OUTSIDERS by Collin Kelly & Jackson Lanzing in November

[Bat-Meal]

What they can't meat some sexy aliens or space travelers up there?

Well, as it turns out, they'll be in Antarctica according to the solicit (I thought it was space).

Also winter Batwoman!

I saw some stuff a while back talking about a "new look Batwoman" and thought whomever wrote that must have been confused - because Kate's default batsuit looks the same as it did when she debuted in 2006 (minus the high heels, but those occasionally return depending on the artist). Now I think they must have meant the cold weather gear she has on here.

It's not first time she's had a special suit for other environments though. There was that space (?) one a few years ago.




Anyway, so now we know that Luke is financing the whole thing, but I wonder why they go with the Outsiders name. Also still wondering if we'll see him in the Gotham War.

[Bat-Meal]

Another interview.

Here is some of it:

Jackson Lanzing: And that truly is what happened to us. It was at San Diego Comic-Con last year, we sat down with Ben Abernathy [Executive Editor for DC Comics], and he said, “We want to do a longer book with you. We're still trying to figure out where Luke Fox and Kate Kane live. If you have anything that could work to team them up, that would be interesting”.

And at the time, we were like maybe it's an ‘Agent of the Bat’ thing. Maybe it's a military fiction thing, because you've kind of got a military background for both characters. But we don't really have a lot of chops for military. That's not really what we do.

Collin Kelly: You don't come to us for military fiction.

[Riv86672]

Collin Kelly: You don't come to us for military fiction.

Jackson Lanzing: you come to us for Planetary.

Collin Kelly: With bats.

Jackson Lanzing: Bats!

[Riv86672]

AKA I’m going to read the first issue out of sheer curiosity.

I mean Hell, the worst that can happen is I get hooked, have to come in here and eat my words.

[Factor]

Collin Kelly: You don't come to us for military fiction.

Jackson Lanzing: you come to us for Planetary.

Collin Kelly: With bats.

Jackson Lanzing: Bats!

Huh? Have they ever written anything close to Planetary in style or critical acclaim?

[Riv86672]

Huh? Have they ever written anything close to Planetary in style or critical acclaim?

^^^Do they really have had to for me to make a bad joke?

[Factor]

^^^Do they really have had to for me to make a bad joke?

My bad, I thought they actually said that. Lol
I haven’t read the interview yet.

[Bat-Meal]

So basically the writing team had been wanting to write a "weird DC archaeology book" for a long time. Then last year DC Editorial told Kelly and Lanzing they wanted them to do another book, and specified that they wanted Luke Fox and Kate Kane out of the toy box to get some use.

Kelly and Lanzing didn't want to do military fiction, or a rip-off of James Bond, so they decided to do the archaeology book that they'd been wanting to do for a long - using the characters that DC had given them (Luke and Kate). So that is why 2 Bat characters are being used in an exploration and archaeology book - because those are the characters DC told the writing team they could have. I'm supposing they might have also been told to use the Outsiders name too, but it's not mentioned.

I'll post the whole interview below anyway:

Jackson Lanzing: To look at weird fictional universes with roughly a century of continuity, and reboots, and crises, and retcons, and all the stuff that happens…

Collin Kelly: All the things that you fall in love with, and then suddenly they're gone. Because the next crisis that’s coming washed them all away.

Jackson Lanzing: And doing a book that tackles that directly and says, “What does it mean to live in that kind of universe? What does it mean to be a historian or an archaeologist in that kind of universe? And what does it mean to try to understand your place in a constantly shifting, changing, rebooting universe?”

That's a very heady concept. And it doesn't lend itself to a simple pitch. And so for a long time, it's sort of been the thing where we sit there and go, like, “Man someday it would be really cool to do a weird DC archaeology book”. That really feels exciting, and inspired by a lot of books that we have loved, and a lot of stories and creators that we've loved over the years.

Collin Kelly: We have the spirit of Grant Morrison over our shoulders on this one, being like, “Yes, boys. Yes”.

Jackson Lanzing: And that truly is what happened to us. It was at San Diego Comic-Con last year, we sat down with Ben Abernathy [Executive Editor for DC Comics], and he said, “We want to do a longer book with you. We're still trying to figure out where Luke Fox and Kate Kane live. If you have anything that could work to team them up, that would be interesting”.

