Firestarter Charlie vs Elsa

[Sophicles]

Charlie from the book Firestarter takes on Elsa, the Frozen Disney princess.

Whose power wins out - fire or ice?

[Powerboy]

Charlie from the book Firestarter takes on Elsa, the Frozen Disney princess.

Whose power wins out - fire or ice?

Strictly from the original book? It's been a long time. For now, I'm going to guess "Fast-Draw contest".

[Sharpandpointies]

Strictly from the original book? It's been a long time. For now, I'm going to guess "Fast-Draw contest".

Which means Charlie wins. Easily.

At bullet-time speeds, she hits Elsa with an opening combination PK/Pyrokinetic blast that liquifies flesh off bone (the entire body) then chars the bone, does the same to the guy behind him, then continues to hit the back wall of a barn such that the wood of the wall becomes shrapnel that tears apart people fifty yards away (like, literally ripping one person in half).

Unless Frozen II gave Elsa some bullet-time feats, this is what she's eating before she can react, put up ice shields, whatever. It doesn't matter if she has greater overall power than Charlie; she doesn't have the speed to compete and end-of-book Charlie has more than enough oomph right out of the gate to insta-kill her.

[Postmania]

Man the recent movie really nerfed her then huh

[choptop]

Which means Charlie wins. Easily.

At bullet-time speeds, she hits Elsa with an opening combination PK/Pyrokinetic blast that liquifies flesh off bone (the entire body) then chars the bone, does the same to the guy behind him, then continues to hit the back wall of a barn such that the wood of the wall becomes shrapnel that tears apart people fifty yards away (like, literally ripping one person in half).

Unless Frozen II gave Elsa some bullet-time feats, this is what she's eating before she can react, put up ice shields, whatever. It doesn't matter if she has greater overall power than Charlie; she doesn't have the speed to compete and end-of-book Charlie has more than enough oomph right out of the gate to insta-kill her.

That's in the book?

[Wildling]

Man the recent movie really nerfed her then huh

The last movie was tragic to me overall in quality, but at least it gave Charlie more TP control as I recall.

That's in the book?

Yeah? The government assassin hired to keep an eye on her shot at her before the book showed she was able to react and burn everything relevant around her.

Keeping in mind her powers were shown as evolving over time, earlier in the novel she showed it was natural for her to not think much about showering on too hot water, she adapted to it just like she was able to not allow a hitman's bullets reach her out of how much power she was unleashing to vaporize around her. This happened a bit after what Sharpandpointies posted.

[choptop]

The last movie was tragic to me overall in quality, but at least it gave Charlie more TP control as I recall.



Yeah? The government assassin hired to keep an eye on her shot at her before the book showed she was able to react and burn everything relevant around her.

Keeping in mind her powers were shown as evolving over time, earlier in the novel she showed it was natural for her to not think much about showering on too hot water, she adapted to it just like she was able to not allow a hitman's bullets reach her out of how much power she was unleashing to vaporize around her. This happened a bit after what Sharpandpointies posted.

Cool so she's more powerful In the book I guess.

[Sharpandpointies]

Yeah? The government assassin hired to keep an eye on her shot at her before the book showed she was able to react and burn everything relevant around her.

Keeping in mind her powers were shown as evolving over time, earlier in the novel she showed it was natural for her to not think much about showering on too hot water, she adapted to it just like she was able to not allow a hitman's bullets reach her out of how much power she was unleashing to vaporize around her. This happened a bit after what Sharpandpointies posted.

What Wildling says.

Here's a post from the last thread we did involving Firestarter (versus Eleven).

Note that this is Charlie 'powered down'. While most of the book involves her needing to ramp up her power to use it at high levels, by the end of the book she has had 'training and practice' thanks to the experiments performed on her, and has a whole lot more power to grab from the get-go. Also more control. Not 'a lot of control', but 'more'.

So when she looses a pulse of power that vaporizes the bullet after it was fired at her and goes on to flash-incinerate Rainbird and Cap, and finishes by ripping the back wall of a barn into a massive, shrapnel explosion, she does that from 'shut down' mode. In the scene, she's all fired up, ready to use her power, then Rainbird talks her down by blackmailing her with her father. She lets go of using her power and is starting to agree with his terms. Her father then interrupts the situation, and Rainbird shoots her father. Charlie starts screaming, her attention goes completely to her father, she's still not showing any signs of revving up her PK/Pyrokinesis any more. It's back down to a 'nothing' state, really. Rainbird calls to her, she turns around, and he fires.

Then we get the scene quoted in the linked thread, with her power reacting to the gunshot after Rainbird fires.

She's plenty fast to win the quickdraw here, and powerful enough to simply incinerate Elsa right off the bat. Even if, by some miracle, the first attack doesn't outright kill Elsa (it will, but let's argue the point) and she somehow, miraculously manages to stay conscious, Elsa needs to deal with protecting herself while suffering massive damage with Charlie simply continuing to attack.

