Bringing Back a Married Spider-Man - The Official Appeal - Mayday and beyond

[Dan Slott]

To the "Lee is Dan Slott" people: Give it up. You're wrong.

For the past week or so I've been working on getting 60 pages of comics out the door, doing podcasts & interviews (to promote my Doctor Who GN, Superior Spider-Man, and Spider-Boy), taking some VERY important business meetings for 2024 & 2025 projects (that you will absolutely freak out over when they're eventually announced), and other business-y things.

Outside of one or two IG and FB updates, and a very odd post here, I've mostly been offline. Between all the extra work AND a personal life (gasp!), the only things I could cut out of my schedule would've been the time I goof off online... or sleep. And I LIKE sleep.

Today was the first day I slept-in in AGES. And, with the posts today on this forum (mostly from 2:30 to 6... while also watching a movie on Hulu. Check out "No One Will Save You"-- it's EXCELLENT!) this is the MOST I've goofed around online in a while. Tomorrow I'll be back to work breaking down the plot for SPIDER-BOY #3 (Introducing a couple new villains AND guest-starring the Mighty Thor!) and, before the week is up, I'll have also turned in the plot for SUPERIOR SPIDER-MAN #4. For me plotting takes less time than scripting, so maybe you'll see me around online... or maybe you won't (NYCC and... other stuff... is coming up, so I might have to work ahead of schedule to keep things on track).

The fun of all of this is:
When I spend too much time online, people like to bust my chops and say "Don't you have WORK you should be doing?" (They ask this even on weekends. :-P).
But when I spend almost all my time working, the exact same people like to bust my chops and say "Why are you internet-hiding from us?" (Insert face-palm gif here.)

There's an old Yiddish joke my gramma used to tell:
A wife gets her husband two ties for his birthday, a blue tie and a red tie.
The next morning, while he's getting dressed, the husband decides to show his wife how much he appreciates her gift, so he puts on the blue tie.
When he comes downstairs for breakfast, his wife takes one look at him and asks,
"What's the matter? Don't you like the red tie?"

The internet can be like that.

Anyhoo... I do hope more of you go back and read the post about the pandemic's effect on Local Comic Shops, coupled with the factor of New Comic Day now being split between Tuesday and Wednesday. I think it explains a lot.

ttyl

[Superboy-Prime]

I think a more pressing question is: Why does Marvel Editorial feel the need to keep Peter Parker beholden to a deal made with the Marvel Universe's Devil? Regardless of if it results in him being with Mary Jane or not, why doesn't it bother anyone over there that he's stuck in a literal Satanic pact?

Correct me on if Spencer's run changed that or not.

[CaptainUniverse]

I think a more pressing question is: Why does Marvel Editorial feel the need to keep Peter Parker beholden to a deal made with the Marvel Universe's Devil? Regardless of if it results in him being with Mary Jane or not, why doesn't it bother anyone over there that he's stuck in a literal Satanic pact?

Correct me on if Spencer's run changed that or not.

It didn't, Peter and Mary Jane are still beholden to Mephisto.

[Alan2099]

I think a more pressing question is: Why does Marvel Editorial feel the need to keep Peter Parker beholden to a deal made with the Marvel Universe's Devil? Regardless of if it results in him being with Mary Jane or not, why doesn't it bother anyone over there that he's stuck in a literal Satanic pact?

How's he still stuck in it? Mephisto's plans for Spider-man feel through and there's nothing stopping him and MJ from getting back together if that's what they both wanted.

[Superboy-Prime]

How's he still stuck in it? Mephisto's plans for Spider-man feel through and there's nothing stopping him and MJ from getting back together if that's what they both wanted.

For one, them not just getting divorced rather than living in a reconstructed reality due to a deal made with the Devil. But also that part about a tiny bit of their souls screaming for eternity.

[Yvonmukluk]

How's he still stuck in it? Mephisto's plans for Spider-man feel through and there's nothing stopping him and MJ from getting back together if that's what they both wanted.

