Ben Reilly: Scarlet Spider/Spider-Man Appreciation 2024.

[Huntsman Spider]

Yeah, I don't think anyone at Marvel remembers that they did The Real Clone Saga. The only Ben to show up in any recent Spider-Verse comic was the one from Spider-Man: The Animated Series but he was just a background character in End of the Spider-Verse.

Probably the best version of Ben we've seen outside the 90s comics is in TAS. Despite "our" Peter commenting, "This is starting to sound like a bad comic book plot!" when it came to Ben's backstory there, I thought it was pretty well-done as a tragedy, given the reality where Ben became a heroic Scarlet Spider and did his best to make peace with his existence as a clone was the same reality where Peter completely fell apart and tried to kill Ben outright before being possessed by a dimension-traveling Carnage symbiote drawn to and amplifying his hate and rage to apocalyptic extremes.

[All Star Superman]

Sure, I’d read it. But why does he have to leave New York? He has his job at the Daily Grind and a budding romance with Desiree. I’d be more interested in him staying and Peter and him sharing Spidey duties as Pete suggested in Revelations part 2. In this scenario, Baby May also lives (as an alive Ben mourning a dead Mayday is somehow even more depressing than what happened), and Ben being single is the primary Spidey while Peter as the responsible family man is more of a pinch-hitter who jumps into action when he’s needed (maybe it breaks down with Ben as Spidey 75% of the time while Pete is Spidey 25%). That to me would be a cool scenario that’s never been explored. That said, I’ll take what I can get and would still like to see more stories with Ben on the road too. But to be honest, it’s his brotherly bond with Peter that is my favorite aspect of the saga.

Ben doesn't necessarily have to leave New York, but I do think an itinerant Scarlett Spider could be a lot of fun, not unlike The Incredible Hulk TV series. Ben travels from town to town, right wrongs and searching for his place in the world. Maybe he returns to New York in time, maybe he ends up in another big city or even another country.

I would like to see a continuation of "The Real Clone Saga" universe. Last time we saw Ben, he was heading back out on the road but Peter and MJ were certain they'd see him again since he promised to come visit his niece.

To me, going back to that universe is the only way to get the "real" Ben back. Get DeFalco and Frenz together and it would be a dream come true.

[Sr. Bungle]

ASM 44 marcos Martin Variant

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[Ubauba01]

Probably the best version of Ben we've seen outside the 90s comics is in TAS. Despite "our" Peter commenting, "This is starting to sound like a bad comic book plot!" when it came to Ben's backstory there, I thought it was pretty well-done as a tragedy, given the reality where Ben became a heroic Scarlet Spider and did his best to make peace with his existence as a clone was the same reality where Peter completely fell apart and tried to kill Ben outright before being possessed by a dimension-traveling Carnage symbiote drawn to and amplifying his hate and rage to apocalyptic extremes.

IIRC, in TAS, Ben Reilly's personality is very similiar to how he was in the comics right after he learned of the "truth" that he is the real Peter. He was in that stage in the cartoon as well, so it makes sense.

Spider-Carnage, on the other hand, is basically 'what if Spider-Man was driven insane from the events of the Clone Saga?'. The backstory in the cartoon is very similiar in broad brushes to the comic story up to and including where Peter is 'revealed' to be the clone.

Hopefully, they bring the show back just like how they are doing it with X-Men '97. They should at least do a wrap up to the Mary Jane being lost in the Multiverse storyline, but hopefully it continues past that.

[JustLuke]

ASM 44 marcos Martin Variant

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This single variant cover is like, the exact opposite of the status quo that we currently have. It's almost comical

[Huntsman Spider]

IIRC, in TAS, Ben Reilly's personality is very similiar to how he was in the comics right after he learned of the "truth" that he is the real Peter. He was in that stage in the cartoon as well, so it makes sense.

Spider-Carnage, on the other hand, is basically 'what if Spider-Man was driven insane from the events of the Clone Saga?'. The backstory in the cartoon is very similiar in broad brushes to the comic story up to and including where Peter is 'revealed' to be the clone.

