Ultimate Spider-Man #1 talk.

[Majesty]

He screamed out "Parker!"

Already creating Mandela effects in my mind.

I'll just take it as a side effect of not sleeping due to video game story/writing deadlines and crunch X_X

[TinkerSpider]

I mean, we're only one issue in so far. It'd be ridiculous to claim that Hickman's already dethroned Kraven's Last Hunt this early on!

No, the parameter was best in the last 15 years. KLH is safe

No one is saying it’s the best issue ever - that’s a willful misread, especially when people have thoughtfully and explicitly made a case for their opinion.

But in the last 15 years? Sure. I’ll put it up against those books, in part BECAUSE of the promise it has, the excitement.

I have abso-f’ing-lutely no idea where Hickman is going with this. None. Because he’s not beholden to the infantilizing notion that characters are toys and must go back in the toy box. That automatically makes this more fun IMO, more anticipatory, more freeing as a reader than anything in 616 over the last fifteen years where the toy box ruled with an iron fist.

It’s so funny, Marvel keeps saying Peter can’t change or grow because it will stop new readers from picking up Spider-Man -

- when according to multiple reports from LCS owners, new faces are flooding the stores just to buy Ultimate.

Funny and sadly ironic.

[Username taken]

Completely agreed. If we changed the character names and appearances but kept everything else the same, I doubt many would even guess it was a Spider-Man book.

It's a promising start and the setup is a breath of fresh air. But if someone asked me to recommend a great single issue of Spidey to read, this isn't making the list.

Agreed.

It was a good set-up but IMO its too early to judge.

[Frontier]

Ah yes, the "You only like it because of the marriage" that's being thrown around LOL. Even though Marvel's promotion centered on "Meet the Parkers."

That's not it. Honest!

Reason 1: Ultimate Spider-Man is not chained to 616 history. It's informed by the story we all know, but from the first page it announces this is not the same old same old. This isn't the old Ultimate (which I liked) which was basically 616 but with a "modern" (now dated!) twist. This isn't RYV (and I loved the series) which was basically what if 616 branched off in a different direction. This isn't Life Story (which I don't love but I appreciate as a well-crafted story) which is basically 616 in real time. It's not Spider-Verse and its ad naseam twists on "what if X were bitten." 616 is amazing and spectacular, don't get me wrong. But it's like a Greek myth by now. And it's stopped being about Peter Parker the character with OMD, and now it's more about remixing the myth over and over. Since OMD, how many clone stories? How many Kravens and plays on the word "Last Hunt?" Goblin legacies? Superior was basically KLH taken to extremes and with the entire supporting cast forced to carry the idiot ball and minus the heart and soul at the center of KLH. There hasn't been anything truly original interjected into Peter's character in 616 since...JMS and the idea of totems, IMO. And that's because, again, Peter Parker has been placed in statis since OMD and he's not allowed to change, he's not allowed to grow, he's not allowed to acknowledge his last adventure may have left some scars, he's basically a two-dimensional cartoon character who factory resets at the end of every arc instead of being a living, breathing human character. He certainly can't be self-aware. He just runs around in circles. And that hindered Zdarsky (loved Spider's Shadow, but that was a What If), it hindered Tom Taylor (I really liked Friendly Neighborhood), it definitely hindered Spencer (who I also liked a lot).

Reason 2: Ultimate Spider-Man starts right away with a self-aware Peter, who acts like a believable human being with human emotions and goals and motivations, not a static cartoon character. Ultimate Spider-Man immediately builds a believable world and populates it with other believable human characters who have their own emotions and goals, they're not just objects rotating around Peter that don't have lives of their own. This world has stakes. Visceral, understandable stakes. We know what Peter is risking. We know what Ben and Jonah are risking. We know what Tony is risking. We're immediately engaged in what they want and why in a way that has been vastly missing from 616 for a long time.

And this ISN'T 616. I think people expecting this book to be the usual 616 remix is going to be disappointed. I'm not expecting Gwen or Venom or Black Cat to show up just because this is Spider-Man book so there must be a Gwen version and a Venom version and a Black Cat version. I'm expecting Hickman to tell his own original story, and if they show up it's because they are germane to that. And if they are expecting good 'ol Peter Parker, blockhead, who can never kick the football because of flanderized Parker luck, who must always walk under a cloud of tragedy - I have a feeling they are going to be greatly disappointed as well. This is a different Peter, who has already been tested by tragedy (losing his parents as a teen, losing May) and who has a whole world that has been stolen from him (and his kids' futures) to fight for. We'll see if that's where Hickman is going!