I mean…this whole run is explicitly about keeping Pete & MJ apart. Given that the whole plan for Spider-Man on Mephisto’s part is to keep them apart, his plans haven’t fallen through at all and won’t, because (and they’d probably not phrase it this way), Marvel editorial is on his side. Whether it’s to prevent Peter and MJ from having a kid, to destroy a love so pure that it spites god himself to do it, or just to torture Peter and MJ, the Wells run sure makes it look like Mephisto’s plans are working as intended. He’s still winning.

It’s gotten to the point where ‘our’ Peter is lecturing another version of himself who actually lost his Aunt not to take a deal with a villain to save your loved ones. When he literally did that exact thing!

We all know that for the foreseeable future that 616 Peter and Mary Jane aren’t going to get back together on a permanent basis, and certainly not remarried. Marvel won’t allow them to. So he’s still stuck in it, and he still will be, until he actually has some kind of reckoning with it.

[marhawkman]

... And around that time I decided to start reading Manga and Graphic Novels, which pushed back against what Marvel just did. It had characters that weren't afraid to grow up, become adults, get married, start families, and continue to have exciting adventures and thrilling fights and tons of interpersonal drama and family dynamics.

As much as Goku as a character doesn't change in terms of personality, he has changed in many other ways. He started as a pre-teen, and eventually became a GRAND-father. Dragon Ball has several things that changed very little over time... but several other things that changed radically.

[Blunt Guy]

Well, I see the usual suspects are still beating their drums about OMD. Have to admire the dedication to the noble cause of changing a comic book outcome (for sixteen years and counting!). It'll probably happen any day now. Life will be perfect again.

[Garlador]

Slott is more than free to post wherever he wishes, whenever he wishes, as often as he wishes. What a bizarre critique. I have an insanely busy career, a busy family life, and nobody is asking me why I pop in to talk comics and share opinions when I could be doing other things. Like Slott, Saturday was the first time in months I've slept in.

Post more, I say. The engagement is great.

As much as Goku as a character doesn't change in terms of personality, he has changed in many other ways. He started as a pre-teen, and eventually became a GRAND-father. Dragon Ball has several things that changed very little over time... but several other things that changed radically.

I'm not a huge Dragon Ball fan, but, yeah, kids never stopped loving Goku despite the fact episode 1 of DBZ establishes him as married with a son, and he's a grandfather currently. I'd argue that characters like Vegeta and Piccolo are more strong examples of characters that grew substantially, with Vegeta also evolving into a devoted husband and father, and Piccolo into a surrogate dad as well. Decades later, and I still see their games selling millions, their toys selling strongly, their anime with strong viewership, and the manga with high sales. Marriage and children didn't turn fans away whatsoever.

Well, I see the usual suspects are still beating their drums about OMD. Have to admire the dedication to the noble cause of changing a comic book outcome (for sixteen years and counting!). It'll probably happen any day now. Life will be perfect again.

What a strange comment. Just because an unresolved problem has stuck around for 16 years doesn't mean it's suddenly become more acceptable. I've stated earlier, this has been a pretty strong year for refuting the anti-marriage agenda, and I've seen a lot of new faces jumping in as a result. Am I a "usual suspect" (I've only come back to the CBR forums this year after a very long hiatus)?

Honestly, I don't understand jumping into a thread with an explicit message and goal if you have no interest in participating. However, if you truly "admire the dedication to the noble cause", I would very much like to hear your thoughts on what you want out of the comic, how you think it should be approached, and what you think you might be able to offer or contribute to the agenda. I'm serious. Life may not be "perfect again", but who wouldn't be curious to see where we could ride this out? All one can do is try. I worry about what's in my control, and roll with that which is out of my control. If I can do something, why not try?

How's he still stuck in it? Mephisto's plans for Spider-man feel through and there's nothing stopping him and MJ from getting back together if that's what they both wanted.

