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  1. #61
    Astonishing Member Tuck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TinkerSpider View Post
    Since it’s been long established that Peter doesn’t drink because it interferes with his spider-sense (just another example of how BND was grossly OOC) may I gently suggest if that is what you are looking for, perhaps this isn’t the character?
    The book has always been inconsistent with whether or not Peter is a teetotaler.

  2. #62
    Mighty Member Garlador's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jman27 View Post
    its a fact hell the new game is an example of this
    How many of US first got into Spider-Man as kids because of relationship problems and girlfriend breakups?

    Almost all of us saw a guy in a cool costume with cool powers swinging around punching a guy dressed like a rhino or bird in the head and thought it was awesome.

    We came for the superhero, stayed for the characters once we got to know them.
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  3. #63
    Really Feeling It! Kevinroc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marvelprince View Post
    Drunken blackout sex with someone he’s supposed to hate is the kind of hijinks I’m here for. And her having a crush on him was funny. It definitely got gross and weird at the end with Chameleon and the brother turning evil. But yeah I would take that over MJ worries about Peter coming home safe for the millionth time. Or teasing kids you know he’s not gonna have.
    Might I suggest reading Wolverine if that's the kind of character you want to read about.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tuck View Post
    The book has always been inconsistent with whether or not Peter is a teetotaler.
    Peter isn’t a teetotaler.

    But he doesn’t get drunk unless by accident, like in Web 38.

    It was pretty dang consistent until BND.
    “I always figured if I were a superhero, there’s no way on God's earth that I'm gonna pal around with some teenager."

    — Stan Lee

  5. #65
    Astonishing Member Tuck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TinkerSpider View Post
    Peter isn’t a teetotaler.
    Sometimes he is.

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tuck View Post
    Sometimes he is.
    Does he get drunk regularly? Do you read Spider-Man for drunken antics? That’s the point I was trying to make, sorry if I wasn’t clear!
    Last edited by TinkerSpider; 10-31-2023 at 12:10 PM.
    “I always figured if I were a superhero, there’s no way on God's earth that I'm gonna pal around with some teenager."

    — Stan Lee

  7. #67
    Mighty Member Garlador's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TinkerSpider View Post
    Does he get drunk regularly? Do you read Spider-Man for drunken antics? That’s the point I was trying to make, sorry if I wasn’t clear!
    As mentioned above, if you want beer-drinking drunken antics and irresponsible alcohol-fueled hookups, Wolverine might be a better fit for those stories.
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  8. #68
    Mighty Member marvelprince's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TinkerSpider View Post
    Since it’s been long established that Peter doesn’t drink because it interferes with his spider-sense (just another example of how BND was grossly OOC) may I gently suggest if that is what you are looking for, perhaps this isn’t the character?
    A guy has too much to drink at his friends wedding and hooks up with a guest is like the most typical young guy thing i can think of. Plus it was all explained in the context of the story. I can't believe there's still some people bothered by that. It was fun.

    Quote Originally Posted by TinkerSpider View Post
    And may I also gently suggest that “MJ pines by the window” is an example of sexist writing that was decried at the time and continues to be criticized even with the characters now single, and is more a function of the lack of creativity and imagination in the writing than anything intrinsically “wrong” with the character and/or the status?

    Fun fact: when Todd McFarlane was launching his Spider-Man title, he originally had MJ sitting at home and worrying. Editor Jim Salicrup threw it back to him and said “this is Mary Jane Watson! She doesn’t sit at home!”

    We need more Jim Salicrups in charge.
    Yeah her doing stuff like going out and partying when the city was in the chaos was much better.

    And I love all that those defending these awful depictions of MJ while missing the entire point. We have decades of these types of stories. I don't want them again. I wasn't a fan of that version of MJ under McFarlane, JMS, or even Slott.

    Quote Originally Posted by TinkerSpider View Post
    The Michelle/Chameleon scenes are outright problematic and would never be my choice no matter the alternative.
    Agreed that stuff was gross.

    Quote Originally Posted by Garlador View Post
    Reading this comment while I catch up with The Flash this year is sure something…



    MJ hasn’t been the “spend all my time worrying about Peter by the window” type in ages either. Because of, you know, character development.
    She hasn't spent all the time worrying bout him bout the window because you know, they split them up. But right up until the deal she was there in Avengers Tower worrying bout Peter. Sure it wasn't as annoying as she was in the 90s but its literally been decades of that. I will gladly take something else.

