Ben Reilly: Scarlet Spider/Spider-Man Appreciation 2024.

[Coop]

Y'know, I was thinking yesterday about Chasm being so goofy and jokey. And it hit me that, maybe, it so clearly doesn't work because Ben's original stories were so serious: the existential journey he went through was often handled with gravitas and had legitimately emotional stakes. To take a character that was treated so respectfully and sincerity in his original appearances and then decide, "Let's turn him into a villain but let's also make him really silly," just makes no sense. I think many of us could handle Ben's turn to Chasm if it was done with the same level of consideration and thoughtfulness that was given to him back in the 90s. But we have rarely had even MOMENTS of sincere trauma under Wells' authorship. It's all just played for laughs, and to do so with a character that was never meant for that role is beyond confounding.

-Pav, who knows he's preaching to the choir...

It's also a weird contradiction to Lowe in 93 explaining the idea as wanting to die a tragedy. Now sure, how Ben's been written and used since then for sure is tragic. But if you read his monologue at the end of 93 it doesn't really square with the the goofy gag character Chasm has been written as in Dark Web on.

As for Ben as a villain, everything is in the execution, so you never know what a different team could have done and if it would have worked. Speaking for myself, I always find these situations where a character who would be difficult to make a villain is made a villain by exposing them to stuff so horrible it completely twists them to now justify the heel turn as a hard sell. It was a hard sell when they did it to Wally with Heroes in Crisis where he overdosed on trauma and exploded into lightning killing everyone and then covering it up. Same with Ben into the Jackal because he was tortured so much he just became a new character. And same with Chasm, where the character aside from liking Janine doesn't act anything like Ben.

In general, I find those kind of writing maneuvers both bad and extremely difficult to make stick. But the way Chasm is and the avoidance of Peter making any effort to actually help him is just salt on the wound.

The character and what's been done to him is just treated as a joke, which is kinda sad because despite the obvious warts people were excited to see him im Beyond and looked for positives. No one expected him working for an evil corporation to go great, but what actually happened was an extra bummer after trying to find the good in Beyond for however many months

[Sr. Bungle]

It's also a weird contradiction to Lowe in 93 explaining the idea as wanting to die a tragedy. Now sure, how Ben's been written and used since then for sure is tragic. But if you read his monologue at the end of 93 it doesn't really square with the the goofy gag character Chasm has been written as in Dark Web on.

As for Ben as a villain, everything is in the execution, so you never know what a different team could have done and if it would have worked. Speaking for myself, I always find these situations where a character who would be difficult to make a villain is made a villain by exposing them to stuff so horrible it completely twists them to now justify the heel turn as a hard sell. It was a hard sell when they did it to Wally with Heroes in Crisis where he overdosed on trauma and exploded into lightning killing everyone and then covering it up. Same with Ben into the Jackal because he was tortured so much he just became a new character. And same with Chasm, where the character aside from liking Janine doesn't act anything like Ben.

In general, I find those kind of writing maneuvers both bad and extremely difficult to make stick. But the way Chasm is and the avoidance of Peter making any effort to actually help him is just salt on the wound.

The character and what's been done to him is just treated as a joke, which is kinda sad because despite the obvious warts people were excited to see him im Beyond and looked for positives. No one expected him working for an evil corporation to go great, but what actually happened was an extra bummer after trying to find the good in Beyond for however many months

To be fair, he wasn't written as a goofy character in Dark Web 1. It doesn't help that we don't have inner monologue for Ben, same thing goes for Kafka

[Huntsman Spider]

Y'know, I was thinking yesterday about Chasm being so goofy and jokey. And it hit me that, maybe, it so clearly doesn't work because Ben's original stories were so serious: the existential journey he went through was often handled with gravitas and had legitimately emotional stakes. To take a character that was treated so respectfully and sincerity in his original appearances and then decide, "Let's turn him into a villain but let's also make him really silly," just makes no sense. I think many of us could handle Ben's turn to Chasm if it was done with the same level of consideration and thoughtfulness that was given to him back in the 90s. But we have rarely had even MOMENTS of sincere trauma under Wells' authorship. It's all just played for laughs, and to do so with a character that was never meant for that role is beyond confounding.

-Pav, who knows he's preaching to the choir...

As one of that choir, preach on, Pav.

It's also a weird contradiction to Lowe in 93 explaining the idea as wanting to die a tragedy. Now sure, how Ben's been written and used since then for sure is tragic. But if you read his monologue at the end of 93 it doesn't really square with the the goofy gag character Chasm has been written as in Dark Web on.

As for Ben as a villain, everything is in the execution, so you never know what a different team could have done and if it would have worked. Speaking for myself, I always find these situations where a character who would be difficult to make a villain is made a villain by exposing them to stuff so horrible it completely twists them to now justify the heel turn as a hard sell. It was a hard sell when they did it to Wally with Heroes in Crisis where he overdosed on trauma and exploded into lightning killing everyone and then covering it up. Same with Ben into the Jackal because he was tortured so much he just became a new character. And same with Chasm, where the character aside from liking Janine doesn't act anything like Ben.

