X-Men Blue: Origins synopsis and spoilers

[Icefanatic]

Claremont wasn’t allowed to do the Destiny and Mystique parental lineage story because the Comics Code Authority rules at that time forbade the explicit portrayal of LGBT characters. Not to mention Jim Shooter’s editorial mandate that gay characters weren’t allowed to be portrayed on the page. I thought this was common knowledge.

As I pointed out in my earlier post, Nightmare was the original 'plan' for the father. There were then other plans that never came together.

Uncanny X-Men Annual #4 (1980), Kurt celebrates his 21th birthday. Margali Szardos uses the Eye of Agamotto from Dr. Strange and the images and captions reveal:

“…the infant Kurt Wagner — barely an hour old — found beside his dying mother, taken in by the Gypsy Witch-Queen Margali Szardos, and raised as one of her own.”

Uncanny X-Men #142 (1981), Nightcrawler met Mystique, and noted she had a physical resemblance to him. her “Who are you?!” he asked and she replies “Ask… your mother, Margali Szardos. Who would better know than — she?”.

Uncanny X-Men #170 (Jun 83), captions for a dream sequence where Mystique is getting hunted by Lady Jean Grey and Sir Jason Wyngarde, note it to be occurring in: “1783, the place England, their quarry a woman who will not be born for another 170 years”, Meaning Mystique was born in 1953, 30 years before the story’s original setting.

Along the way, CC brought in the demon-sorcerer of Limbo, Belasco, as a foil for the X-Men. Belasco had pointy ears like Nightmare, ruled a demonic dimension(Limbo), and even had a forked, prehensile tail just like Nightcrawler. Belasco made a deal with his “Elder Gods”(the N’Garai) for immortality on the basis he would return to earth and become the “Father” of a new race of Earth-Born Demons. In the Magik Limited series from 1983–1984, Kurt was the X-Man who fell most under Belasco’s control, even becoming his “familiar”. It seemed their might be a connection between them...

Uncanny X-Men #177 (Jan 84) Kurt is beginning to question Margali’s account of him as a foundling. When he asks his girlfriend Amanda Sefton“Who am I…? Where do I come from?! What is my real family?” she responds “I know what Mom told me — she found you, new-born and barely alive, in a roadside shelter in the Black Forest. A man — your father, I guess — lay outside…”

Also in Uncanny X-Men #177, Mystique kills six of the seven X-Men robot sims of the X-Men practicing for an attempt to get Rogue back to her and Irene, she hesitates when it comes to the robot Nightcrawler. Destiny says: “You could not harm a facsimile Nightcrawler — how will you fare against the man himself? If he’s killed…” Mystique then responds “Be silent, woman! Mention him again… at your peril. The X-Men have my child and if I have to slaughter them all to rescue her, then I shall!”

Uncanny X-Men #204 (1986), which introduced Judith Rassendyll, the last of the Elfburgs, and was supposed to lead to his parentage. But Claremont couldn't get the story to come together to his liking(called it a 'dud').

---

What can we gather from all that? That Margali Szardos lied to Amanda for some reason when she said she found Kurt next to his dying father, that it was his mother instead(Eye of Agamotto doesn't lie). That Margali Szardos and Mystique knew each other. That there was a familial relationship between Kurt and Raven. That Mystique was having to prepare herself for the possibility of killing someone she cared something about(Kurt) to retrieve someone she regarded as her child(Rogue). That Mystique was then around 30 years old when she met Kurt, and he around 20.

Given all that, you can likely see that the familial relationship CC was intending at that point was brother and sister, with Mystique the older sibling to Kurt. There is no way he was setting Mystique's age at thirty, Kurt's at twenty and intending her to be either of Nightcrawler's parents. He was also clearly setting up Belasco as Nightcrawler's father, along the same lines he had planned for Nightmare and with Kurt as one of his 'Earth-Born Demons'. Having Mystique not only be Kurt's sister but Belasco's child as well also explained some her demonic imagery(the skulls). That was the plan as of the mid/late 80's. Mystique his sister and Belasco their shared father.

Most fans had pegged Belasco as his dad and liked the idea, and the dangling question of his connection with Mystique could have been easily resolved with the sister revelation. Instead we got a muddled mess.

Claremont didn't hit upon the idea of retconning Mystique to be much older than previously depicted, able to shapeshift to the point of producing sperm and conceiving a child with a geriatric until he was writing Excalibur. Then a 64 page Excalibur hardcover graphic novel was announced to ship in December 1990: "Chris Claremont and Alan Davis continue their Excalibur collaboration with the biography of Kurt Wagner Nightcrawler, from his birth to his rescue at the hands of Charles Xavier. We will finally learn more of the mysterious connection between Nightcrawler and Mystique!"

