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  1. #196
    Astonishing Member Mercwmouth12's Avatar
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    Also have a couple of questions for you
    Why not do a sub stack like blog like Tom does every week?

    Second would you ever consider creator own work\charters away from DC and Marvel?

  2. #197
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mercwmouth12 View Post
    Also have a couple of questions for you
    Why not do a sub stack like blog like Tom does every week?

    Second would you ever consider creator own work\charters away from DC and Marvel?
    If you're speaking of Tom Brevoort, I'm betting he wouldn't be doing that blog every week if he had some books to write...lol!

  3. #198
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mercwmouth12 View Post
    Also have a couple of questions for you
    Why not do a sub stack like blog like Tom does every week?
    Zero interest.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mercwmouth12 View Post
    Second would you ever consider creator own work\charters away from DC and Marvel?
    Yep. Have been approached numerous times. Have some concepts worked out. It's really all a matter of time.
    Writing is work. And there are only so many hours a day I can work-- and feel good about the work-- without burning out.
    And I have the wonderful problem of Marvel providing me with all the work I *can* handle. Which comfortably comes out to 2 plots + 2 scripts a month-- but I can do more for short stretches.

    And, sometimes, Marvel needs me to go way past that. When that happens-- usually when a FCBD or Point One issue has been added to the schedule, or too many books in a row go to double or triple size-- I call Chris Gage and ask if he can help scripting over my plots. I've been trying to pull back on that though, and have only co-written with Chris twice now in the past 3+ years (Once for SPIDER-MAN #10, because SUPERIOR#1 and SPIDER-BOY #1 had their page counts pushed up to 30 pages each-- AND I'd agreed to do a short story for MARVEL AGE #1000. And the other time, when it would have felt weird to do the SUPERIOR SPIDER-MAN RETURNS jam issue with Stegman, Ramos, and Camuncoli... and *not* include Christos as well.)

    But this past year I proved to myself that I *can* carve out extra room in my schedule in order to do the 58 page DOCTOR WHO: ONCE UPON A TIME LORD special. So with *that* in mind, I'm hoping I can employ that same amount of time, planning, and passion into some creator owned projects as well!
    Last edited by Dan Slott; 11-29-2023 at 07:07 PM.

  4. #199
    Spectacular Member Ubauba01's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Slott View Post
    .
    I have a question, in Earth-616 Beta, will Peter Palmer always remain 15? Will he just never grow up, like Peter Pan?

    Since this universe is heavily based on continuity errors made in the Lee-Ditko run, does the existence of 616 Beta retcon those original errors to be 616 Beta momentarily bleeding into the regular Earth-616?

    http://ludwig.squarespace.com/spider...er-palmer.html

    In those panels in the posted link, was the 616 universe canonically merged with the 616 Beta universe basically?
    Last edited by Ubauba01; 12-04-2023 at 09:20 AM.

  5. #200
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ubauba01 View Post
    I have a question, in Earth-616 Beta, will Peter Palmer always remain 15? Will he just never grow up, like Peter Pan?
    That is a very interesting question. I have no real answer for it... and that's kinda neat.
    Because right now, until we revisit that character and their set up again, the answer would be that it's possible. We won't know until another creative team chooses to go back and see. Maybe that's the way it is, maybe it's something else neither of us has considered. In the end, you hope the payoff to that setup is "Whatever will lead to the most interesting story."

  6. #201
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    A great way for internet conspiracies to spread is when you say something VERY specific, when you parse something with incredibly precise language... and then people paraphrase you online and judge you on that new-- and entirely incorrect-- phrasing.

    I've recently said that:

    In 2022, the first issue of Mark Bagley and my SPIDER-MAN book was Marvel's best selling issue in units.

    And in 2023, the first issue of SPIDER-BOY has been Marvel's best selling issue so far.

    Multiple people have now incorrectly repeated that I said SPIDER-MAN #1 was the best selling comic of 2022.
    And that SPIDER-BOY #1 was the best selling comic of 2023.

    Both of these statements have been called out as lies and untruths. And THOSE statements are. But they are NOT what I have said.

    In 2022, SPIDER-MAN #1 was Marvel's best selling issue in units.

    This is 100% true.

