Titans Appreciation 2024

[king81992]

In before they say Sovereign turned Waller into a Supervillain because he couldn't stand the idea of a woman in power so he had to turn her evil.

Waller was always evil (to a certain extent), even before Sovereign showed up. Writers just hand waved her shadiness by playing the 'she's acting for the greater good' card. In truth, she hasn't been working for the greater good since Ostrander.

[ducklord]

Waller was always evil (to a certain extent), even before Sovereign showed up. Writers just hand waved her shadiness by playing the 'she's acting for the greater good' card. In truth, she hasn't been working for the greater good since Ostrander.

Of course, with Sovereign claiming to have "been there all along" (as continuity-problematic as that may be), his retconned influence could eventually provide the Parallax Space Bug-get-out-of-jail-free card that Waller needs for a character reset. 'Cause this "bwah-ha-ha, kill all the super-heroes" mindset is, bluntly, wrong.

[Frontier]

Waller was always evil (to a certain extent), even before Sovereign showed up. Writers just hand waved her shadiness by playing the 'she's acting for the greater good' card. In truth, she hasn't been working for the greater good since Ostrander.

She was never evil unless you view the idea of Task Force X as inherently evil and not gray.

[ducklord]

She was never evil unless you view the idea of Task Force X as inherently evil and not gray.

To be fair*, even at its best (ie getting volunteers and reducing sentences), Task Force X is pretty dark grey. Sticking bombs in prisoners' heads, even if they *are* nominally volunteering for their suicidal missions, is way off the map, civil rights-wise.

* I will forever hear the gang from Letterkenny when I type the words "to be fair."

[Godlike13]

To be fair*, even at its best (ie getting volunteers and reducing sentences), Task Force X is pretty dark grey. Sticking bombs in prisoners' heads, even if they *are* nominally volunteering for their suicidal missions, is way off the map, civil rights-wise.

* I will forever hear the gang from Letterkenny when I type the words "to be fair."

Not too mention what their missions often entailed. Pretending that Task Force X is any shade of grey is pretty silly. IMO Waller has always been the same as Lex Luthor. Selling their evil as not evil because its for the greater good according to them.

[Frontier]

To be fair*, even at its best (ie getting volunteers and reducing sentences), Task Force X is pretty dark grey. Sticking bombs in prisoners' heads, even if they *are* nominally volunteering for their suicidal missions, is way off the map, civil rights-wise.

* I will forever hear the gang from Letterkenny when I type the words "to be fair."

Not too mention what their missions often entailed. Pretending that Task Force X is any shade of grey is pretty silly. IMO Waller has always been the same as Lex Luthor. Selling their evil as not evil because its for the greater good according to them.

But at least per Ostrander she was straight with them and didn't use them as disposable tools that were so easily thrown away. She at least had principles and standards and was doing what she felt was best.

I don't think Lex is a fair comparison because ultimately it's just his own ego and he doesn't really care about the greater good, he just tells himself that.

[Mantis-Ray]

But at least per Ostrander she was straight with them and didn't use them as disposable tools that were so easily thrown away. She at least had principles and standards and was doing what she felt was best.

I don't think Lex is a fair comparison because ultimately it's just his own ego and he doesn't really care about the greater good, he just tells himself that.

It should also be noted that not all the squaddies had bombs implanted in their heads. Plenty of characters, including heroes like Vixen and Roy Harper were willing to work under her simply cause she made a good deal with them. There was a logic to her that kept her understandable as a character.

But now Waller has been flanderized into a cartoonish villain with no level of restraint and is causing crimes herself. Whats left of Waller now is just a dull caricature.

[Drako]

You guys are acting like this is new.

[Rac7d*]

It should also be noted that not all the squaddies had bombs implanted in their heads. Plenty of characters, including heroes like Vixen and Roy Harper were willing to work under her simply cause she made a good deal with them. There was a logic to her that kept her understandable as a character.

But now Waller has been flanderized into a cartoonish villain with no level of restraint and is causing crimes herself. Whats left of Waller now is just a dull caricature.

When you say now you mean the last 12 years right…. right

[Frontier]

When you say now you mean the last 12 years right…. right

Well, yeah it's been a problem for a while.

[marhawkman]

It occurs to me that my idea of Waller being written "right" is 20+ years old.

[Mantis-Ray]

Hey if people can still complain about Spider-Man not being written right since 2007, no reason why that can't apply to other characters.

[Agent Z]

The Sovereign appearing in other books outside Wonder Woman would be weird unless they're trying to build him up to a global threat like Leviathan.

Most DC stories take place in America, which is where the Sovereign lives. Though you could also argue he's already a global threat by taking on Wonder Woman.

[Agent Z]

You guys are acting like this is new.

They've pointed out this has been an issue with Waller for a long time.

[Godlike13]

But at least per Ostrander she was straight with them and didn't use them as disposable tools that were so easily thrown away. She at least had principles and standards and was doing what she felt was best.

I don't think Lex is a fair comparison because ultimately it's just his own ego and he doesn't really care about the greater good, he just tells himself that.

So does Waller. She has principles and standards, but again they're according to her. Lex might even be more altruistic as he at least thinks he's saving the world. Where with Waller its about her country.