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  1. #31
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    Personally, I don't think you need to go all in on retconning this run. Like pretending it never happened at all is better than forcing some retcon onto it that doesn't make sense the more you think about it. In terms of "fixing" MJ, all I want to see is good stories about MJ. They are not going to be tainted in my mind just because dead language happened. All that was OOC anyways. The most that I would want to see is a story at the beginning of the run arguing why PeterMJ should still get together in spite of everything that happened. Like it's been mentioned before that Aunt May should probably be pretty pissed about the whole Paul situation. Especially since she doesn't know that MJ was stuck in an alternate dimension for 4 years. So have a story where Aunt May is against the two of the coming back together because of all of that. And show how they work through that situation together. Or like I said before, just ignore dead language cause it sucks.

  2. #32
    Astonishing Member Tuck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Konnik92 View Post
    - they'll use Slott's "put the toys back in the box" strategy at the end if the run, getting Peter and Mary Jane back together the same way they seperated them (without logic), like nothing happened.
    This option is unsatisfying to us the fans, but I heard rumors that this is how it will go.
    In fairness, this is more or less what Spencer did at the beginning of his run.

    I thought it was a cheat, but most fans were happy to roll with it.

  3. #33
    Incredible Member Daibhidh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    It seems to be hinted that Paul's incapable of physical intimacy, so that revelation is probably coming.
    That would really not make the situation any better. It's rather icky to think it would.

    I agree MJ's situation was deeply unfair. But that's a different question from whether she did anything wrong, and is in need of being fixed.

    At this point, there are many different ways to resolve it. Paul's a secret bad guy! Paul and MJ realize that their relationship is no longer working. Paul dies (which would be something for something for MJ to process going forward.)
    None of those options make things any better. The third makes the damage irreparable and the first two make the damage worse.
    Petrus Maria Johannaque sunt nubendi

  4. #34
    Fantastic Member Spidey_Legend's Avatar
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    Ben is the easier to fix. Just said that current Ben is another clone who Miles Warren brainwash into thinking is Ben.


    Peter and MJ needs to just retcon all this run. The currents one are fakes construct created by Paul. Meanwhile the real ones are somewhere else not knowing what happened and happily together or something like that. Then they are rescued by the Fantastic Four.

  5. #35
    Incredible Member Daibhidh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tuck View Post
    In fairness, this is more or less what Spencer did at the beginning of his run.

    I thought it was a cheat, but most fans were happy to roll with it.
    I gather that a lot of fans at the time thought that Slott at the end of his run was teasing a reconciliation only to slam the door on it for good. Reading it with hindsight it seems to me that it set up Spencer's reconciliation: it had MJ and Peter acknowledge that they still had romantic feelings that they wanted to act on, and MJ just needed to work through her feelings about Peter putting himself in danger.
    Petrus Maria Johannaque sunt nubendi

  6. #36
    Really Feeling It! Kevinroc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daibhidh View Post
    I gather that a lot of fans at the time thought that Slott at the end of his run was teasing a reconciliation only to slam the door on it for good. Reading it with hindsight it seems to me that it set up Spencer's reconciliation: it had MJ and Peter acknowledge that they still had romantic feelings that they wanted to act on, and MJ just needed to work through her feelings about Peter putting himself in danger.
    Slott kept teasing a reconciliation over and over again before slamming the door on it each time. It got old.

    Quote Originally Posted by Konnik92 View Post
    They're totally gonna ignore the problems and not address them. Wells and Lowe are trying so hard to (and failing to) turn this around, telling us (the readers) that we're "not reading what they wrote the right way" or something like that. That what's happening with MJ is ok, one of life's challenges and telling that it resembles the novel "Dr. Zhivago", despite that there is no logic to her character here what-so-ever. That our feelings for Peter and Mary Jane is "strongly coloring our read on Paul", despite how we clearly see how he looks, acts and interracts with the characters. That they don't see anything wrong with the book this run and the decisions in it. How Lowe always replies with "Sorry you don't like the book. Have a nice day!" or something like that on Twitter (or "X" or whatever).

    Here's how I think things this will go:

    - they'll use Slott's "put the toys back in the box" strategy at the end if the run, getting Peter and Mary Jane back together the same way they seperated them (without logic), like nothing happened.
    This option is unsatisfying to us the fans, but I heard rumors that this is how it will go.

    - they leave their mess for the next writer to fix (if the Editorial allows it).
    Which means not only we have to wait for the current nightmare to end, but also wait if they'll fix this or we'll get another BND.

    So to summarize, Wells and Lowe don't seem to care what they do with the characters, they ignore the fans's negative responce and try to make them look ungrateful.
    They're gonna reconcile at the end of the run (or leave it ambiguous so the next creative team can do whatever they want) and it's going to be completely unsatisfying.