    It performed this way for MARVEL.
    Did a DC or IMAGE book outsell it for units? Possibly. I don't know.
    Did any other Marvel issue outsell it for units in 2022? No.

    Also, I never even said it was Marvel's best selling issue for 2022.
    I specifically said it was Marvel's best selling issue in units.
    There are two way we can say an issue was the best selling for the year: in dollars and/or units.
    In dollars, SPIDER-MAN #1 was not the best selling issue for 2022.
    That honor went to an issue of AMAZING SPIDER-MAN.
    (SPIDER-MAN #1 was Marvel's 2nd best selling issue for 2022 in dollars. Which is still a pretty impressive feat!)
    When it came to unit sales, SPIDER-MAN #1 had a lower price point than that issue of ASM, which was how it could sell #1 in units, but #2 in dollars.

    So to sum up, it is 100% true that SPIDER-MAN #1 was Marvel's best selling issue in units for 2022.

    Meanwhile...

    SPIDER-BOY #1 is the best selling comic for Marvel in 2023 so far.
    By now you've seen that it's the best selling comic in November for both units and dollars.
    As for it being the best selling comic for Marvel in 2023, that is something Marvel's Editor In Chief has said, on the record, in an interview at Lucca.
    https://www.scifinow.co.uk/exclusive...uing-a-legacy/

    End of the day, you can believe what you want to believe, it doesn't change the facts. ;-)

  7. #202
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    "How did the rest of the SPIDER-MAN run do?"

    Great! It was a Spider-Man satellite title where every issue was in the Top 25.
    (Don't take my word for it, go over to ICV2 and check out the Top 50 comics from Oct 22 to Sep 23.)

    Not only that, it was a Top 25 comic where almost half of the run sold out and went back to press for 2nd (and sometimes 3rd) printings.

    There was a decision to end the book and split it into two titles: SPIDER-BOY and SUPERIOR SPIDER-MAN.

    One of those titles debuted with Marvel's best selling single issue of the year.

    The other title had its one-shot special land in the Top 10.

    And its 1st issue, by the exact same SPIDER-MAN creative team, also launched in the Top 10.

    And all three issues (SPIDER-BOY #1, SUPERIOR SPIDER-MAN RETURNS #1, and SUPERIOR SPIDER-MAN #1) are all going back to press for 2nd printings.

    Something tells me that Marvel is happy with their decision.
    Last edited by Dan Slott; 12-10-2023 at 10:46 AM.

  8. #203
    Ultimate Member WebLurker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Slott View Post
    In 2022, the first issue of Mark Bagley and my SPIDER-MAN book was Marvel's best selling issue in units.
    Dumb question, but what does "units" mean in this context and is the sales rate referring to product Marvel sells to stores or what the customers buy at the end of the line?
    Doctor Strange: "You are the right person to replace Logan."
    X-23: "I know there are people who disapprove... Guys on the Internet mainly."
    (All-New Wolverine #4)

  9. #204
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    Units is number of units sold.
    Dollars is number of dollars made in total.
    So... ASM #700 was (when it came out) the most profitable comic of this century, but that was because of a perfect storm of both a crazy number of units sold and a very high price point.

    The overall number of units is the number of units sold to retailers.

    But, when you're looking at the figures from ICV2 (for example), those numbers are Point of Sale. So that would be when the person at the register scans the UPC code and rings the customer up. So those ICV2 numbers would be units sold to customers. (Here's what ICV2 says about their sales numbers, "These sales rankings represent sales to consumers by comic stores during the period.")
    Last edited by Dan Slott; 12-10-2023 at 12:39 PM.

  10. #205
    Ultimate Member Mister Mets's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WebLurker View Post
    Dumb question, but what does "units" mean in this context and is the sales rate referring to product Marvel sells to stores or what the customers buy at the end of the line?
    "Units" would be number of copies sold.