To tackle this point, it was stated that Mephisto outright "won" here and continues to win. It was said that a part of Mary Jane and Peter's souls will be "screaming for eternity" knowing that there's a hole there that can never be filled. That their marriage was "made holy" by the Most High, and that holiness was desecrated and perverted by the deal. That their future together, and their child(ren), were sacrificed and removed from an ordained destiny. That it's implied that Peter and Mary Jane cannot be married again, because the moment they get too close to doing so, literal hell opens up and supernatural forces always conspire to keep them apart, with the direct influence of demons and devils and fallen gods at the root of their relationship misery these days. It's never organic, natural conflict, because otherwise they would be remarried based on both their history, desires, and personalities.



This isn't "ancient history" or "16 years ago". This is RECENT history. The trauma and damage of One More Day is brought up and reference in MODERN comics. It's ridiculous to say "get over it" when Marvel themselves keep mentioning the event in their comics - and emphasizing that it's WRONG.

Beyond even that, it's a sticking point that Mary Jane told Mephisto that part of the terms of their deal is that he had to leave Peter alone "for the end of his days".

About that...

[Celgress]

I won't lie, looking at the above panels anger me even all these years later.

While I don't care about the marriage as passionately as many other long-term fans, it is the whole evil triumphing over good aspect of OMD with Big Red's win that sticks in my craw. It'll never sit right with me. The message is antithetical to storytelling, especially to comic books which are at their heart morality plays. And let's not act like Peter and/or MJ will ever get that win back this is not a setup for another story beat, there will be no resolution here due to editorial interference, so, yeah, terrible.

[exile001]

While I don't care about the marriage as passionately as many other long-term fans, it is the whole evil triumphing over good aspect of OMD with Big Red's win that sticks in my craw. It'll never sit right with me.

This is the lingering problem I have with it. It really bugs me that Pete and MJ never got their win, that they lost so much and that's it. Our hero and his partner just gave the devil a big win, and suffer the consequences of that going forward.

I do like that Spencer added a caveat that their eventual child actually does defeat Mephisto at a critical juncture, which is his way of giving Pete and MJ their win back, but it still feels a bit hollow to me.

That said, I don't dwell on it when I'm reading other Spider-Man books (likely helped by taking a 3 year break with BND). Mostly, I don't care and what's done is done.

[Jman27]

This is the lingering problem I have with it. It really bugs me that Pete and MJ never got their win, that they lost so much and that's it. Our hero and his partner just gave the devil a big win, and suffer the consequences of that going forward.

I do like that Spencer added a caveat that their eventual child actually does defeat Mephisto at a critical juncture, which is his way of giving Pete and MJ their win back, but it still feels a bit hollow to me.

That said, I don't dwell on it when I'm reading other Spider-Man books (likely helped by taking a 3 year break with BND). Mostly, I don't care and what's done is done.

For me it’s solidified and confirms that they lose and will never win against Mephisto

[Bitterman]

For me it’s solidified and confirms that they lose and will never win against Mephisto

At this rate is safe to confirm that patient zero of the pacts is Not even Norman or Peter.
Is Aunt May for always cheating death and someone dying in her stead, even Stan Lee wanted to get rid of her so peter could grow up but Ditko said no and they went with Gwen.

PS: i don't know how to use the spoiler tag

[Dan Slott]

...even Stan Lee wanted to get rid of her so peter could grow up but Ditko said no and they went with Gwen.

Citation? I'm only asking because before ASM #400, J.M. DeMatteis had to reach out to Stan Lee and ask if it was okay to (back then) have Aunt May pass away because Stan was so fond of the character.

[Kaitou D. Kid]

At this rate is safe to confirm that patient zero of the pacts is Not even Norman or Peter.
Is Aunt May for always cheating death and someone dying in her stead, even Stan Lee wanted to get rid of her so peter could grow up but Ditko said no and they went with Gwen.

PS: i don't know how to use the spoiler tag

A bit off-topic, but I resist the idea that Aunt May needs to die for Peter to grow up. So much that I wrote a piece called "Undo One More Day, But Don't Kill Aunt May".

https://subatomicviewer.wordpress.co...kill-aunt-may/