Reason 3: Ultimate Spider-Man is well-written. The craft is evident. The pacing is great. The dialogue sounds natural. The kids sound like kids (Richard reminds me of one of my favorite 11 year olds, who also loves to read and is okay with being who he is). The art is terrific - Checchetto is terrific at character expressions and "acting." And it's literary. This isn't to say that there haven't been well-written Spider books in 616 in the last 15 years. But Ultimate asks of its readers. Or maybe, a better way is to say it offers. It offers subtext, themes, metaphors. There are parallels to be drawn to 616, and parallels to be drawn to the real world. It's thought-provoking, if you want it to be. You can also read it straightforward and get a decent comic book yarn if you like, although if you are looking for superhero shenanigans this first issue would be disappointing. But if you want to read deeper - this book is very rewarding. I didn't expect to still be thinking about scenes in the comic days after I read it, yet I am. It's so much fun to watch smart but thoroughly human characters do smart but thoroughly human things in a well-plotted story, and I have faith in Jonathan Hickman that this will continue.

I'm not as familar with Miles's books, but I will say Cody Ziglar is killing it lately.

I'm just waiting to see if Spider-Man actually gets to win fights.

[TinkerSpider]

I'm just waiting to see if Spider-Man actually gets to win fights.

True. Very true. I’ve changed my mind, jury’s out until then

[Hurricane Billy]

No, the parameter was best in the last 15 years. KLH is safe

No one is saying it’s the best issue ever - that’s a willful misread, especially when people have thoughtfully and explicitly made a case for their opinion.

But in the last 15 years? Sure. I’ll put it up against those books, in part BECAUSE of the promise it has, the excitement.

I have abso-f’ing-lutely no idea where Hickman is going with this. None. Because he’s not beholden to the infantilizing notion that characters are toys and must go back in the toy box. That automatically makes this more fun IMO, more anticipatory, more freeing as a reader than anything in 616 over the last fifteen years where the toy box ruled with an iron fist.

It’s so funny, Marvel keeps saying Peter can’t change or grow because it will stop new readers from picking up Spider-Man -

- when according to multiple reports from LCS owners, new faces are flooding the stores just to buy Ultimate.

Funny and sadly ironic.

Completely agreed. I've got a couple of guesses and theories of where Hickman might be going in the initial arc or so, but in terms of the broader narrative and scope of whatever Hickman has planned here? No clue at all where this is going to lead... and it's exciting to feel that way.

[Garlador]

I still haven’t fully formulated my thoughts, but I have a lot to say on it. I’m excited and happy so far, but there’s a lot of context for me regarding why that is.

[lefthanded]

Reason 3: Ultimate Spider-Man is well-written. The craft is evident. The pacing is great. The dialogue sounds natural. The kids sound like kids (Richard reminds me of one of my favorite 11 year olds, who also loves to read and is okay with being who he is). The art is terrific - Checchetto is terrific at character expressions and "acting." And it's literary. This isn't to say that there haven't been well-written Spider books in 616 in the last 15 years. But Ultimate asks of its readers. Or maybe, a better way is to say it offers. It offers subtext, themes, metaphors. There are parallels to be drawn to 616, and parallels to be drawn to the real world. It's thought-provoking, if you want it to be. You can also read it straightforward and get a decent comic book yarn if you like, although if you are looking for superhero shenanigans this first issue would be disappointing. But if you want to read deeper - this book is very rewarding. I didn't expect to still be thinking about scenes in the comic days after I read it, yet I am. It's so much fun to watch smart but thoroughly human characters do smart but thoroughly human things in a well-plotted story, and I have faith in Jonathan Hickman that this will continue.

I'm not as familar with Miles's books, but I will say Cody Ziglar is killing it lately.

Agreed with your entire post, and just wanted to add on to your Reason #3.

The recent slate of Peter Parker writers have not written him well, and instead are focusing on plot/mystery at the expense of character development. This is "Mystery Box Storytelling", where the only hook to keep reading, so that you'll find out the answer 10+ issues later.

"Which of Peter's allies is going to die" artificially creates relationships that Peter has, just so he can excessively grieve.
"What did Peter do" is an anvil over any actual good writing; instead you have characters behaving out of character, because the mystery/plot needs them to be.
"Who is/are Kindred" is another mystery that overwhelms character development and the natural ending one would expect based on the characters.
Anything involving Ben Reily and Beyond Corporation seem to be written overly complicatedly.

Ultimate Spider-man #1 manages to create a straightforward story, while seeding future story developments as well as showing where are characters are at and where they may develop to. There is no "Mystery Box storytelling" to convince us to keep reading 20+ issues for the answer; instead the mystery box is literally opened at the end of this issue to show us the answer and possibilities that will come next.
Very well written.

[Aura Blaize]

And that's because, again, Peter Parker has been placed in statis since OMD and he's not allowed to change, he's not allowed to grow, he's not allowed to acknowledge his last adventure may have left some scars, he's basically a two-dimensional cartoon character who factory resets at the end of every arc instead of being a living, breathing human character. He certainly can't be self-aware. He just runs around in circles. And that hindered Zdarsky (loved Spider's Shadow, but that was a What If), it hindered Tom Taylor (I really liked Friendly Neighborhood), it definitely hindered Spencer (who I also liked a lot).

.

To be fair, Slott did have him rather shaken over living a life with Uncle Ben still alive only to have him taken away again. It honestly surprised me because I expected it to be handwaved away.

Still, it's pretty freaking rare.

I'm not as familar with Miles's books, but I will say Cody Ziglar is killing it lately.

