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  1. #16
    Ultimate Member Phoenixx9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mercury View Post
    Jean is surrounded by her various facets—Marvel Girl, time-displaced teenage Jean, Jean before she piloted the shuttle to safety, Dark Phoenix, Madelyne Pryor, Jean during her New X-Men and X-Men Red days, et al.—all of them brimming with fury and desperate to remind her that she, along with everyone else, is dead. Marvel Girl says to her, “And it’s your fault. Or that’s what you keep telling yourself.” Jean responds, “It isn’t fair. I tried…so hard.” New X-Men Jean retorts, “Life isn’t fair. Why should death be? And, fair or not, you’re dead!”



    As Jean ascends toward an ethereal light, her facets struggling to pull her back down, she responds, “No. Not quite. Not permanently. Maybe…” Suddenly, she winces as if in pain, “Why are you all so angry? It can’t be just because we’re dead. We’ve been dead before.” She turns to see herself as she was right before she piloted the shuttle. Shuttle Jean asks, “Don’t you get it? We’re figments of your past. Fragments of your nightmares.” Madelyne continues, “Products of imaginary stories you’ve been telling yourself. None of this is real. But then…I was never real.”

    Phoenix, in all of its fiery glory, ascends, with Jean positioned at its heart, flanked by Madelyne and Shuttle Jean, or really, Marvel Girl. “Except here,” Phoenix clarifies. “In the White Hot Room, everything is real…in its own way.” Jean asks, “What do you mean?” Time-displaced teenage Jean responds, “You’re joking, right? I saw a dozen realities. And my gut said—forget them all!” She goes on to detail how Jean preventing her from erasing the X-Men’s memories of the future eventually caused everyone’s deaths. “You should have trusted me! You’re mad at yourself,” she exclaims before overwhelming Jean with Phoenix fire.

    Next, Marvel Girl approaches Jean. “Why did you force that nightmare on me,” she asks. “Scott dead. Wolverine dead.” Jean responds, “[I thought] Maybe it would have been better if someone else was in charge. Maybe it wasn’t all up to me.” Marvel Girl retorts, “Whereas, in reality, the Phoenix had hidden your body, and while you healed, it took on your aspect…until your true will asserted itself and stopped it. You died, of course…But that wasn’t the end…All was restored. How is that terrible?” Jean responds, “Because of what came afterward! Impulsive arrogance didn’t work. So I tried logic.” Now, Jean/Phoenix responds, “And set them up to die. Not everyone—just your dearest loves…”

    Jean, in the midst of attacking and before replying to Jean/Phoenix, is approached by Madelyne, who continues, “From that perspective, the reality was so much kinder…to you, anyway. Surely you haven’t forgotten about me, as much as you all would rather?” Jean responds, “Maddie. Madelyne Summers. Scott’s wife. My clone.” Madelyne continues, “Mr. Sinister’s broodmare. Mother of the Mutant Nathan Christopher renamed Cable.” Madelyne then describes how she was “given free reign over a techno-organically transformed world” in Jean’s previously created alternate reality. She goes on to note that Jean rejecting Phoenix caused both her initial emergence in the current continuity and the aforementioned alternate reality’s destruction.

    Suddenly, Jean manifests a pink Phoenix raptor, her words outlined in red and awash in gold just like Phoenix’s throughout this and previous issues. She says, “So now you’re saying I should have made a different choice? Accepted the Dark Phoenix, tainted as it was, with the deaths of millions…because that would have spared you? It would have cut the drama. But would you have been better off? Lacking power from any source…never alive? …Never feeling? No Scott? No baby Nathan? No kingdom to rule in Hell?” Madelyne responds, “Now you’re getting it. We have fine minds, as minds go. But that’s not our greatest asset. Heart. Depth of feeling. That’s what called the Phoenix to us. Love is what you’re all about. I have…other priorities.” Jean interrupts, “Inferno happened. For better or worse.” Madelyne, naked, collapses in Jean’s arms. Jean continues, “And it’s not the worst thing we’ve had to face. Life is a process, however you’re created. We all learn…even you. Even me,” Jean says, cradling Madelyne.