And at the time, we were like maybe it's an ‘Agent of the Bat’ thing. Maybe it's a military fiction thing, because you've kind of got a military background for both characters. But we don't really have a lot of chops for military. That's not really what we do.

Collin Kelly: You don't come to us for military fiction.

Jackson Lanzing: Yeah, it's not really what we do. And so when we started talking about it, we kept running into the same hole, which is like, “We're just kind of writing a rip-off [James] Bond book, like, I don't really know that this is doing anything”.

And then we just sat there and were like, “What other structures could you put a three-person team into, that could allow you to really dig into this?” And we were like, “Star Trek and archeology and understanding and empathy”.

Is there a version of this story that isn't about going into the unknown and punching it? But rather going into the unknown and understanding it? Is there a way to do this book as almost like a rejoinder to Challengers of the Unknown, and then a rejoinder to the way that Batman does business and do something that sits outside of the normal sort of DC, scriptural framework.

Collin Kelly: And what we saw with Luke and Kate was they are two characters who are ready to step outside of that framework. They've seen coming out of Gotham War, coming out of the shadow of the Bat in a very real way. They're over it. They've seen the superheroes and how the superhero system functions: you put them in jail, they get back out… it's just a giant circle. So how do we break that and the same way we break any criminal cycle is with empathy. Is with understanding the victims who are then, in turn, the perpetrators. How do we break that cycle? And that is what the Outsiders are really going to be about.

Jackson Lanzing: And that's the point of archaeology and history in the first place, is to better understand how these things have worked so that we can better understand how to move forward. And so, yeah, we had several backup pitches, we really assumed that this book would never get greenlit, and they cut us off. Ben Abernathy cut us off halfway through the pitch and said, “Guys, you got it. It's done. greenlit. Let's go”.

It's a 12 issue Maxi-Series. They're all 24-page one-shots that dive directly into some forgotten corner or genre or idea from the DC Universe and especially from the last decade of pop culture, and really try to look at that and understand what it means and how we can all carry it forward in our own lives and in the lives of these characters.

Collin Kelly: That's a little ambitious.

[Frontier]

I guess it's nice to know editorial wanted Kate and Luke to do stuff .

[OBrianTallent]

I'm definitely jumping in the first issue just out of sheer curiosity, but I really hope to see more diverse characters joining the team than just two bat characters and a retreaded Drummer (rather they would have just used the original.) I will say though...there's only one other bat-adjacent character I would accept on this team though and she would have to be written correctly.
bette.jpg

[Frontier]

I'm definitely jumping in the first issue just out of sheer curiosity, but I really hope to see more diverse characters joining the team than just two bat characters and a retreaded Drummer (rather they would have just used the original.) I will say though...there's only one other bat-adjacent character I would accept on this team though and she would have to be written correctly.
bette.jpg

Kate doing anything with Bette? Heaven forbid .

[Riv86672]

I'm definitely jumping in the first issue just out of sheer curiosity, but I really hope to see more diverse characters joining the team than just two bat characters and a retreaded Drummer (rather they would have just used the original.) I will say though...there's only one other bat-adjacent character I would accept on this team though and she would have to be written correctly.
bette.jpg

^^^I'd be there SO FAST.

[Oberon]

It seems a gross mischaracterization of Kate, that she would never try to connect with Bette.

Then again, there were times where she seemed to not be connected, though Bette was her admirer (Elegy, mostly).

Bette deserves better treatment by her cousin, maybe others, but certainly the editorial board at DC.

[Factor]

At this time, Bette's best bet is to join the cast of Nightwing. She could be another hero in Bludhaven now that Nightwing will be busier with Titans business and Babs always has her own stuff to deal with.

[Oberon]

My theory is that DC wants to downplay the Nightwing/Flamebird connection per some obscure canon and the semi/sort/retcon of Betty from the Silver Age to Flamebird, now.
But it wouldn't have to be that way, or entirely.
A mature take on Nightwing, Dick, has Flamebird and Batgirl both being his partners but no triangles or romantic tensions.
I don't know Dick's overall background with Babs, though it is obviously greater and greatly nuanced. Don't know where he and Batgirl are at on the romance situation, so other ideas like Titans would be interesting.
If the Titans are to be more important than the JLA
they need a capable member for a new team variant too.