    If Comic A sells 100,000 issues and has a cover price of $4, while Comic B sells 90,000 copies with a cover price of $5, there are two ways to consider which sold better.
    By Unit sales, Comic A sold better.
    By dollar sales, Comic B did better, because total sales are $450,000 rather than $400,000.
    Sincerely,
    Thomas Mets

  11. #206
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    Quote Originally Posted by WebLurker View Post
    Dumb question, but what does "units" mean in this context and is the sales rate referring to product Marvel sells to stores or what the customers buy at the end of the line?
    The numbers that people typically point to are the icv2 numbers which according to their own description:

    These are unit and dollar sales rankings based on sales tracked at point-of-sale by the ComicHub system at stores selling American comics around the world. During the period for which these reports were generated, there were over 125 stores using the ComicHub system. As this is a small, non-random sample of over 3,000 stores selling American comics worldwide, these rankings may not be typical for all stores, but do represent a variety of locations and store emphases.

    This data was collected based on a four-week month, from October 29 to December 2, 2023. These sales rankings represent sales to consumers by comic stores during the period. We’re reporting the Top 50 Comics on the public site, and the Top 200 Comics on the Pro site.
    So units in this context refers to the number of comics sold to customers through the ComicsHub system. And dollars basically refers to (unit #)*(price) for all sales through the comicshub system.

    How many customers use comicshub is unknown as far as I know. It's about 125 stores out of a sample of a couple thousand. But not all stores are going to have the same amount of customers.

    The other thing to keep in mind is that since this is a non-random sample whose customers share a specific behavior (using comicshub) it's difficult to use these numbers to extrapolate behavior for the market as a whole. (The best analogy I could use would be if you used vote by mail numbers to project the voting behavior of the entire population) So take them with a grain of salt.

    But these numbers are really the only insight that we have into how many of each book is being sold. And when C.B. calls spider-boy the highest selling comic of the year, I imagine that he's not using icv2 numbers but marvels own internal numbers.
    Last edited by Moxxi517; 12-10-2023 at 02:07 PM.

  12. #207
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moxxi517 View Post
    And when C.B. calls spider-boy the highest selling comic of the year, I imagine that he's not using icv2 numbers but marvels own internal numbers.
    Correct.

    It's frustrating to me that the numbers aren't available to the public-- at least in the way there were before when practically all the companies were using Diamond.

    I've seen the numbers for the Top 25 best performing issues for Marvel for 2022.
    An issue of ASM was in the #1 spot for dollars.
    SPIDER-MAN #1 was in the #1 spot for units, and the #2 spot for dollars.

    Ever since the numbers stopped being available to the public, internet speculation and assumptions have run rampant with personal anecdotes, personal speculation, and (basically) personal tastes of *some* disgruntled fans taking the place of straight forward data. And when those opinions get reflected back in echo chambers a few hundred strong, they create an alt-reality that bares no resemblance to actual reality.

    There's an online world where Nick Lowe is going to be "fired any second now" and where Zeb Wells is going to be yanked off ASM. But in the REAL world, 24 of those Top 25 issues of 2022 came out of Nick Lowe's office and/or the unit he personally oversees. 24 issues made up of mostly Zeb Wells issues of ASM, with some SPIDER-MAN, MILES MORALES, and EDGE OF SPIDER-VERSE in there too. Nick Lowe edited or oversaw 24 out of 25 of Marvel's best-selling issues last year. No company in the world-- or at least ones interested in making a profit-- would ever think of firing that person. When toxic fans attack him on social media and he doesn't respond-- it's because he doesn't have to. He's putting out books he cares about, they're dominating Marvel's charts, and he likes the people he's working with.

    Me? I'm far more salty. And it makes me feel better to come on here and vent-- using facts and (carefully worded) truths.

    Some of my most hardcore haters say I use this forum thread to puff myself up and brag. If that's the case, then here's something that flies in the face of that: Zeb Well's ASM issues dominated that chart in a way my issues never did. That chart of best selling issues of 2022 was almost a solid wall of Zeb Well's ASM. I've been in those summits for almost 20 years. I have never seen anyone pull off that kind of streak. Not Bendis, Brubaker, Hickman, and definitely not me. And those other guys have the excuse that their books came out once a month, and that a writer on a book like ASM gets to have more swings at bat. So that's an excuse that they have and that I definitely DON'T. People can make a bazillion posts online about how "poorly" ASM is doing in their specific shop, but those posts are just empty words on a screen compared to the bottom line numbers that Marvel (a company that likes selling actual comics in the real world) gets to see each and every month. Zeb is safe as houses on this title.