    [IMG][/IMG]

    Once again, Phoenix rises and speaks directly to Jean. “That’s better. You’ve been creating worlds to prove you had no choice. Nightmare tales about how we—you and I—brought death and destruction. How you were damned if you did. Damned if you didn’t. All paths lead to death. Is this really the story you wanted to tell yourself? Your dreams, so much more terrible than even this reality.”

    Suddenly, Jean’s various facets point out, “You’re starting to awaken, aren’t you? You’re starting to remember.” Jean recounts the events of the Hellfire Gala, how Orchis attacked, and how she tried to protect and save all mutants. And how she failed. “Why…didn’t you come to me,” Jean asks Phoenix, now appearing as a small raptor in the palm of her hand. “How could I? I’m as dead now as you are. Like you, I exist only here—a nexus between all Phoenix hosts and our eternal flame. I’m bits and pieces. Inactive. The White Hot Room is the heart of the Phoenix, and it is broken. Why do you think I encouraged those terrible images where, when you changed things, everything went wrong? What did you think I was trying to tell you?”

    Jean responds, “My instinctive choices were right. My impulse was true.” Phoenix continues, “You did all you could…and more. But there were other forces at play. Even you, powerful though you are, can’t control everything.” Jean responds, “And…no matter what choices we make, in the end, death claims us all? But not us. At least, not yet. Not completely.” The small Phoenix raptor takes flight and circles around Jean, who continues, “We’re not alone here. And there’s one more thing we can do. Shall we do it together,” Jean asks as the small Phoenix raptor lands on her hand, their energies co-mingling.

    Suddenly, Jean sees Apocalypse confronting and proclaiming to Hope and Exodus, “Now you know. You are the mutant chalice where the future will be wrought. You must pass—or else all ends.” Jean says to herself and Phoenix, “Apocalypse. Threatening someone smaller than himself. Somehow that figures. Look at me,” she says, taking stock of her chained body. “I’m a mess. Hardly alive—probably not even that for long. And poor Hope…it’s up to her now. Welcome to the White Hot Room.” Hope says to Exodus, “Okay, Exodus. We’re in the White Hot Room. What does that mean?” Exodus responds, “It is a higher realm. Spiritual. I have often thought it akin to the Tiphareth, from the Kabbalah.” Jean notes, “Not bad. Sounds like Exodus knows his stuff. Hope’s basic power is to mimic the abilities of those near her. There may be something we can do…together. One last gambit.”

    Jean awakens Phoenix’s powers within her chained body, and suddenly, Hope manifests Phoenix wings and a flaming sword. Chained Jean says, “Hope…wings of fire. Phoenix fire. Blinding…”

    As Jean observes Hope, Exodus, Apocalypse, and her chained self, Phoenix, perched on her hand, asks her, “Did it work?” Jean responds, “No longer am I the woman you knew? I am fire and life incarnate? Now and forever—I am Phoenix? Who knows? Maybe. That or…something else. At least we did no harm.” Phoenix knowingly retorts, “So sure of yourself. So arrogant,” as if privately noting something that should be obvious to Jean by now.

    Jean responds, “Just following my gut. You know this isn’t over. Not for them. Not for us. But what comes next—be it life or death—we face it together.”



    The End?
    I this all shows and means that Jean needs to 1000% fully acknowledge, accept and adhere that she is indeed The Phoenix and fully merge/bond/associate with the PF Now and Forever!

    Oh, and the art is Awesome!
    [Quote Originally Posted by Thor-El 10-15-2020 12:32 PM]

    "Jason Aaron should know there is already a winner of the Phoenix Force and his name is Phoenixx9."


    Like a Red Dragon, The Phoenix shall Soar in 2024!