  7. #37
    Astonishing Member Tuck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevinroc View Post
    Slott kept teasing a reconciliation over and over again before slamming the door on it each time. It got old.
    What was it, twice? In ten years.

    That seems in line with the idea that they're drawn together, but the deal is keeping them apart.

    It also meant that there was room to tell stories without MJ hanging over everything. The current situation has it hanging over the story more than if the were still together, where MJ could be shipped off to a movie shoot for months if the writer wanted. I don't get the strategy here.

  8. #38
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tuck View Post
    What was it, twice? In ten years.

    That seems in line with the idea that they're drawn together, but the deal is keeping them apart.

    It also meant that there was room to tell stories without MJ hanging over everything. The current situation has it hanging over the story more than if the were still together, where MJ could be shipped off to a movie shoot for months if the writer wanted. I don't get the strategy here.
    Which is basically what Spencer did.

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    Which is basically what Spencer did.
    Was it Spencer or was it editorial trying to get a MJ title off the ground? We appear to be on the third attempt with Jackpot after Amazing Mary Jane and the two MJ and Black Cat titles.
    “I always figured if I were a superhero, there’s no way on God's earth that I'm gonna pal around with some teenager."

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  10. #40
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TinkerSpider View Post
    Was it Spencer or was it editorial trying to get a MJ title off the ground? We appear to be on the third attempt with Jackpot after Amazing Mary Jane and the two MJ and Black Cat titles.
    I think it was at least partially Spencer if only because I feel like MJ being gone was meant to be part of the Kindred storyline, hence Mysterio's involvement, and it lead to a far more natural and better written transition to an MJ spinoff.

  11. #41
    Uncanny Member Digifiend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malachi View Post
    Ben can be saved but I am more inclined to believe that Janine shouldn’t be. The tragedy of Ben being back to himself and Janine suffering demonic corruption because of what she did while Ben was sick is more potent than whatever Wells is trying to do. You also have a recurring foe for Ben, maybe even nemesis material. Or grey, anti-hero. The big thing is that what happens has consequences that are not easily dealt with.
    Janine's powers may be demonic in origin having been granted by the Goblin Queen, but she's not actually corrupted. She expressed remorse and tried to fix things after accidentally creating a werewolf while wearing a werewolf mask, and in her latest one-shot, she actually does heroic stuff wearing Captain America and Hulk masks. She's on the road to a heel-face turn. If Ben can be fixed, then Scarlet Spider and Hallows Eve can be a heroic battle couple.
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  12. #42
    "Emma is STILL right! Vegeta's Avatar
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    MJ and Ben are both easy fixes compared to other characters "done dirty" by Marvel. (Your Scarlet Witches, Hank Pyms, Cyclopses and whatnots) MJ in particular is simply just a reconciliation and reaffirmation of her love for Peter Parker. People just try to blow it out of proportion like it's "RUINED FOREVER."
    "The White Queen welcomes you, TO DIE!"

  13. #43
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    Ben is an easy fix, which is part of why Chasm is such a letdown of a character. Every time he appears there are like two different new ways to fix him that are just ignored.

    The MJ situation is much harder to deal with. I don't know what they were thinking have the woman whose Spider-Man's most iconic love interest just move on because he wasn't around and some dude named Paul was. They didn't sell it. They didn't sell MJ being cold to Peter. Now everyone looks bad and honestly I don't want to see another female character manipulated into a relationship by external forces but I also don't accept that MJ just gives up on Peter and gets with Paul cause he's the only dude around.

    Definitely a bad situation for a MJ

  14. #44
    Really Feeling It! Kevinroc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vegeta View Post
    MJ and Ben are both easy fixes compared to other characters "done dirty" by Marvel. (Your Scarlet Witches, Hank Pyms, Cyclopses and whatnots) MJ in particular is simply just a reconciliation and reaffirmation of her love for Peter Parker. People just try to blow it out of proportion like it's "RUINED FOREVER."
    If 26 had ended with that, I think people would have let this go. But this farce has gone on for too long for that to be a satisfying ending to this.

    (They're still gonna try to make that the conclusion of this and it will be completely unsatisfying. Future writers are going to have to retcon this whole thing.)

  15. #45

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vegeta View Post
    MJ and Ben are both easy fixes compared to other characters "done dirty" by Marvel. (Your Scarlet Witches, Hank Pyms, Cyclopses and whatnots) MJ in particular is simply just a reconciliation and reaffirmation of her love for Peter Parker. People just try to blow it out of proportion like it's "RUINED FOREVER."
    The problem with MJ for me has less to do with whether MJ would get back together with Peter and more to do with why Peter would get back together with someone who treated him this way. IMO he would look pretty bad if he welcomed her back with open arms after being left like that.

    Just retcon Ben into Spidercide pretending to be Ben. Even if this means the real Ben is still dead it would be an improvement.

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