Hopefully, they bring the show back just like how they are doing it with X-Men '97. They should at least do a wrap up to the Mary Jane being lost in the Multiverse storyline, but hopefully it continues past that.

Yeah, that would be cool.

ASM 44 marcos Martin Variant

mmvariant.jpg

This single variant cover is like, the exact opposite of the status quo that we currently have. It's almost comical

In the words of Deadpool from the first movie, "Fake laugh, hiding real pain."

[CaptainUniverse]

ASM 44 marcos Martin Variant

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I want this status quo back.

[bob.schoonover]

That cover rules. Really need someone to make that on a dust jacket I can put over one of my Clone Saga omnis

[Refrax5]

Only the middle. The end has some of the strongest stuff with Ben in the Spidey suit. People who hate on it are fans who checked out in the middle during ‘Maximum Clonage’ and just assumed that standard of quality continued. But I reread the last year (with gems like the Dan Jurgens and then Dezago/Wieringo ‘Sensational’ runs, or “Web of Carnage” arc, or the Spider-Man: Redemption miniseries, and even “Revelations”) much more than I reread the first year. I know YMMV but I think all that stuff is pretty strong.

Agreed. Ben's tenure as Spider-Man was one of my favorite parts of the Clone Saga. I think one of the reasons he appealed to me when I was a kid was that I wanted to be Spider-Man and it was sometimes hard for me to relate to how much Peter was burdened by it. Seeing a Spider-Man that loved being Spider-Man and saw it as a dream come true, who was a little more reckless and free-spirited, really appealed to me. Ben was all the stuff I liked about Peter with some added unique elements of his own. I agree that the first chunk of the Clone Saga is probably the most consistently good part, but there's a LOT of great stuff during Ben's time as Spidey, too. Even Revelations had some really great moments for both Ben and Peter. That scene where Goblin becomes enraged by Peter for constantly surviving his attacks and refusing to lay down and Peter saying, "If you want me dead, you grinning, green clown, you're going to have to do better than that. Much better" was such a badass moment and the kind of grit and toughness that I wish we saw more from Pete in modern comics.

It's maybe silly, but those comics inspired me a lot as a kid having a rough time. I saw how Ben and Peter took the worst life had to throw at them and kept going and finding a way to live good lives. A few years ago, I went through another rough time and I reread the Clone Saga and it still gave me the same comfort and inspiration to endure.

That's probably why having Ben break and become a supervillain and Peter being so frequently depicted as this immature, incompetent goofball in recent years bothers me. They don't feel like the guys I grew up reading.

[Huntsman Spider]

Agreed. Ben's tenure as Spider-Man was one of my favorite parts of the Clone Saga. I think one of the reasons he appealed to me when I was a kid was that I wanted to be Spider-Man and it was sometimes hard for me to relate to how much Peter was burdened by it. Seeing a Spider-Man that loved being Spider-Man and saw it as a dream come true, who was a little more reckless and free-spirited, really appealed to me. Ben was all the stuff I liked about Peter with some added unique elements of his own. I agree that the first chunk of the Clone Saga is probably the most consistently good part, but there's a LOT of great stuff during Ben's time as Spidey, too. Even Revelations had some really great moments for both Ben and Peter. That scene where Goblin becomes enraged by Peter for constantly surviving his attacks and refusing to lay down and Peter saying, "If you want me dead, you grinning, green clown, you're going to have to do better than that. Much better" was such a badass moment and the kind of grit and toughness that I wish we saw more from Pete in modern comics.

It's maybe silly, but those comics inspired me a lot as a kid having a rough time. I saw how Ben and Peter took the worst life had to throw at them and kept going and finding a way to live good lives. A few years ago, I went through another rough time and I reread the Clone Saga and it still gave me the same comfort and inspiration to endure.

