How do you prefer your Cyborg?

[Ascended]

I'm kinda mixed on this. I do think he needs to start out with visible (including on his face) prosthesis and have issue with his humanity and be upset with what he feels was done to him.

However, I do think he very much needs to get past it.

Exactly. I don't want to pull the rug out from Vic's history and make fundamental changes to what he's gone through and who he is (I just want his future aimed in the right direction ), but every single one of us, regardless of whatever else we may disagree on, is tired of that same old angst. And that's the arc; Vic is in the accident and struggles to accept what happened to him. Thanks to DC's crap treatment, he spends time cycling through the stages of acceptance. Which hey, some folks do, so it's fine as far as backstory goes. But the man needs to find real, lasting peace, whatever the details of that look like, and grow.

I do kinda disagree with "the best of both and inferior to neither" as I kinda think it reads as though he thinks himself superior.

I can see how I sounded that way. Wasn't my intention, Vic doesn't have that kind of 'better than thou' ego. I was just trying to say Vic (should) no longer feel like he's 'less than' just because of the prosthetics.

But that's really my problem, not something anyone else needs to fix.

Generally sure, but when it comes to cycling Vic's angst, it's not a "you" problem, that stupid shit has held Cyborg back for twenty years and more. That's a failing on DC that affects all of us; it's the biggest reason Cyborg hasn't become more popular, and something they absolutely need to fix. Same applies to most of the Titans really. Not even Dick and Wally fully escaped DC's obsession with repeating Wolfman's greatest hits, and having their stories limited by it.

And, of course, as much as I want my heroes to be happy, in the end they are fictional characters. What the fans find entertaining (and want to spend money on) is more important than the characters' happiness.

We want pathos and drama and challenges both internal and external, but that's not the same thing as Vic spending his whole life in depression. Some characters thrive when they suffer endlessly, like Batman and Spider-Man, but that doesn't work for every character. Nobody wants a super sad Flash all the time, just as we don't want a super happy one all the time. Vic's got great gravitas and pathos, great emotional range as a character, it doesn't serve him or us fans if he's always just one emotion.

[Iconic]

I don't know. It's worked pretty good for Wolverine.

Except Wolverine comes with a payoff. He’s not viewed as unappealing. He gets to be a romantic interest. He looks cool. He gets to have an interesting life. He’s allowed to grow. Remove all of that from him and you have Cyborg.

[skyvolt2000]

I don't know. It's worked pretty good for Wolverine.

How many books does Logan appear in?

You can get away with a lot when you have a character that appears in more than one book.

[Ascended]

Now we got a college student writing Cyborg. That is the best they can do?

Dude's a college student? Damn, good for him. And he's doing solid work so far, we'll have to remember to keep an eye on this guy.

But you're trying to have it both ways here man. You ask if a college kid is the best DC can do, but complain about the way the old guard treated him. Personally I think getting a college kid is a fantastic idea. We've seen what the established industry talent can do with Vic and it was generally far less impressive than it could/should have been. I'm thrilled they're giving a chance to someone young and hungry, out to leave a mark. There's established writers I'd like to see on Vic of course, folks I think would do great things with him if given a chance, but a young guy with something to prove and, one hopes, a fresh imagination? Not seeing that as an inherent negative.

[Customizer]

Victor has the faceplate in Young Justice.

I'm aware. I was referencing his non face plate appearances in the show

Young Justice was a decent show prior to its most recent comeback season.

[Agent Z]

Except Wolverine comes with a payoff. He’s not viewed as unappealing.

Neither is Victor.

He gets to be a romantic interest.

Victor has had those as well.

He looks cool. He gets to have an interesting life.

You don't need to change Victor's look for him to have an interesting life. And this is my opinion, but Logan doesn't really look that cool. People just accept his design because of the grandfather clause.

He’s allowed to grow.

What growth has Logan had? The guy has pretty much been the same person for decades. The last interesting development he had was when he lost his healing factor and that was undone.

[Agent Z]

I'm aware. I was referencing his non face plate appearances in the show

Young Justice was a decent show prior to its most recent comeback season.