At that point Shooter was a few years gone as EIC, the planned graphic novel would have been released without the Comics Code, and it was only about a year later that Northstar came out, Code-be damned.

As I said, Claremont gave up on it because he couldn't make it work. And this story doesn't work either.

[yogaflame]

Okay that's fine but why reply to me if you're not going to read what I wrote. If you still have to be better than anything or anyone else out there in that power to be Omega, then again...how are Jean and Quentin both omega level telepaths.

I read what you wrote.

Hickman's logic isn't infallible. I've never seen Quentin operate at Jean's level. But that aside, he did specify that the omega power can't be exceeded by others, as in his example with Forge not being omega because other inventors are better than him(even if later writers did label him 'omega').

I have no quarrel with you Bobby, maybe my post was misinterpreted.

[BobbysWorld]

I read what you wrote.

Hickman's logic isn't infallible. I've never seen Quentin operate at Jean's level. But that aside, he did specify that the omega power can't be exceeded by others, as in his example with Forge not being omega because other inventors are better than him(even if later writers did label him 'omega').

I have no quarrel with you Bobby, maybe my post was misinterpreted.

Sorry, I was responding to what I saw as a dig that seemed to be intent on just doubling down rather than engaging in conversation. I'll give you that Hickman isn't above infallibility - in fact I have my own criticisms of his take on omegas since I don't think it works to try and separate their powersets into singular abilities, only one of which is omega for any of them....just as an example, Bobby's power doesn't make sense as just negative temperature manipulation. Most of his greatest feats are not possible without hydrokinesis...negative temperature control contributes nothing to his ability to exist in moisture as a medium, which is the basis of his immortality, his golems, his teleportation, etc.

So I definitely agree with having a critical eye towards Hickman's definition, I just mean that I don't think it works to try and attribute the idea of there only being one omega per power to things he laid out, specifically. That's the basis of my counter-comments....if people think that it works best if there's only one omega per power and they're the most powerful of their type, that's certainly not something I have a problem with. We all have our preferences as to how we think various things SHOULD be presented to make more sense. I just mean that I see a lot of people definitively stating that so and so CAN'T be omega because the canon is that only the most powerful of every type can be omega....and whether anyone personally thinks it makes more sense that way or not, the canon does not actually line up with that take as of right now, even though that might change at some later date.

FWIW, I just reread the page citing Magneto and Forge, and I do understand why people have interpreted it to mean 'omegas must be the most powerful of their type' but keeping in mind that he established on the very same page multiple omegas of the same type, my interpretation of that part was always that he was simply putting Forge and Magneto forward as examples of powerful mutants at the apex of their respective powertypes....but the actual distinction made, that omega powersets can not be surpassed, never actually mandated that omegas had to FIRST be the most powerful mutant of their type, bar none....it was simply....their power could not be surpassed by "non-mutant means," was the direct quote. So multiple mutants can share omega status....they just can't be surpassed by non-mutant means.

I do think the waters are muddied because of Ewing in specific. He DOES seem to approach the idea of omegas as most powerful of their type....but only ever in conjunction with Arakkii. They're the ones who talk about their 'omega healer' or 'omega precog' and the only time omega has been used in that context for non-Arakkii was when Magneto was describing Forge TO the Great Ring, which was when he referred to Forge as Krakoa's omega technopath. So it could be that Ewing operates off of a different perception of omegas than Hickman laid out, or it could also be that he's writing the Arakkii as having a culturally different take on omegas....that there's an omega per power, and only one of each, the strongest of their powertype. Which fits with the Arakkii culture, and casts a different light on Magneto's line about Forge....he was framing Forge in the context of Arakkii cultural views on omegas, in respect for his audience.

[davetvs]

I do think the waters are muddied because of Ewing in specific. He DOES seem to approach the idea of omegas as most powerful of their type....but only ever in conjunction with Arakkii. They're the ones who talk about their 'omega healer' or 'omega precog' and the only time omega has been used in that context for non-Arakkii was when Magneto was describing Forge TO the Great Ring, which was when he referred to Forge as Krakoa's omega technopath. So it could be that Ewing operates off of a different perception of omegas than Hickman laid out, or it could also be that he's writing the Arakkii as having a culturally different take on omegas....that there's an omega per power, and only one of each, the strongest of their powertype. Which fits with the Arakkii culture, and casts a different light on Magneto's line about Forge....he was framing Forge in the context of Arakkii cultural views on omegas, in respect for his audience.

That's how I read it.