In general, I find those kind of writing maneuvers both bad and extremely difficult to make stick. But the way Chasm is and the avoidance of Peter making any effort to actually help him is just salt on the wound.

The character and what's been done to him is just treated as a joke, which is kinda sad because despite the obvious warts people were excited to see him im Beyond and looked for positives. No one expected him working for an evil corporation to go great, but what actually happened was an extra bummer after trying to find the good in Beyond for however many months

A good point as well.

To be fair, he wasn't written as a goofy character in Dark Web 1. It doesn't help that we don't have inner monologue for Ben, same thing goes for Kafka

Alas, yeah.

[JustLuke]

I'm starting to doubt the existence of Chasm:Curse of Kaine at this point. Marvel has been radio silent since the announcement back on Febrary

If there's no announcement after ASM #48 then something is clearly up.

[Sr. Bungle]

If there's no announcement after ASM #48 then something is clearly up.

It was announced for the summer, so it should be in the July solicits or am I wrong?

[JustLuke]

It was announced for the summer, so it should be in the July solicits or am I wrong?

Usually there's announcements for this stuff beforehand. Early solicits like for the Ultimate line-earlier but you're right. If it's not there though I think we should consider that plans may have changed

[IamnotJudasTraveller]

Usually there's announcements for this stuff beforehand. Early solicits like for the Ultimate line-earlier but you're right. If it's not there though I think we should consider that plans may have changed

It's probably getting announced when Ben's mini-arc in Amazing wraps - it's usual form for this kind of stuff.

[Refrax5]

Usually there's announcements for this stuff beforehand. Early solicits like for the Ultimate line-earlier but you're right. If it's not there though I think we should consider that plans may have changed

I don't think so. Lowe said he wasn't going to reveal much about that series just yet in Web of Spider-Man last month, so it makes sense we haven't seen much so far.

[Sr. Bungle]

I don't think so. Lowe said he wasn't going to reveal much about that series just yet in Web of Spider-Man last month, so it makes sense we haven't seen much so far.

What would be the last month for something to be launched in "summer"? August?

[Sr. Bungle]

https://www.reddit.com/r/MilesMorale...way_from_cody/

Ziglar wanted Ben Reilly to be labeled Spider-Man of Manhattan and he and Miles were supposed to interacted closely but they opted for Misty and Coleen instead.

[JustLuke]

https://www.reddit.com/r/MilesMorale...way_from_cody/

Ziglar wanted Ben Reilly to be labeled Spider-Man of Manhattan and he and Miles were supposed to interacted closely but they opted for Misty and Coleen instead.

My hatred for Chasm has grown even larger, thanks

[Coop]

I definitely would much rather have seen more Miles than Misty and Coleen, two characters I didn't much enjoy during Beyond. By comparison the issue where Ben and Miles met was probably one of the best issues of the entire event

[IamnotJudasTraveller]

My hatred for Chasm has grown even larger, thanks

I really thought Ziglar was one of the rotating crew who got Ben the best, and I remember that he referenced Ben's struggle as similar to Spider-Punk's as "the small guy/everyman having to go head to head with the big corporation for control of his life".
I'd dare say we were robbed.

[HypnoHustler]

I really thought Ziglar was one of the rotating crew who got Ben the best, and I remember that he referenced Ben's struggle as similar to Spider-Punk's as "the small guy/everyman having to go head to head with the big corporation for control of his life".
I'd dare say we were robbed.

Ziglar’s issues were great. Kelly Thompson clearly would rather have been writing a “Daughters of the Dragon” mini and probably pushed Lowe on that, since they fit that story about as well as a dartboard on a hot air balloon.

[Huntsman Spider]

https://www.reddit.com/r/MilesMorale...way_from_cody/

Ziglar wanted Ben Reilly to be labeled Spider-Man of Manhattan and he and Miles were supposed to interacted closely but they opted for Misty and Coleen instead.

My hatred for Chasm has grown even larger, thanks

I definitely would much rather have seen more Miles than Misty and Coleen, two characters I didn't much enjoy during Beyond. By comparison the issue where Ben and Miles met was probably one of the best issues of the entire event

I really thought Ziglar was one of the rotating crew who got Ben the best, and I remember that he referenced Ben's struggle as similar to Spider-Punk's as "the small guy/everyman having to go head to head with the big corporation for control of his life".
I'd dare say we were robbed.

Ziglar’s issues were great. Kelly Thompson clearly would rather have been writing a “Daughters of the Dragon” mini and probably pushed Lowe on that, since they fit that story about as well as a dartboard on a hot air balloon.

Would generally cosign, especially the part with Ziglar comparing Hobie/Spider-Punk and Ben. I'd throw in how Miles and Ben as Spider-Men exist (and struggle) within Peter Parker's shadow and could definitely bond over that.