How do you prefer your Cyborg?

[Ascended]

How do you prefer Cyborg when it comes to his "human parts vs robot parts". Sometimes his entire one arm is human, and his other arm isn't. Sometimes he's robot from the elbows and knees down. Or like in the movie he's basically a machine from the next down.

What do you think looks best?

The best we've probably had in comics is the DCYou design by Reis, and I think the Flashpoint costume was quite good as well. And I like the current look, especially when he's wearing athletic wear over it. In larger media, the Doom Patrol look is good, but I find most adaptations have a few bits that I like and a lot that I don't.

Don't think we've ever hit the 'perfect, timeless' design, and I'm not sure we ever can, since technology keeps changing so Vic has to too.

But my general rules for what a good Cyborg design needs is...

Vic needs to look like a cyborg. Not a dude in power armor, not a robot. He's a fusion; man and machine, so I want roughly 50% organic, 50% cybernetic. And I prefer it asymmetrical, so he's not missing the same pieces on both sides (which is weird). Vic doesn't need to be showing skin the way the 80's version did, I'm fine when the skin is covered by the black spandex or whatever, but the flesh needs to be there and in equal amount to the cybernetics. And yes, his, um, 'gear shift' is all original and in perfect working order. And some of the bionic parts (hand, knee, whatever) need to be obviously robotic, and not just an armor covering.

The cybernetics need to reflect the highest, most cutting edge stuff in the public consciousness. Whatever that is, at a given moment in time. Right now it looks sleek and supple, and almost like real flesh except for color/texture and a few obvious joints, screws, and seams. Right now, Vic should look like he was designed by Apple and whoever makes those really sleek military drones.

Emblem. He needs one, and DC needs to stick with it. Vic needs something you can slap on a t-shirt or lunchbox that people will recognize. His face is his most iconic and marketable asset, but a face, any face, is a poor substitute for a 'S' shield or lightning bolt. And some folks (understandably) take issue with the face-plate. DC's given him some, changed them, taken them away...they need to settle on one and use it across the board on everything, just as Clark always has his shield. I prefer the emblem to be over his heart rather than centered on his chest. That keeps the asymmetrical element and also speaks to the themes of the character.

I prefer when Vic wears clothes. He's basically running around naked otherwise. I'm ashamed to say I never really considered that before someone (the new writer?) pointed it out recently.

Not precisely part of the 'costume' conversation, but tangentially related. Vic should have the ability to change what he looks like. We're at the point where holograms are real so I don't even want Vic using that to disguise himself, I want his tech to literally rearrange itself so he can appear as whatever he wants (within reason). But while I'm fine with Vic going 'normal' when he wants to be incognito, I want him to spend most of his time in his 'default' cyborg appearance, and I want it to be because Vic has made peace with what and who he is. He wants to be seen for that, and not have to hide behind a 'normie' disguise so other people can feel comfortable.

[Riv86672]

Or more accurately, the one people are desperate to ignore.

^^^Oh, zing! Arrow to the heart!

Oh, how could I forget! Korvac! The incredibly high profile character that's been featured heavily in both movies and television!

^^^There are ppl who discuss things, and there are ppl who just wait for their turn to say the same thing over, as they aren’t in any way open to changing their minds. You’re the latter and while fun, I keep these interactions short.

I’ll just leave you with…

…this poor white man has had his junk split down the middle. LENGTH WISE!

[Triniking1234]

Or people are just pointing out obvious racial double standards. If this is so okay for Cyborg, there shouldn't be any problem if, say, Cable had nothing from the waist down as well.

How is it a double standard when other characters with origin stories like Victor exist? Metamorpho and Captain Atom don't have ̶p̶e̶n̶i̶s̶e̶s̶ human bodies either.

[Customizer]

The best we've probably had in comics is the DCYou design by Reis, and I think the Flashpoint costume was quite good as well. And I like the current look, especially when he's wearing athletic wear over it. In larger media, the Doom Patrol look is good, but I find most adaptations have a few bits that I like and a lot that I don't.

Don't think we've ever hit the 'perfect, timeless' design, and I'm not sure we ever can, since technology keeps changing so Vic has to too.

But my general rules for what a good Cyborg design needs is...

Vic needs to look like a cyborg. Not a dude in power armor, not a robot. He's a fusion; man and machine, so I want roughly 50% organic, 50% cybernetic. And I prefer it asymmetrical, so he's not missing the same pieces on both sides (which is weird). Vic doesn't need to be showing skin the way the 80's version did, I'm fine when the skin is covered by the black spandex or whatever, but the flesh needs to be there and in equal amount to the cybernetics. And yes, his, um, 'gear shift' is all original and in perfect working order. And some of the bionic parts (hand, knee, whatever) need to be obviously robotic, and not just an armor covering.