[DarkMagnus]

I Dont hate this retcon.

In fact i love it. Good for Kurt and Raven. and Irene is soooo a weirdly badly person..

And Lil Rogue <3

[Su_Whisterfield]

I Dont hate this retcon.

In fact i love it. Good for Kurt and Raven. and Irene is soooo a weirdly badly person..

And Lil Rogue <3

Litte Rogue was adorable, but I thought she was older when they adopted her?

[Fokken]

This issue was a triumph.

Clearly not a triumph for everyone, but I enjoyed it very much. I read it twice to ensure I was gathering and placing all the puzzle pieces correctly, and I DID look up a word or two since I'm not well versed in biology terminology but finding the story both entertaining and educational made it all the more fun -- for me, personally.

My sympathies to all the folks who did not latch on to this story's teet.

The anticipation for the next (and final?) issue of Uncanny Nightcrawler has me gyrating in my seat.

[Su_Whisterfield]

This issue was a triumph.

Clearly not a triumph for everyone, but I enjoyed it very much. I read it twice to ensure I was gathering and placing all the puzzle pieces correctly, and I DID look up a word or two since I'm not well versed in biology terminology but finding the story both entertaining and educational made it all the more fun -- for me, personally.

My sympathies to all the folks who did not latch on to this story's teet.

The anticipation for the next (and final?) issue of Uncanny Nightcrawler has me gyrating in my seat.

Yeah, I enjoyed it.
Kurt has been my favourite character since 1980, I walked into the Student’s Union bar at college and announced I had a new elf and this one was blue (my friends were very understanding we were the weird, dope smoking, hippy art and drama students, Tolkien, and his ilk, were what we read).

I hope this will open up new stories, new dynamics. I feel it’s time we had a Darkholme/Adler book with their extended families.

[Fokken]

This issue did beg some questions about Rogue.

Nightcrawler's conception had higher purpose.

Was Rogue's adoption equivocal?

[DarkMagnus]

Litte Rogue was adorable, but I thought she was older when they adopted her?

I Suposse that´s not cannon now too.

I remember there is a What if? where Rogue and Kurt get involved and everything ends soo weird.

[DarkMagnus]

This issue did beg some questions about Rogue.

Nightcrawler's conception had higher purpose.

Was Rogue's adoption equivocal?

Rogue´s adoption was promoted by Destiny so she has to had a purpose for her.

[Factor]

It’s so convoluted it feels like a classic X-men comic, but not in a good way LOL.
Mystique being able to produce sperm to impregnate an old lady with a son who looks like some demon she met is… a choice.
Austen’s story feels like a masterpiece now.

[Devaishwarya]

Spurrier will Spurrier. Well and so.

I find it odd that some readers are villainising Charles when they were the ones who asked him to erase their memories and feelings.
And calling Destiny terrible (she is, but not this instance) for abandoning Kurt to Margali...she knows what the future holds if she doesn't do what she needs to do, regardless of the pain it will cause her and those around her (Although...the part with Azzael killing the X-Men and ruling the world if he wasn't preoccupied by his heirs was contrived and unnecessary and could have been completely left out) I think it might have been a very similar situation when she told Raven they had to let Rogue go to Xavier's School for the Gifted with the exception of Rogue having had time to grow with her mothers' love.

My only surprise takeaway/retcon here is that Irene is Kurt's birth mother and not Raven, as initially believed.

[ermac]

As I pointed out in my earlier post, Nightmare was the original 'plan' for the father. There were then other plans that never came together.

Uncanny X-Men Annual #4 (1980), Kurt celebrates his 21th birthday. Margali Szardos uses the Eye of Agamotto from Dr. Strange and the images and captions reveal:

“…the infant Kurt Wagner — barely an hour old — found beside his dying mother, taken in by the Gypsy Witch-Queen Margali Szardos, and raised as one of her own.”

Uncanny X-Men #142 (1981), Nightcrawler met Mystique, and noted she had a physical resemblance to him. her “Who are you?!” he asked and she replies “Ask… your mother, Margali Szardos. Who would better know than — she?”.

Uncanny X-Men #170 (Jun 83), captions for a dream sequence where Mystique is getting hunted by Lady Jean Grey and Sir Jason Wyngarde, note it to be occurring in: “1783, the place England, their quarry a woman who will not be born for another 170 years”, Meaning Mystique was born in 1953, 30 years before the story’s original setting.