  9. #69
    Mighty Member marvelprince's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TinkerSpider View Post
    Peter isn’t a teetotaler.

    But he doesn’t get drunk unless by accident, like in Web 38.

    It was pretty dang consistent until BND.
    Just how he accidentally got drunk in BND. At a wedding. Where he was depressed.

  10. #70
    Mighty Member marvelprince's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevinroc View Post
    Might I suggest reading Wolverine if that's the kind of character you want to read about.
    No, because i like Peter and these occasional stories are fun with Peter strictly because its not something he does often. That what causes the drama and tension in the personal life. You enjoy Peter and MJ married obviously, I prefer a younger Peter trying to balance his personal life and superhero life while making some mistakes along the way. That doesn't make him Logan lol.

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by marvelprince View Post
    Just how he accidentally got drunk in BND. At a wedding. Where he was depressed.
    I mean I guess we consider these things differently because media has been ok with these kinds of depictions in the past. But sex where one person is blackout drunk and the other isn't is rapey. By my standards of consent it was just rape, (that's the premise here right? michelle wasn't blackout drunk and peter was. To the point where he couldnt even recognize who he was talking to before blacking out) and I feel like editorial agrees with me because they retconned it in the most heavy handed way imaginable. It's just the kind of rape that society casually ignores when it happens to a dude.

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by marvelprince View Post
    A guy has too much to drink at his friends wedding and hooks up with a guest is like the most typical young guy thing i can think of. Plus it was all explained in the context of the story. I can't believe there's still some people bothered by that. It was fun.
    Some people take a very different view of consent when alcohol is concerned, it’s antisocial behavior and perhaps shouldn’t be modeled by a character sold to kids and used as a Disney company mascot.

    Edit: What Moxxie517 said.

    And no one gets blackout drunk “accidentally.” In Web 39 he was tipsy after drinking a cup of punch that he didn’t know had been spiked, completely different situation.

    Yeah her doing stuff like going out and partying when the city was in the chaos was much better.
    So you don’t like it when MJ is passive and you don’t like it when she’s active?

    And I love all that those defending these awful depictions of MJ while missing the entire point. We have decades of these types of stories. I don't want them again. I wasn't a fan of that version of MJ under McFarlane, JMS, or even Slott.
    MJ depicted in character is “awful?”


    She hasn't spent all the time worrying bout him bout the window because you know, they split them up. But right up until the deal she was there in Avengers Tower worrying bout Peter. Sure it wasn't as annoying as she was in the 90s but its literally been decades of that. I will gladly take something else.
    It’s been literally more decades of a single Peter dating various women with the relationships either going absolutely nowhere or ending in tragedy.

    I agree the writing for MJ has been at times sexist, cliched and unoriginal.

    Like when Zeb Wells wrote her standing sadly by the window in Beyond and ASM #1.
    Last edited by TinkerSpider; 10-31-2023 at 01:15 PM.
    “I always figured if I were a superhero, there’s no way on God's earth that I'm gonna pal around with some teenager."

    — Stan Lee

  13. #73
    Astonishing Member Tuck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TinkerSpider View Post
    Some people take a very different view of consent when alcohol is concerned, it’s antisocial behavior and perhaps shouldn’t be modeled by a character sold to kids and used as a Disney company mascot.
    It shows the consequences of making a deal with the Devil.

  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tuck View Post
    It shows the consequences of making a deal with the Devil.
    That made me laugh out loud!
    “I always figured if I were a superhero, there’s no way on God's earth that I'm gonna pal around with some teenager."

    — Stan Lee

  15. #75
    Mighty Member Garlador's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marvelprince View Post
    A guy has too much to drink at his friends wedding and hooks up with a guest is like the most typical young guy thing i can think of. Plus it was all explained in the context of the story. I can't believe there's still some people bothered by that. It was fun.
    I will only say in my life experiences and talking with individuals who have been taken advantage of due to alcohol-driven parties with lack of agency and consent factoring into these encounters, I do not view it as “fun” and I continue to ask writers to do better and readers to expect better.

    It’s wrong.
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