  2. #17
    Jean Grey Scholar Mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jackraow21 View Post
    I'm confused about where this leaves Jean. And Hope. So... Hope has the power of the Phoenix now and Jean is still in the WHR?
    I think it's clear, especially considering the final page of the issue, that Jean and Phoenix are still bound together, both transcendentally and physically. All she did was activate her Phoenix abilities to the degree necessary to allow Hope to mimic them. And based on Phoenix’s reaction to that choice, she may have made another mistake.
    Jean Grey in the words of Walt Whitman, from his masterpiece Leaves of Grass, "Song of Myself" (51 and 52):

    "Do I contradict myself? Very well then I contradict myself, (I am large, I contain multitudes.)"

    "Failing to fetch me at first keep encouraged, Missing me one place search another, I stop somewhere waiting for you."

  3. #18
    Judgement Awaits LordAllMIghty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tenebrae View Post
    This mini is a very good example of, "it could have been an email". A lot of filler for not a lot of substance. A one shot or issues in an ongoing would have served it better.
    As much as I love Jean, I was thinking the same thing.

    This could have been a backup story in the regular x titles
    Some of us wait, some of us act.

  4. #19
    Spectacular Member SugarMan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jackraow21 View Post
    I'm confused about where this leaves Jean. And Hope. So... Hope has the power of the Phoenix now and Jean is still in the WHR?
    I thought it was pretty clear, especially with Jean stating so. Hope is “mimicking” the Phoenix abilities of Jean. That’s why she awakened it within herself.

    Also, they stated Jean is awoke, so she’s either telling Hope what to do, or observing. We will see in Immortal!

  5. #20
    Incredible Member The Thunderbird's Avatar
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    Historically, I've always been one to prefer Jean as just herself rather than Jean being in unison with the Phoenix. However I did find the breakup between Jean and Phoenix in Phoenix: Resurrection to be quite sad. So it's pretty nice to see them reconcile. I really liked the art for the whole mini. Bernard perfectly captured Jean's angst, beauty, and love.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mercury View Post
    I think it's clear, especially considering the final page of the issue, that Jean and Phoenix are still bound together, both transcendentally and physically. All she did was activate her Phoenix abilities to the degree necessary to allow Hope to mimic them. And based on Phoenix’s reaction to that choice, she may have made another mistake.
    I'm guessing that this has something to do with Hope having thanked a certain red-skinned female Sinister perhaps?

  6. #21
    Invincible Member Havok83's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jackraow21 View Post
    I'm confused about where this leaves Jean. And Hope. So... Hope has the power of the Phoenix now and Jean is still in the WHR?
    I think thats the point which is why it ended on a question mark. This mini really just setup what Gillen is writing and we will have to wait for him to complete this story

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jackraow21 View Post
    I'm confused about where this leaves Jean. And Hope. So... Hope has the power of the Phoenix now and Jean is still in the WHR?
    Quote Originally Posted by Del torro View Post
    This whole series was disappointing
    Quote Originally Posted by PhoenixStudies View Post
    We won't know for sure until next week's Immortal, but in this issue Jean says Hope's base power is to mimic so Jean and the Phoenix put some phoenix flame into Jean who is in the desert with Hope and Exodus. They do this so that Hope can mimic Jean and fight the representation of Apocalypse. The Phoenix asks Jean if it worked and Jeans like dunno and they walk off into the white hot ether.

    Its kinda trippy in the way that the best Jean/Phoenix stories are, imho.

    Jean is in two places and two forms simultaneously. We see Jean with the phoenix on her arm touch Jean (the part of her that is in the dessert and in chains) with flame, so that Hope can use the power. Hope doesn't seem to manifest the whole phoenix, just fire wings and a fire sword. The Phoenix in full bird form remains with Jean.

    They are all still in the White Hot Room.

    Will Jean integrate herself and wake up from her stupor? Will she resurrect?

    I bet Hope will defeat Apocalypse but Jean will have to free them from the White Hot Room.
    Hmm... I don't know because I haven't read the issue yet but from the comments, I get the feeling no one is planning on bringing Jean Grey back as long as Hope is around to take her side of the bed with Scott.

  8. #23
    Sarveśām Svastir Bhavatu Devaishwarya's Avatar
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    Wait! What TAF? You do know Hope is still a teenager, right? You know this right?