The cybernetics need to reflect the highest, most cutting edge stuff in the public consciousness. Whatever that is, at a given moment in time. Right now it looks sleek and supple, and almost like real flesh except for color/texture and a few obvious joints, screws, and seams. Right now, Vic should look like he was designed by Apple and whoever makes those really sleek military drones.

Emblem. He needs one, and DC needs to stick with it. Vic needs something you can slap on a t-shirt or lunchbox that people will recognize. His face is his most iconic and marketable asset, but a face, any face, is a poor substitute for a 'S' shield or lightning bolt. And some folks (understandably) take issue with the face-plate. DC's given him some, changed them, taken them away...they need to settle on one and use it across the board on everything, just as Clark always has his shield. I prefer the emblem to be over his heart rather than centered on his chest. That keeps the asymmetrical element and also speaks to the themes of the character.

I prefer when Vic wears clothes. He's basically running around naked otherwise. I'm ashamed to say I never really considered that before someone (the new writer?) pointed it out recently.

Not precisely part of the 'costume' conversation, but tangentially related. Vic should have the ability to change what he looks like. We're at the point where holograms are real so I don't even want Vic using that to disguise himself, I want his tech to literally rearrange itself so he can appear as whatever he wants (within reason). But while I'm fine with Vic going 'normal' when he wants to be incognito, I want him to spend most of his time in his 'default' cyborg appearance, and I want it to be because Vic has made peace with what and who he is. He wants to be seen for that, and not have to hide behind a 'normie' disguise so other people can feel comfortable.

This is a well thought out reply to the topic and i appreciate the detailed response.

While i may not agree with every point made (what can i say... i'd like to to see Cyborg in animated film style battle armor at some point I realize i'm in the minority % with that opinion heh) i think most of the suggestions you've made uplift / improve the character. I do have a question for you though... when you say you're fine with Cyborg "going normal" what does that mean exactly in your opinion? I ask as you've mentioned that you'd like to see

his tech "literally rearrange itself so he can appear as whatever he wants (within reason).

a power set that Cyborg has shown repeatedly within the comics.

So what is "normal"?

If he can rearrange his physical structure isn't the character whatever he presents himself as? What is the default look if he has the ability to appear as whatever he wants (ex. laser arm man, rocket boot man, USB / computer / tech interface device man etc.)?

If he can change his feet (calves) into rocket boots and then back into his "normal" feet... then why wouldn't he change any other part of his body back into it's "normal" appearance (face, hands, lower legs etc.)?

BTW i've associated Cyborg with the "C" emblem for some time now (2nd only to his armor itself). The "C" is equivalent to the "S" or bat symbol for me.

[Nomads1]

Given how long the discussion of Vic's man parts has been going, I'm inclined to think that people have really misinterpreted what the OP meant with "How do you prefer your Cyborg".

Peace

[marhawkman]

If the face plate were removed that would be a completely acceptable look IMO. Not my favorite but acceptable sans metallic head portion.

The face plate is OG. It's just not Vic Stone without it.

[Triniking1234]

They should dial the face plate back like in Doom Patrol so that it only covers the upper left part of his head like in Doom Patrol.

[Ascended]

While i may not agree with every point made (what can i say... i'd like to to see Cyborg in animated film style battle armor at some point I realize i'm in the minority % with that opinion heh)

I'm down for Vic to shift his armor to fit the situation, so yeah, bring that on! Let's see Vic suit up like that to tank a tough fight, hell yeah.

I do have a question for you though... when you say you're fine with Cyborg "going normal" what does that mean exactly in your opinion?

In that context what I meant was Vic changing his appearance so he'd look standard human, as if the accident had never happened. Like a 'normal' person. What I'm saying is, is that I think Vic's tech needs to be advanced enough that he could pass for normal if he wanted to (that's barely even 'sci-fi' these days, so if Vic can't, dude might as well be a toaster), but he no longer wants to. That's the arc, right? When we first meet him he hated what the accident did to him, he hated the prosthetics, he hated not being normal and not fitting in. All that tired 'man or machine?' angst. Now, years later, his tech is advanced enough he could pass for normal, easily. But he's over the angst, he's made peace with his truth, he doesn't want to hide what or who he is, he wants to live his normal, not everyone else's idea of normal. He finally got what he wanted, only to realize it no longer mattered to him.

That said, there'd be times he'd want to be lowkey. Going out on a chill date and not wanting to draw attention at the theater/restaurant as a famous superhero? Or infiltrating a crime organization undercover? He'd 'go normal' for stuff like that, but that's basically the same as a celebrity putting on a hat and sunglasses to buy groceries, just trying to avoid being recognized.

a power set that Cyborg has shown repeatedly within the comics.

