Jean Grey / Phoenix Appreciation 2024

[Mercury]

That's kind of what happened in X-Factor at least 3 times after she kept blaming Madeleyne for Scotts insanity. Because she went through the siege perilous

You've excised, either unintentionally or strategically, a great deal of context, which I will be more than happy to provide:

(1) First, Jean admonished Scott for leaving Madelyne and Nathan, repeatedly urged him to call and return to them, and rejected his advances long after they thought Madelyne was dead. That says everything we need to know about her intentions and how she really felt when she was in her right mind (barely).

(2) Her sister's house had not only recently been bombed, but her sister had also disappeared, along with her niece and nephew, by the time of that exchange. And yet, she still agreed to forgo being there for her own family—her parents, her sister, her niece, her nephew—to help him find Madelyne and Nathan.

(3) In the middle of her own personal and familial trauma and still reeling from the revelation that she had been betrayed by the O5, who all kept Madelyne and Nathan a secret from her, she weathered Scott practically attacking her while trying to get her to admit she was Phoenix and Madelyne and that she was toying with him. Yes, he was being manipulated, but she was also in a state of severe trauma and couldn't even accept major aspects of herself!

(4) After she finally relented and got back together with him, and they found out Madelyne was, in fact, alive, she tried comforting him and still offered her support to find Nathan.

(5) And then came this, not long before Jean finally exploded, where he tried subtly inculcating her with his own guilt when he was the one that insisted they get back together:





With this added context, it becomes clear why she felt compelled to blame Madelyne, especially considering she was on her side in the beginning: She was feeling blamed for Scott's guilt. He practically tells her so. Not to mention the fact that she was dealing with all of the sh*t mentioned above, i.e., her own crisis of identity, the memories of what she had done as Dark Phoenix, the potential death of her sister, niece, and nephew, and her estrangement from her family. The way you've framed it, she was just a jealous ex who would've suffocated Madelyne with a pillow if she got the chance...

No dice.

EDIT Moreover, when it counted, she was on Madelyne's side every time, including sacrificing her soul to Mephisto to save her and Nathan and to relieve Scott of his guilt.

[Mercury]

[Braxxer]

Marvel's tweet about the book reached 1k likes in just 45 minutes. For comparison, X-Force from a day ago is still at 775.

https://twitter.com/Marvel/status/1778107001119084663

Well it’s twitter and if you ever been part of x-twitter you know that jean stans there are wild

[Apechei]

I actually wonder if this side of Jean is also any indication of the Phoenix being bonded with her. The way she is lashing out, in addition to the context that Beau provided, could show how the Phoenix feeds on her emotions and passion, so her reaction to being hurt is amplified. Also because the Dark Phoenix has been in the previews for a couple of episodes now… Hope she finds character redemption though!

[ExodusCloak]

You've excised, either unintentionally or strategically, a great deal of context, which I will be more than happy to provide:

(1) First, Jean admonished Scott for leaving Madelyne and Nathan, repeatedly urged him to call and return to them, and rejected his advances long after they thought Madelyne was dead. That says everything we need to know about her intentions and how she really felt when she was in her right mind (barely).

(2) Her sister's house had not only recently been bombed, but her sister had also disappeared, along with her niece and nephew, by the time of that exchange. And yet, she still agreed to forgo being there for her own family—her parents, her sister, her niece, her nephew—to help him find Madelyne and Nathan.

(3) In the middle of her own personal and familial trauma and still reeling from the revelation that she had been betrayed by the O5, who all kept Madelyne and Nathan a secret from her, she weathered Scott practically attacking her while trying to get her to admit she was Phoenix and Madelyne and that she was toying with him. Yes, he was being manipulated, but she was also in a state of severe trauma and couldn't even accept major aspects of herself!

(4) After she finally relented and got back together with him, and they found out Madelyne was, in fact, alive, she tried comforting him and still offered her support to find Nathan.