That's probably why having Ben break and become a supervillain and Peter being so frequently depicted as this immature, incompetent goofball in recent years bothers me. They don't feel like the guys I grew up reading.

Yeah, I hear you there. Much respect to you as well.

[boots]

I've been asking myself this a lot lately and I figured I'd ask other fans of Ben as well.

Would you support a book that is set in a universe that is either A) "The Real Clone Saga" or B) a universe where Ben survives "Revelations." Both books would focus on Ben before he was (IMO) irreparably damaged by later writers as he leaves New York to truly create a new life for himself.

At this point, I'd support such a title even though it isn't the 616 version of Ben. It seems to me that, like a married Peter in 616, we're not going to see Ben restored to his heroic self. I hate settling, but that seems to be what we have to do these days.

i empathise with the sentiment and i'd wish a series like this a lot of luck...but ben as a "brand" is broken for me no matter which universe or alt. even a total 616 reboot wouldn't bring me back.

more JMD "lost years" (either on the road or as spidey) might though? it wouldn't even need to be JMD, just anyone who wants to have fun playing in the sandbox. it would depend on the story.

otherwise, the "spine-tingling" mini is the only thing i've been reading and will continue to read. at least they've done spidercide justice is not something i ever thought i'd hear myself say. man, 2024 is wild.

[Huntsman Spider]

i empathise with the sentiment and i'd wish a series like this a lot of luck...but ben as a "brand" is broken for me no matter which universe or alt. even a total 616 reboot wouldn't bring me back.

more JMD "lost years" (either on the road or as spidey) might though? it wouldn't even need to be JMD, just anyone who wants to have fun playing in the sandbox. it would depend on the story.

otherwise, the "spine-tingling" mini is the only thing i've been reading and will continue to read. at least they've done spidercide justice is not something i ever thought i'd hear myself say. man, 2024 is wild.

Yes. Yes, indeed.

[Refrax5]

i empathise with the sentiment and i'd wish a series like this a lot of luck...but ben as a "brand" is broken for me no matter which universe or alt. even a total 616 reboot wouldn't bring me back.

more JMD "lost years" (either on the road or as spidey) might though? it wouldn't even need to be JMD, just anyone who wants to have fun playing in the sandbox. it would depend on the story.

otherwise, the "spine-tingling" mini is the only thing i've been reading and will continue to read. at least they've done spidercide justice is not something i ever thought i'd hear myself say. man, 2024 is wild.

I don't really feel that way overall. These are fictional characters and characters have been fixed from much worse than this. I remember evil murderous Tony Stark getting replaced by a teenage version, Hydra Cap, Punisher murdering litterers, Green Lantern killing trillions of people, Wally West killing his friends and mutilating their bodies to frame two innocent people, Jason Todd shooting a kid, etc. Ben's craziness was never his fault and something that was done TO him. All you have to do is give him his mind back and move on. People are sabotaging the character by blowing things out of proportion and refusing to accept even a hypothetical reformation of the character.

It's an easy fix and bound to happen eventually. And if nobody supports it, editorial will absolutely take the wrong lesson from that.

[Refrax5]

Yeah, I hear you there. Much respect to you as well.

Appreciate that. Back at ya.

[Huntsman Spider]

Appreciate that. Back at ya.

You're very welcome, and thanks.

I don't really feel that way overall. These are fictional characters and characters have been fixed from much worse than this. I remember evil murderous Tony Stark getting replaced by a teenage version, Hydra Cap, Punisher murdering litterers, Green Lantern killing trillions of people, Wally West killing his friends and mutilating their bodies to frame two innocent people, Jason Todd shooting a kid, etc. Ben's craziness was never his fault and something that was done TO him. All you have to do is give him his mind back and move on. People are sabotaging the character by blowing things out of proportion and refusing to accept even a hypothetical reformation of the character.

It's an easy fix and bound to happen eventually. And if nobody supports it, editorial will absolutely take the wrong lesson from that.

Excellent point there about Ben not being totally FUBAR.