[Captain Smith]

At the end of the book, IIRC, Charlie was hinted at taking a shot at the sun. For what purpose, I don't know. Been awhile though.

[Sharpandpointies]

End of the book, Charlie looks up at the sun and sees it looking weird, like through a heat-haze. She wonders if she has mucked around with it. Then she realizes that no, it's just the vast amounts of steam from the hundred+ tonnes of water she just flash-boiled.

BUT she then thinks...'in the future, maybe?'

Here:

The steam rolled majestically past her. Overhead,the sun was a tarnished silver coin.

I changed the sun, she thought disjointedly, and then, No—not really—it’s the steam—the fog—it’ll blow away—

But with a sudden sureness that came from deep inside she knew that she could change the sun if she wanted to . . . in time.

The power was still growing.

This act of destruction, this apocalypse, had only approached its current limit.

The potential had hardly been tapped.

And King notes earlier in the book that her powers seem to be tied, in part, to her pituitary gland, which goes apeshit in puberty...and Charlie is just about to enter puberty.
Basically, he meant Charlie to be a potential apocalypse for the entire world. But she's not there yet.

[Wildling]

And King notes earlier in the book that her powers seem to be tied, in part, to her pituitary gland, which goes apeshit in puberty...and Charlie is just about to enter puberty.
Basically, he meant Charlie to be a potential apocalypse for the entire world. But she's not there yet.

The scientist who created this story's psychic serum said she could at one point trigger a nuclear explosion with her mind. The military guy in charge of the Shop shady government agency responsible thought he was crazy and had him killed off, but later regretted the decision when their safety heat measures were falling short against her growing powers. Part of the context is both her parents got empowered by the same controlled experiment then fell in love and had Charlie, which was not at all planned or expected by the Shop. She's like a mutation within a mutation.

[Sharpandpointies]

The scientist who created this story's psychic serum said she could at one point trigger a nuclear explosion with her mind. The military guy in charge of the Shop shady government agency responsible thought he was crazy and had him killed off, but later regretted the decision when their safety heat measures were falling short against her growing powers. Part of the context is both her parents got empowered by the same controlled experiment then fell in love and had Charlie, which was not at all planned or expected by the Shop. She's like a mutation within a mutation.

I have vague memories of that (Rainbird sitting down and chatting with the guy before killing him); thanks for the reminder.

And given Charlie's own thoughts on the matter, seems the guy was underestimating her future potential. O_o

[Jcogginsa]

Regarding Elsa's Speedfeats, in the first move she blocks a cross bow bolt, seemingly on instinct. That's probably her clearest speedfeat. Obviously not bullet timing there.

Now, in the sequel she manages to react to charges from the Water Horse

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YqIdhUhlU4

Depending on how generous you are, this could be interpreted as a very good speed feat.

At the climax of the movie, a dam breaks, and her kingdom is about to be blooded. Elsa is currently a fair distance away from the damn, on the other end of a sea. So think minimum, we're talking several miles away from the dam.

When the Damn breaks, Elsa is frozen solid. Then she unfreezes, and seemingly passes out, falling into some water where the horse is looking at her.

After that, Elsa manages wake up, get on the horse, and ride all the way back to her Kingdom, get ahead of he Flood, and create a big ice wall to stop it.



Not remotely as clear cut as the Crossbow feat, of course.

Less debatibly, she manages to deflect a peace of debris being flung around by a tornado

[Wildling]

Regarding Elsa's Speedfeats, in the first move she blocks a cross bow bolt, seemingly on instinct. That's probably her clearest speedfeat. Obviously not bullet timing there.

Now, in the sequel she manages to react to charges from the Water Horse

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YqIdhUhlU4

Depending on how generous you are, this could be interpreted as a very good speed feat.

At the climax of the movie, a dam breaks, and her kingdom is about to be blooded. Elsa is currently a fair distance away from the damn, on the other end of a sea. So think minimum, we're talking several miles away from the dam.

When the Damn breaks, Elsa is frozen solid. Then she unfreezes, and seemingly passes out, falling into some water where the horse is looking at her.

After that, Elsa manages wake up, get on the horse, and ride all the way back to her Kingdom, get ahead of he Flood, and create a big ice wall to stop it.



Not remotely as clear cut as the Crossbow feat, of course.

Less debatibly, she manages to deflect a peace of debris being flung around by a tornado

The scene cut off long enough that it wasn't clear to me if she woke up to get to and ride the horse or if the horse (which was the one seen awake) carried her to the surface to make her recover and carry her.

But it's not just Charlie's bullet reaction scene, which happened because Rainbird specifically wanted her to turn and look into his eyes before he shot her dead (a creepy hitman villain thing as I recall), but from earlier in the novel it's shown she has inherited some of her parents's psychic powers, even if lesser than her PK potential. At one point she perceived a squad of government assassins were going to arrive and raid the place she and her father were hiding in, before her father and the person sheltering them saw their cars arriving.

[Cleric of Hell’s Brigade]

Yeah, I feel like Charlie just cooks her on the speed draw.