(5) And then came this, not long before Jean finally exploded, where he tried subtly inculcating her with his own guilt when he was the one that insisted they get back together:





With this added context, it becomes clear why she felt compelled to blame Madelyne, especially considering she was on her side in the beginning: She was feeling blamed for Scott's guilt. He practically tells her so. Not to mention the fact that she was dealing with all of the sh*t mentioned above, i.e., her own crisis of identity, the memories of what she had done as Dark Phoenix, the potential death of her sister, niece, and nephew, and her estrangement from her family. The way you've framed it, she was just a jealous ex who would've suffocated Madelyne with a pillow if she got the chance...

No dice.

EDIT Moreover, when it counted, she was on Madelyne's side every time, including sacrificing her soul to Mephisto to save her and Nathan and to relieve Scott of his guilt.

What's the great deal of context excised? I wasn't writing an essay on whether Jean behaved badly or was in the right to tell at Scott. All I did was point out that the writer could have lifted the scene from that issue in X-Factor. Cause as you even acknowledge in that issue there was no immediate event that preceeded that scene. That's not a doppelganger or Mystique or a Phoenix controlled Jean. Her annoyance at him stems from his obsession and one tracked mind months after Madeylne is missing again and they still haven't found baby Nathan. In fact I don't recall them getting into an argument over Sara which would have made sense in the context of what is going on. That plot is slowly dropped in between writers?? Do they even find bodies to bury? X-Factor wasn't particularly well written. Sure you can mention all those caveats if you want that doesn't change the one point I made that this is where that writer lifted it from. Both the cartoon and the comic scenes take place what a few months after??

X-Factor wasn't written very well.

[Devaishwarya]

X-Factor under Louise Simonson was very well-written. With respect to Jean it showed her being multi-faceted and layered in the midst of Scott's self-created melodrama. Being the supportive friend and team-mate while also dealing with the fact that someone else "stole" her love but not the love she still felt for him, and still trying to do the right thing. The anger, the conflict, the compassion...they were well-executed.

[PyroFN]

I actually wonder if this side of Jean is also any indication of the Phoenix being bonded with her. The way she is lashing out, in addition to the context that Beau provided, could show how the Phoenix feeds on her emotions and passion, so her reaction to being hurt is amplified. Also because the Dark Phoenix has been in the previews for a couple of episodes now… Hope she finds character redemption though!

Honestly, even if it isn’t, Jean is allowed to make mistakes and be hypocritical. That’s how you start character development. We were told from the very beginning that Jean was a mess of fragments and she had been making efforts to sort through her memories to see which ones were actually hers.

She is in no way in a complete state of rationality. Not that she is insane, but more that she is vulnerable and confused about who she is and what she wants.

I personally don’t want anything dismissing Jean’s behavior. I want these to be her own mistakes she makes to really build her character. It’s interesting.

[ExodusCloak]

X-Factor under Louise Simonson was very well-written. With respect to Jean it showed her being multi-faceted and layered in the midst of Scott's self-created melodrama. Being the supportive friend and team-mate while also dealing with the fact that someone else "stole" her love but not the love she still felt for him, and still trying to do the right thing. The anger, the conflict, the compassion...they were well-executed.

Disagree, I think it was good up until the Right arc finsihed and aimlessly went into the villain of the week. It was also derailed by a few crossovers some of which are unreadable and 2 of which are readable but I wouldn't call good. And I also think UXM was much stronger at the time.

[Mercury]

What's the great deal of context excised?

I posted what was excised.

I wasn't writing an essay on whether Jean behaved badly or was in the right to tell at Scott. All I did was point out that the writer could have lifted the scene from that issue in X-Factor.

This is fair. In that case, I'm just adding context to your point.

Cause as you even acknowledge in that issue there was no immediate event that preceeded that scene. That's not a doppelganger or Mystique or a Phoenix controlled Jean. Her annoyance at him stems from his obsession and one tracked mind months after Madeylne is missing again and they still haven't found baby Nathan.

