matter of execution. Any concept and character could fit into the DCU with the right editor and creative team behind it.

With the latest attempt by Rosenberg being what it is, I don't expect any more pushes for a full-blown relaunch for the foreseeable future, although James Gunn's Authority movie definitely provides a compelling reason to try again at some stage. Plus there's always the odd Midnighter or Zealot popping up here and there.

[Heeroyuy_Batman]

I think it's all a matter of execution. Any concept and character could fit into the DCU with the right editor and creative team behind it.

I agree wholeheartedly with you. I will also say that sometimes it's animated shows that figure out how to make characters fit. For example, Static Shock was merged into the DCAU in its Second Season and then there's the excellent use of Icon, Rocket, and Static in Young Justice. I think it may be an animated show that gets the formula right for how to get the other Wildstorm characters who haven't been integrated into the DCU or those who haven't worked so far to integrate well.

[The Cool Thatguy]

Personally, I just have to wonder where the editors are.

Rosenberg is throwing Wildstorm characters against the wall and not even attempting to see what sticks.

We had Backlash cameo, just to get waved off.

And when he's not doing that, Rosenberg is just treating Grifter as the main character, a poor man's Archer.

I don't know why anyone would expect this to work, honestly