OUTSIDERS by Collin Kelly & Jackson Lanzing in November

[Frontier]

To be honest Lucius hasn't felt the same to me since the Jace Batman book. Really broke my respect for him.

[Bat-Meal]

To be honest Lucius hasn't felt the same to me since the Jace Batman book. Really broke my respect for him.

Is Luke the only one in the Fox family that doesn't know Jace is the Batman of New York? The writing team for this series stated a while back that Luke doesn't know because it would create complications for this series and have to be addressed.

[Frontier]

Is Luke the only one in the Fox family that doesn't know Jace is the Batman of New York? The writing team for this series stated a while back that Luke doesn't know because it would create complications for this series and have to be addressed.

Honestly I don't even remember. Last I remember it turned out he cheated on his wife and fathered a child with a subordinate.

[OBrianTallent]

Its trying way too hard with the big universal stuff, with characters that don't really fit.

Luke and Kate were just the wrong characters for this. This would better fit say Mr. Terrific and the Atom.

This was my thought from the very beginning. It seems now though that the Drummer fits more than previously expected, but as for Jace and specifically Kate....Outsiders, while seemingly fitting on basis of the name, isn't an omniversal/multiverse title. It's not what readers want when they think Outsiders. These characters are not this either. I mean, if you want basic, popular characters for something like this....Tim Drake, Kon and Cassie have more experience and even some expectation for stories such as this.
They really should have gone with another name other than Outsiders. Plus a larger cast would have potentially been more interesting. I'm intrigued with the revelation of the Drummer, but not enough so I think to start buying the book again, except at the local used book store where I can probably find the issues for about a dollar each eventually.

[ayanestar]

Honestly I don't even remember. Last I remember it turned out he cheated on his wife and fathered a child with a subordinate.

After reading all of that mess, I truly couldn't care less about him anymore. It's truly a shame, I had always hoped thy would make more use of his family, but not like this.

[Bat-Meal]

This was my thought from the very beginning. It seems now though that the Drummer fits more than previously expected, but as for Jace and specifically Kate....Outsiders, while seemingly fitting on basis of the name, isn't an omniversal/multiverse title. It's not what readers want when they think Outsiders. These characters are not this either. I mean, if you want basic, popular characters for something like this....Tim Drake, Kon and Cassie have more experience and even some expectation for stories such as this.
They really should have gone with another name other than Outsiders. Plus a larger cast would have potentially been more interesting. I'm intrigued with the revelation of the Drummer, but not enough so I think to start buying the book again, except at the local used book store where I can probably find the issues for about a dollar each eventually.

When I think Batwoman and Batwing I don't think discovery and "understanding" or whatever it is exactly that the writing team for this said - I expect them to go charging into fights. Some assocation with Batman is kind of implied by their titles too. And they are both usually depicted with some level of arrogance, so the empathy angle for this series with these characters is a weird choice. It's part of the reason why they both feel off in this series, but particularly Luke.

[Mantis-Ray]

Honestly I don't even remember. Last I remember it turned out he cheated on his wife and fathered a child with a subordinate.

All because Ridley wanted to make Jace blasian (black/Asian) because his own kids are.

I get wanting inclusion and seeing yourself/your kids in comics but he picked the worst way to go about it.

When I think Batwoman and Batwing I don't think discovery and "understanding" or whatever it is exactly that the writing team for this said - I expect them to go charging into fights. Some assocation with Batman is kind of implied by their titles too. And they are both usually depicted with some level of arrogance, so the empathy angle for this series with these characters is a weird choice. It's part of the reason why they both feel off in this series, but particularly Luke.

The writing here not only makes them ineffectual but they also wind up looking pretentious because of the book's general "I'm too cool for superheroes" tone. So Jace and Kate are all "I'm above being a superhero, I solve my problems intelligently" so they wind up looking like try-hard douches.

[Bat-Meal]

The writing here not only makes them ineffectual but they also wind up looking pretentious because of the book's general "I'm too cool for superheroes" tone. So Jace and Kate are all "I'm above being a superhero, I solve my problems intelligently" so they wind up looking like try-hard douches.

Well, it's messing-up Luke, but I think it's been made quite clear that Kate will be staying as Batwoman in the long term. They had that part in #3 about recruiting Luke but Kate "dreaming of Bats" and hence being too far gone or something, plus it looks like she temporarily leaves the group in coming issues - I think she'll return to the status quo in Gotham after #12. Not so sure about Luke though.

[Man-Thing]

It wasn't really so much a versus as a conversation and a flat-out rejection. For some reason a number of different writers seem to like the idea of Nocturna being obsessed with Kate. She's becoming more than a little stalker-ish, without actually doing the stalking part.

wait what was part two? Did they have another encounter besides this after the Andreyko run that I missed?

[DigiCom]

I'm really REALLY not happy that the writers chose to

spoilers:

Take away the happy ending of Planetary #27

end of spoilers

I don't CARE how meta it is.

[HsssH]

Like 1% of Planetary readers will ever read this, and real number will be likely way lower. Who cares.

[Mantis-Ray]

I'm really REALLY not happy that the writers chose to

spoilers:

Take away the happy ending of Planetary #27

end of spoilers

I don't CARE how meta it is.

I haven't read the issue yet, can you explain what this means?

[Caivu]

wait what was part two? Did they have another encounter besides this after the Andreyko run that I missed?

In Crimes of Passion a few years ago. And in Truth & Justice, but that's non-canon.

[Man-Thing]

Thanks, will go look those up

[DigiCom]

I haven't read the issue yet, can you explain what this means?

In brief:

spoilers:

It's revealed on the last page that the Drummer is Jakita Wagner. Specifically, the Jakita Wagner from Planetary who is looking for Elijah Snow, which suggests that somehow between the end of the series and now, that universe was lost/destroyed.

end of spoilers