    I guess I post here every now and then because of how frustrated I get between the INSANE disparity between the online fictions that are presented AS facts... and the truth of things in the real world.

    A lot of this started for me during the early days of BND. There was a very toxic fan that kept posting a completely bogus "sales chart" mapping how Post OMD comics were faring against how Pre OMD comics performed. This chart frequently showed up on message boards, FB, and other sites as PROOF that the BND comics were failing.

    As someone who saw the actual numbers, these charts were bizarre to me. They bore no relation to reality at all. When confronted about this, the toxic fan said that his charts were accurate because he'd devised his OWN metric for how the books should be counted. Since ASM was coming out three times a month, he was combining the sales and rankings of ASM coming up with an average to represent those issues-- and comparing them against the single sales point of the Pre-OMD issues.

    Now if that were the case, that would still be a flawed system. Averaging three issues together would always mean that the two lower ranking books would drag down the ranking of the highest selling issue. That would make it impossible for BND to ever get credit for being the highest selling comic-- even if that was the case.

    But it gets worse. Because that chart didn't even accurately portray the sales the way the toxic fan was describing them. When confronted about THAT, he said that the program he was using to make the chart couldn't average three numbers together. He could only input two figures to be averaged. So guess what he did. He picked the two LOWEST selling issues per month and THREW OUT the HIGHEST selling issue. He chucked a third of the data. And not just any data, the highest data. That's crazy.

    A Pre-OMD Spider-Man creator found the chart and proudly displayed it on their FB page. The editor of BND confronted that creator on their page and asked them what it was that they thought they were doing, and how unprofessional it was of them to other creators. The creator said they were just stating facts. I talked to them in DMs and showed them all the data the chart's creator had thrown out, and the posts where the chart's creator admitted to the flawed way they presented the data. When that creator saw that, they immediately took their post down.

    When the nonsense people post online so diverges from the facts, that's what annoys me so much. Not any hypothetical fantasies fans indulge in about what they believe is going on behind the scenes. It pretty much always comes down to this: the complete and utter BS some toxic fans like to spread that is wildly different from the truth.
    Last edited by Dan Slott; 12-12-2023 at 11:25 AM.

  13. #208
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    Every good or bad take is dependent on if the poster is hating on a book or excited about it.

    For example, I've seen the same posters say that a large number of variant covers on a book means ONE thing if it's a book they hate and the exact OPPOSITE if it's a book they're excited about:

    "Marvel must not have a lot of faith in (name of book) because they've made so many variants for it."

    and

    "Marvel must have a lot of faith in (name of book) because they're making so many variants for it."

  14. #209
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    Watching some people trying to navigate an earlier post and trip over themselves because they're failing to grasp the difference between a book's rankings and a book's sales.

    In 2022, the overwhelming majority of Marvel's Top 25 best selling single issues were Zeb's ASM issues. That's a fact. This isn't me claiming that the sky is pink with polka dots. This is me saying something that just IS. This is a thing. I also said that that what Zeb achieved is something incredible and something I never came close to doing. Also true. Even in years where my run of ASM (or Superior) did phenomenally well, it didn't sweep the way Zeb's run has been sweeping. In my time you'd see Avengers books, X-books, Cosmic books, licensed books (like Star Wars) all mixed in. 2022 was a massive year for Zeb's ASM-- in a massive block.

    But it's possible for someone to sweep, to practically run the board, and not take out best-selling records from previous years. You get that, right? There's a difference between rankings in one year and the sales of another year.

    It's weird that you can spit facts, and someone out there will try to find a lie where there is none. Where someone will bend themselves into a pretzel and make all kinds of false assumptions and make-believe reasons that things can't be any other way then the way they're imagining a situation to be.

  15. #210
    Fantastic Member Kurus's Avatar
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    Personally, I feel anyone bragging about sales figures in this industry is a least a little delusional. It’s like bragging about being the biggest fish in a very small pond. Think about how many people have seen movies like Avengers: Endgame or played the insomniac Spider-Man games. If comics could sell a tenth of those numbers, it be a massive success, the kind of sales this industry hasn’t seen since the early nineties. But both marvel and dc have consistently failed to capitalize on the superhero movie boom.

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