....The only time Victor didn't have the faceplate was before his accident. I honestly don't know what you are referring to here.

[Alan2099]

....The only time Victor didn't have the faceplate was before his accident. I honestly don't know what you are referring to here.

Well, there was also the time he was Gold T-1000, but he was far less "cyborg" at that time and far more just-a-robot.

[Ascended]

Well, there was also the time he was Gold T-1000, but he was far less "cyborg" at that time and far more just-a-robot.

Gods I did not care for that era. Like, I give DC points for effort, they did try to evolve Vic after the Technis Imperative, but that was not a great direction, or a good visual.

For a brief time they had the gold tech, but looking like the old school design. That wasn't so bad, it looked like Vic at least and gold is a decent color on him. But the silver/white is more recognizable and, I think, looks better anyway.

[Sutekh]

Gods I did not care for that era. Like, I give DC points for effort, they did try to evolve Vic after the Technis Imperative, but that was not a great direction, or a good visual.

For a brief time they had the gold tech, but looking like the old school design. That wasn't so bad, it looked like Vic at least and gold is a decent color on him. But the silver/white is more recognizable and, I think, looks better anyway.

Also not a fan of the technis 'gold T-1000' look, but I do agree that gold could have been a good color for his metal bits. Or even a more ruddy copper or 'red gold' shade. The silver got old, for me.

[Agent Z]

I think we all want what is best for Victor. However, we may have different ideas about what that entails.

[Iconic]

Has Cyborg taken off? Has this character, which is one of the extremely few black original characters to not be a spinoff/sidekick/backup, been given an elevated profile? Any major roles that led to anything substantial? No? Then the character you claim to like hasn’t worked. Maybe they should go and stick with a new direction.

Maybe he should be attractive. Maybe he should be more capable based on his powerset. Maybe he shouldn’t be questioning his humanity for the umpteenth time. Maybe he should have more of a supporting cast that doesn’t get reset when DC decides on a new writer. This same ol-same ol hasn’t moved the needle. That’s why this thread has been popping up here for well over a decade.

[Alan2099]

Has Cyborg taken off? Has this character, which is one of the extremely few black original characters to not be a spinoff/sidekick/backup, been given an elevated profile? Any major roles that led to anything substantial? No? Then the character you claim to like hasn’t worked. Maybe they should go and stick with a new direction.

He's a regular on a popular cartoon show and was one of the main characters in a movie. That seems rather elevated to me.

[Sutekh]

He's a regular on a popular cartoon show and was one of the main characters in a movie. That seems rather elevated to me.

Have any other former Titans been considered for their own solo movie (which he was, before that fell apart), or appeared in a big budget picture like Justice League? Plus his appearances on Doom Patrol add yet another series to his recent-ish appearances, and no matter how quirky and niche Doom Patrol is, it seems to be held in better regard by it's fans than Titans was (which had some great costumes and great actors, and utterly crap writing/plotting, IMO).

He's gotten some decent use in TV/movies between Teen Titans Go, Justice League, Doom Patrol, even Smallville (more than any other Titan, except Nightwing, if you count his appearances as Robin by Chris O'Donnell and Burt Ward!), just, too many ideas as to what 'we fans' want, IMO, which makes every appearance disappointing or 'not good enough' or 'doesn't count' to some segment of us.

[Customizer]

....The only time Victor didn't have the faceplate was before his accident. I honestly don't know what you are referring to here.

That's what i'm referring to

Real life has gotten in the way of a more lengthy response but i want to reiterate on page 14 of this thread , as i have in many posts, I just want Cyborgs face plate gone and a defined canon based power set that's utilized as it is defined.


That's it .

*shrugs*

For the most part I don't have an issue with Cyborg from the neck down in any of the designs that i've seen (except the Perez design...it's very dated in my opinion).


In fact if someone forced me to choose between either "no face plate" and "a strictly defined canon based power set" that removes opinion based discussions about what people want i'd choose the latter. The core of this back and forth (IMO) is DC not being crystal clear about what the character can and can't do on a consistent basis.

I'm starting to understand the frustration that many DC fans have had with universe resets and the ill defined status of past canon.