    From everything leading up to now, the solicits and covers we've seen, even without reading this issue (which you should have before making any kind of statement)...How do you get "the feeling" that Jean isn't coming back?

    Anywho...

    Jean is Phoenix once again. Okies.
    I just hope whoever writes them going forward actually writes new and interesting stories of Jean actually using the PF for great good...let's see what she can do with it having full control...instead of re-re-re-retreading the same old boring *overwhelming power-go crazy-death!" Phoenix story tropes.
    Last edited by Devaishwarya; 11-15-2023 at 12:51 PM.
    Lord Ewing *Praise His name! Uplift Him in song!* Your divine works will be remembered and glorified in worship for all eternity. Amen!

  9. #24
    Incredible Member Hakka84's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mercury View Post
    My goddess, this page is wonderful. The lines, the colours, Jean's poses. The way the small phoenix leans toward Jean's lips/face.
    First Warren in Dark X-Men #1, and then Genis-Vell in Captain Marvel #1. Seriously, Marvel?!
    Avatar reflecting my mood. I couldn't stand the sunny high-flying Angel one anymore.

  10. #25
    Extraordinary Member Uncanny X-Man's Avatar
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    I'm torn. I thought the mini was a fine character study on Jean but this last issue suffered by not being able to move the plot forward.

    Not Simonson's fault at all I suspect, I'm sure they wanted to keep the meaty parts for Immortal X-Men but when you basically have 20 pages that could be summarized with a single line, it's hard to justify the price of admission.

  11. #26
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    So, overall, what actually happened in this series? Why did Jean, who is not fire and not life incarnate (due to editorial shippers), and the Phoenix Force decide to become buddy cops(?) at the end randomly?

  12. #27
    Incredible Member ermac's Avatar
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    I miss Tom Taylor's Jean from X-Men Red.

  13. #28
    Invincible Member Havok83's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Micabe View Post
    Hmm... I don't know because I haven't read the issue yet but from the comments, I get the feeling no one is planning on bringing Jean Grey back as long as Hope is around to take her side of the bed with Scott.
    Hope's his granddaughter. Just no

  14. #29
    Jean Grey Scholar Mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PhoenixStudies View Post
    We won't know for sure until next week's Immortal, but in this issue Jean says Hope's base power is to mimic so Jean and the Phoenix put some phoenix flame into Jean who is in the desert with Hope and Exodus. They do this so that Hope can mimic Jean and fight the representation of Apocalypse. The Phoenix asks Jean if it worked and Jeans like dunno and they walk off into the white hot ether. Its kinda trippy in the way that the best Jean/Phoenix stories are, imho.

    Jean is in two places and two forms simultaneously. We see Jean with the phoenix on her arm touch Jean (the part of her that is in the dessert and in chains) with flame, so that Hope can use the power. Hope doesn't seem to manifest the whole phoenix, just fire wings and a fire sword. The Phoenix in full bird form remains with Jean. They are all still in the White Hot Room.

    Will Jean integrate herself and wake up from her stupor? Will she resurrect?

    I bet Hope will defeat Apocalypse but Jean will have to free them from the White Hot Room.
    I find it puzzling that some fans still question what is being re-established in this mini, which only underscores what Gillen re-established during Judgment Day and, along with Aaron, Pak, Morrison, Seagle, et al., during AvX and before that: Jean and Phoenix are connected on a level that is beyond comprehension. She transcends all Phoenix hosts because she is Phoenix. I mean, isn't it perfect how Jean facilitates Hope mimicking her abilities in Jean Grey #4 (2023) in much the same way she facilitated her doing so in AvX #12 (2012)? Again, the parallels. 🤌🏻





    Jean Grey in the words of Walt Whitman, from his masterpiece Leaves of Grass, "Song of Myself" (51 and 52):

    "Do I contradict myself? Very well then I contradict myself, (I am large, I contain multitudes.)"

    "Failing to fetch me at first keep encouraged, Missing me one place search another, I stop somewhere waiting for you."

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Havok83 View Post
    Hope's his granddaughter. Just no
    Hope no biological Grey/Summers nor do I recall her ever being legally adopted by one...

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