DC Comics saying they own Machine Man not marvel?

[thwhtGuardian]

Unless any of us are lawyers or have seen the specific legal rights agreements that were signed way back when that adaptation was created, all we can do is speculate which doesn't interest me.

What does interest me is the idea that someone might finally do something substantial with MM again, even if it's just out of spite or legal reasons! I've always had a soft spot for Aaron and thought he could do well with as a tv series - and separated from the other heroes where being a living machine seems less special with Hulk, Thor and Vision standing next to him. A show that was like his old Kirby series could be cool - it was like the Hulk show: traveling around, trying to avoid being captured by the army while doing good deeds for strangers along the way and finding out what it's like to be human. I even like that he's not the biggest fan of humanity - I can relate to that.

The Batman Beyond spinoff cartoon Project Zeta was exactly like that and it was pretty great.

[Gaastra]

Zeta project had the dc animated universe squirrel girl also! Both companies have a squirrel girl!

As said in the marvel thread--

Marvel was able to keep the shogun warriors' pilots, half the micronouts plus captain universe, psycho man and microverse, team america cast and us1 human cast and godzilla cast and tarzan, some john carter and doc savage bad guys and shadow bad guys also but they all showed up in those books first. They got to keep shang chi also.

On the other hand, death's head and circuit breaker showed up in a marvel title before showing up in transformers to keep rights. On the other hand the neo-knights showed up in transformers first yet some say marvel owns them?

Not sure how the rights go on some of these books unless a deal was made who gets who when printed.

As why now decades later wb?

[j9ac9k]

Maybe DC will keep the rights to X-51 and Aaron Stack, but Marvel will keep "Machine Man" and lose the use of those first two names, similar to how we got two Pietro/Quicksilvers. (man, and I had said I didn't want to fall into this rabbit hole...)
A cursory G search shows he was called "Mister Machine" on a few covers:

And MM has mostly been depicted by Marvel with his Nextwave look lately, which is pretty different aside from his eyes and the color purple:


The opposite side of the coin to my previous comment is that maybe neither side will really care and this will just ensure that nobody uses Machine Man again just to avoid the argument since he's not exactly a crown jewel in Marvel's roster.

If DC did use him, where might be a good fit? A vertigo-esque series that explores the existential nature of AI? Teaming him with similar characters like Cyborg or throwing him on the Doom Patrol with Robot Man? Making him a foil for the Metal Men?

This story might be burying the lead though: does this mean we could see the 2001 Monolith in a DC comic??? (my first thought is Kamandi, but it'll probably be in the next Crisis event) DC might do it just to show Dr Manhattan walking out of the Monolith and figure out the story later. Will we see Hal9000 v Brainiac? Is Hal9000 an evolution of Brother Eye? (because it all has to lead back to Batman) "I..can't .. do... that ... Bruce."

[matt levin]

Why the foofarah? Is Machine Man suddenly a desirable property? It just so happens I've recently reread the series from 2001 - Machine Man 9 and while I most liked Aaron Stack in NEXT WAVE!!!, Kirby's issues are fun, thoughtful, and do not suggest the same 'commercial property desirability' as nearly all other Marvel and DC characters. Sooo... why the foofarah?

[tv horror]

I just wonder if this is DC pushing against Marvel or if it is Warner pushing against Disney.
It would be kind of ironic anyway if the same year Disney lost OG Mickey Mouse to Public Domain, they could lost a Marvel character to hteir competition. Even if its a c-list character.

Thank goodness I was able to buy the collected Machine Man by Kirby and Ditko recently, so I'm happy at least.

[Alan2099]

If DC did use him, where might be a good fit? A vertigo-esque series that explores the existential nature of AI? Teaming him with similar characters like Cyborg or throwing him on the Doom Patrol with Robot Man? Making him a foil for the Metal Men?

Give him a buddy/team-up book with Animal Man.

[HsssH]

Why the foofarah? Is Machine Man suddenly a desirable property? It just so happens I've recently reread the series from 2001 - Machine Man 9 and while I most liked Aaron Stack in NEXT WAVE!!!, Kirby's issues are fun, thoughtful, and do not suggest the same 'commercial property desirability' as nearly all other Marvel and DC characters. Sooo... why the foofarah?

Is there any foofarah here? This might be just some random guy noticing something weird in 2001 contracts, informing higher ups and they in turn informing Marvel. It doesn't look like anyone is getting for a major legal battle here.

[Gaastra]

Think its up to what contract the book has. Marvel had to put circuit breaker and death's head in another non transformers book first to keep rights and lost red sonja for having her in a conan book first but they keep half the micronouts, captain universe, psycho man and the microverse all in the ip book first.

At the same time marvels owns bad guys and side cast from tarzan, fu munchu, shadow, team america, us 1, shogun warriors, kiss, doc savage, john carter of mars, and even neo-knights from transformers.

All were in that ip book first.

[WiT]

How is it not the same situation? Machine Man was also created by Marvel (Kirby) for a Marvel comic. Marvel can use him whenever they want.

Because there were probably terms spelled out in the licensing deal, that may not ne present in the other case. You can't assume they were the same.


For example when Marvel licensed transformers Hasbro retained the rights to any character introduced in a transformers comic. That is why Hasbro owns "G.B. Blackrock", who was introduced in the Marvel comic, but not "Circuit Breaker" because she first appeared in Secret Wars II.

[WiT]

The issue here isn't a trademark though, it is a copyright, abandonment rules don't apply.

[Zero Hunter]

My conspiracy theory is that Gunn wanted to use MM in his Guardians movies, but Disney's lawyers said that it is not a clear situation on his ownership. So Gunn still wants to use him and passed this info to WB's lawyers.

Gunn did want to use Bug from the Micronauts in the first Guardians movie but was told he couldn't.

[Gaastra]

Marvel full owned the bug comics rights but would have to share movie and show rights with hasbro looks like.

Also guess dc dumped the machine man thing with them working with marvel to reprint the crossovers again.