Along the way, CC brought in the demon-sorcerer of Limbo, Belasco, as a foil for the X-Men. Belasco had pointy ears like Nightmare, ruled a demonic dimension(Limbo), and even had a forked, prehensile tail just like Nightcrawler. Belasco made a deal with his “Elder Gods”(the N’Garai) for immortality on the basis he would return to earth and become the “Father” of a new race of Earth-Born Demons. In the Magik Limited series from 1983–1984, Kurt was the X-Man who fell most under Belasco’s control, even becoming his “familiar”. It seemed their might be a connection between them...

Uncanny X-Men #177 (Jan 84) Kurt is beginning to question Margali’s account of him as a foundling. When he asks his girlfriend Amanda Sefton“Who am I…? Where do I come from?! What is my real family?” she responds “I know what Mom told me — she found you, new-born and barely alive, in a roadside shelter in the Black Forest. A man — your father, I guess — lay outside…”

Also in Uncanny X-Men #177, Mystique kills six of the seven X-Men robot sims of the X-Men practicing for an attempt to get Rogue back to her and Irene, she hesitates when it comes to the robot Nightcrawler. Destiny says: “You could not harm a facsimile Nightcrawler — how will you fare against the man himself? If he’s killed…” Mystique then responds “Be silent, woman! Mention him again… at your peril. The X-Men have my child and if I have to slaughter them all to rescue her, then I shall!”

Uncanny X-Men #204 (1986), which introduced Judith Rassendyll, the last of the Elfburgs, and was supposed to lead to his parentage. But Claremont couldn't get the story to come together to his liking(called it a 'dud').

---

What can we gather from all that? That Margali Szardos lied to Amanda for some reason when she said she found Kurt next to his dying father, that it was his mother instead(Eye of Agamotto doesn't lie). That Margali Szardos and Mystique knew each other. That there was a familial relationship between Kurt and Raven. That Mystique was having to prepare herself for the possibility of killing someone she cared something about(Kurt) to retrieve someone she regarded as her child(Rogue). That Mystique was then around 30 years old when she met Kurt, and he around 20.

Given all that, you can likely see that the familial relationship CC was intending at that point was brother and sister, with Mystique the older sibling to Kurt. There is no way he was setting Mystique's age at thirty, Kurt's at twenty and intending her to be either of Nightcrawler's parents. He was also clearly setting up Belasco as Nightcrawler's father, along the same lines he had planned for Nightmare and with Kurt as one of his 'Earth-Born Demons'. Having Mystique not only be Kurt's sister but Belasco's child as well also explained some her demonic imagery(the skulls). That was the plan as of the mid/late 80's. Mystique his sister and Belasco their shared father.

Most fans had pegged Belasco as his dad and liked the idea, and the dangling question of his connection with Mystique could have been easily resolved with the sister revelation. Instead we got a muddled mess.

Claremont didn't hit upon the idea of retconning Mystique to be much older than previously depicted, able to shapeshift to the point of producing sperm and conceiving a child with a geriatric until he was writing Excalibur. Then a 64 page Excalibur hardcover graphic novel was announced to ship in December 1990: "Chris Claremont and Alan Davis continue their Excalibur collaboration with the biography of Kurt Wagner Nightcrawler, from his birth to his rescue at the hands of Charles Xavier. We will finally learn more of the mysterious connection between Nightcrawler and Mystique!"

At that point Shooter was a few years gone as EIC, the planned graphic novel would have been released without the Comics Code, and it was only about a year later that Northstar came out, Code-be damned.

As I said, Claremont gave up on it because he couldn't make it work. And this story doesn't work either.

Nice summary. Thanks.

[Devaishwarya]

Her power never really made sense. She can look at a 2D photograph and somehow replicate every fine detail of a person's irises and fingerprints, etc. So, obviously there was some kind of subconscious mental ability to do more than she could do consciously. It is weird to give her explicit genetic-level [subconsciously] manipulating abilities, but she can't replicate other mutants powers. Whatever.

Exactatiously.

Writers have always played fast and loose with these characters' powers in ways that don't make a lot of sense (as if comic book stories generally on a base level makes any sense...but that's another topic) It really isn't that big of a deal. Although I seem to vaguely recall (in the 90's/early 2000's) Mystique turning into some weird plane amalgam and flying...did I dream that?

To me it does make some sense that she can't replicate mutant powers when she shape-shifts because:
1: Her shape-shifts are often just superficial, she doesn't ever need to go to the extreme as she did in this story which was specifically to father a child.
2: Even if she went as far as to replicate the mutant dna she wouldn't have the resilience, ability and understanding of how to use those powers effectively. Unlike Rogue whose genetics and physiology make it possible for her to effectively use those powers she borrows.

The potential is there, I suppose, for Raven to push the limits of her powers but...I don't think she's the type of character who would care that much to invest the time and effort. Because she doesn't need to.