Her annoyance stems from him using his relationship with her to paint them both as guilty parties. He doesn't mention anything about his initial decision to leave Madelyne and Nathan to see Jean, nor does he mention Jean's repeated attempts to get him to go back to them.

In fact I don't recall them getting into an argument over Sara which would have made sense in the context of what is going on. That plot is slowly dropped in between writers?? Do they even find bodies to bury?

Jean does bring it up, but the focus remains on Scott. I think part of this has to do with Jean's empathy but also her unconscious/subconscious attempt to avoid dealing with her sh*t. As for bodies, Jean finds her niece and nephew and returns them to her parents. Years later, we learn Sara was kidnapped and absorbed by the Phalanx.

X-Factor wasn't particularly well written. Sure you can mention all those caveats if you want that doesn't change the one point I made that this is where that writer lifted it from. Both the cartoon and the comic scenes take place what a few months after??

I apologize if I overlooked your main point. I thought you were making a character judgment, which you have before, which is why I felt compelled to add context to Jean's actions.

X-Factor wasn't written very well.

Like with almost any series, there were moments that were brilliant, along with moments that were lacking.

[Grinning Soul]

X-Factor under Louise Simonson was very well-written. With respect to Jean it showed her being multi-faceted and layered in the midst of Scott's self-created melodrama. Being the supportive friend and team-mate while also dealing with the fact that someone else "stole" her love but not the love she still felt for him, and still trying to do the right thing. The anger, the conflict, the compassion...they were well-executed.

Agreed it was very well-written. Realistic character moments, while still having plot *and* action.

[Devaishwarya]

Yupp. It brought the soap opera but it was balanced well with the plots and the action. I have very fond memories of that initial run from the beginning right through to Inferno.

[Celestialbodies]

Going off other opinions, I was expecting the worse. But I am truly enjoying this direction for no other reason than it gives her character something to work towards. Both her and Scott are in EXTREMELY vulnerable positions, and can be taken advantage of Jean with Logan and Scott with Madelyne. Seeing Logan reject her advances until she's figured herself out, and Madelyne take advantage of Scott's confusion that is a story. Jean doesn't get to be untouched by this situation. She's lashing out because she doesn't fully trust herself, while also trying to reconnect the dots to past connections.

I'm impressed with Beau's ability to navigate all the different emotions she's dealing with. Her power, her confusion, and her decisions are all her own when have we ever gotten a Jean written with such nuance and intention?

[dr237]

Yupp. It brought the soap opera but it was balanced well with the plots and the action. I have very fond memories of that initial run from the beginning right through to Inferno.

I agree, and I think Jean and Scott are judged too harshly for their actions in this storyline. They were in a literally impossible situation, and most of the time the proper language isn't even used to understand their situation. Jean and Scott weren't Ex-s, they never broke up. Their relationship ended because of her (believed) death. He moved on physically to another living organism, but you can't say he moved on emotionally/cognitively because he married the closest substitute for Jean the universe provided. But then it turns out Jean is alive, with no comprehension of what has transpired, so her love and devotion are unchanged. So you have the two of them, who love each other with enough strength and ferocity to stop Dark Phoenix from destroying the universe (arguably two times--original saga and when Scott was Dark Phoenix in Avengers v. X-Men), but they also each have a true sense of duty and honor. In this situation, those forces/values are in conflict, and pain would be unavoidable.

[Devaishwarya]

Exactatiously. Couldn't have said it better myself.

[Mercury]

My thoughts on X-Men 97 Ep. 5 (I posted a clip one of my favorite moments here: https://twitter.com/Jean_RED_Grey/st...39290374647909)

“Whole galaxies beckoned me, but I turned my back for you.” When she said this, my whole being contorted into this shape: 🤌🏻 Also, they are both suffering AND wrong. But I love them most when they push, challenge, and call each other out on their bullshit.

Also, it was confirmed for me that Jean holding the lake water back was, in part, inspired by the backstory "Stalking Life" from Classic X-Men #18, in which she telekinetically lifts a lake.