Right. What I suggest here isn't new, I'm just saying I want to see DC capitalize on it properly, instead of halfassing it like they usually do.

What is the default look if he has the ability to appear as whatever he wants?

The 'default' look, I figure, is what he looks like without any 'transformer' systems running. The man/machine hybrid with the face plate, prosthetic limbs, etc. Vic should be able to shift his cybernetics around at will, change their texture, color, augments, etc., without effort. But when none of that is running, when he's just himself, then he's just the regular Cyborg we all recognize.

If he can change his feet (calves) into rocket boots and then back into his "normal" feet... then why wouldn't he change any other part of his body back into it's "normal" appearance (face, hands, lower legs etc.)?

If you mean 'normal' like 'accident didn't happen, regular person' normal then like I said, he doesn't because he no longer wants to.

BTW i've associated Cyborg with the "C" emblem for some time now (2nd only to his armor itself). The "C" is equivalent to the "S" or bat symbol for me.

Yeah they've been using it more often than not, last couple years. I feel like it started getting more regular use when AT&T bought WB maybe? Still not consistently used, but it's getting better and I think the logo is starting to maybe take hold, a tiny bit, in the public consciousness. I think we're a long way from it having wide-spread recognition but I think we might be on the path getting there, finally.

[skyvolt2000]

How is it a double standard when other characters with origin stories like Victor exist? Metamorpho and Captain Atom don't have ̶p̶e̶n̶i̶s̶e̶s̶ human bodies either.

And both have kids or wives at one point.

And yes we have guys like Silvermane running around without a human body.

Same with Deathlok. With one version of him having a wife and 2 kids.

The issue with Cyborg is there seems to be pushback or a desire for him to look as less human as he can at DC at one point.


And with black characters since it's a battle for them to get usage-folks are going to pay attention to every little thing.

If they date
If they do more than background duty in books
If they get killed off
If they get pushed aside for another person

Folks are going to notice.

Especially for someone who is pretty much the only black character-who can boast appearing in comics and tv at the same time. So if he is the only one-everything is going to be looked at.

Folks are going to wonder why a guy with all those power can't do more.

Change his appearance when needed for undercover.
Change his appearance to protect someone-him having the sorely Exxy makes Exxy a target for enemies.
Change his appearance-so you have more toys to MAKE.

[dkrook]

I love how ceartain posters are so obsessed with Vic's dick. It just so comical them looking for racism in every little thing. I'm not sure how they can enjoy anything

What's funnier is just who exactly is trying to deny the elements of racism in so many things including decisions made in comics. Lol, I wonder if foxes would deny there's an issue with chickens being killed and eaten by other foxes. There's plenty to appreciate about Victor being able to have all his powers while look like a whole human.

[dkrook]

Really? Because I just googled it now and the only context I found about him being "ugly" was in regards to the live action movie. No one said anything about his comic, animated or Doom Patrol iterations being ugly.

Furthermore this quote, "And don't tell me his face plate is "iconic" because there is nothing really "iconic" about Cyborg's design." is from a 2013 blog post which is specifically talking about the New 52 design. Anyone claiming there is nothing iconic about Cyborg's design is either being disingenuous or clearly doesn't know what iconic actually means.

Either way, a handful of bellyachers on the Internet do not speak for the majority. Most people, believe it or not, don't think or care about how much sex Cyborg has or how attractive he is or isn't. It's not like he's the only black character DC has or even the only black character in the Titans.

Lol, now you're just being obtuse. The looks that he sported throughout time have been hideous. We need to stop pretending that these books about heroes and superbeings tend to be 85% fantasy wish fulfillment and most young kids and adults don't wanna be chop shop looking black guy with self-hatred and daddy issues.

[Shockingjustice]

The face plate is OG. It's just not Vic Stone without it.

By that logic so is Cyborg showing more skin than just his face, but DC has clearly being removing his skin portions.

[Agent Z]

You said it was never mentioned. It was In that game.

I was talking about the comics.

[Agent Z]

Yep. And I'm just gonna come out and say it: asides from Robotman (whom I'm not counting here because he's literally just a brain), have we ever seen a white male cyborg built this way?

Raiden from Metal Gear immediately comes to mind. Actually, most of the main cyborg characters from Metal Gear Rising - none of whom are black - would qualify. Also Random Virus from Ace Lightning.

[Agent Z]

Or more accurately, the one people are desperate to ignore.



Oh, how could I forget! Korvac! The incredibly high profile character that's been featured heavily in both movies and television!

Again, we have people moving the goal posts. The question was if white cyborgs had been built like this, not how high profile they were.