He has. Ironically because Miles is actually allowed to grow. Hell he's going through PTSD and is working through it with therapy, which is why his spider sense is evolving.

It's honestly **** that Peter should have gone through years ago, but again as you said, everything he has learned seems to be reset because he's not allowed to grow and evolve (The Other Upgrades, The Way of the Spider, etc)

Ultimate Spider-man #1 manages to create a straightforward story, while seeding future story developments as well as showing where are characters are at and where they may develop to. There is no "Mystery Box storytelling" to convince us to keep reading 20+ issues for the answer; instead the mystery box is literally opened at the end of this issue to show us the answer and possibilities that will come next.
Very well written.

Agreed. In fact the mystery involving the universe is natural and not forced.

For instance one of the biggest mysteries for me is JJJ and Ben's relationship. I REALLY want them to explore how it came to be. Hell, Ben Parker himself has always been a rather big mystery. We know what his death caused, but do we ever know the actual man?

Also one of the headlines on the wall in Ben's office is how Roxxon came after the Bugle. I honestly would love to hear the story behind that.

And in the process of typing this post, I realize....We don't know these characters. That is a massive appeal to me.

[Username taken]

I'm just waiting to see if Spider-Man actually gets to win fights.

I hope he does.

I know it doesn't happen much again but there was a time Spider-man did beat the crap out of his villains.

From The Rhino to Sin-Eater to Wilson Fisk to the Green Goblin (both father and son) Peter used to get serious and wreck fools.

[Coop]

I definitely expect more out of Hickman than Peter barely being able to function as a hero. I am sure he will struggle but I have faith it won't just be a story about Peter being an ineffectual hero. I have faith we we'll get something better than that kind of lazy expectation subverting

[Kevinroc]

The thing about comparing Hickman's USM to other Spider-Man comics is that Hickman's USM is very much a comic made for the moment in the way that other comics are not.

Superior is basically "can a bad guy become a good guy" but that's been done many times before and didn't really speak to the moment of its creation.

Life Story felt like a cliff notes version of Spider-Man, but needed more breathing room. I don't think it's bad, but I wouldn't rate it as high as others might.

Miles Morales is probably the closest to speaking in the moment but it's hampered by a creative team that didn't really want to get into what it means for a Black and Latino teen taking on the name of the most popular superhero in the world (Bendis' heart was in the right place, but he maybe wasn't the guy who should have been writing those comics). There were fan comics that tackled these issues with more intensity than the main comics did. Later writers began to tackle these issues, and the comics are all the better for them.

But USM is very much in the moment. The narrative of this series (and maybe this new Ultimate line as a whole) is that of a lost generation that feels like their future was taken from them. This is a much deeper story than we have seen from a mainstream Spider-Man comic in a long time. It may be too early to declare it "THE BEST SPIDER-MAN COMIC OF THE LAST 15+ YEARS" but it definitely has the potential to be something really special.

[Coop]

For me, it's without question the most excited I have been about the first issue of a new Spider-Man run since the probably original Ultimate Spider-Man.

Where the run ends up is definitely up for debate, but I absolutely didn't put down the first issue of either Wells run, Spencer's run, any Slott run, and feel as excited or interested as I was here.

Not trying to put down any other comics, but this issue landed for me on all points

[Frontier]

I get the sense the kids are probably going to get lost by the wayside a lot in this run.

[Mister Mets]

The thing about comparing Hickman's USM to other Spider-Man comics is that Hickman's USM is very much a comic made for the moment in the way that other comics are not.

Superior is basically "can a bad guy become a good guy" but that's been done many times before and didn't really speak to the moment of its creation.

Life Story felt like a cliff notes version of Spider-Man, but needed more breathing room. I don't think it's bad, but I wouldn't rate it as high as others might.

Miles Morales is probably the closest to speaking in the moment but it's hampered by a creative team that didn't really want to get into what it means for a Black and Latino teen taking on the name of the most popular superhero in the world (Bendis' heart was in the right place, but he maybe wasn't the guy who should have been writing those comics). There were fan comics that tackled these issues with more intensity than the main comics did. Later writers began to tackle these issues, and the comics are all the better for them.

But USM is very much in the moment. The narrative of this series (and maybe this new Ultimate line as a whole) is that of a lost generation that feels like their future was taken from them. This is a much deeper story than we have seen from a mainstream Spider-Man comic in a long time. It may be too early to declare it "THE BEST SPIDER-MAN COMIC OF THE LAST 15+ YEARS" but it definitely has the potential to be something really special.

Considering Bendis created Miles Morales, it made sense for him to tell the story.

There could easily have been a backlash if Bendis quit Ultimate Spider-Man and someone else took over with Miles Morales.

Ah yes, the "You only like it because of the marriage" that's being thrown around LOL. Even though Marvel's promotion centered on "Meet the Parkers."

That's not it. Honest!

Reason 1: Ultimate Spider-Man is not chained to 616 history. It's informed by the story we all know, but from the first page it announces this is not the same old same old. This isn't the old Ultimate (which I liked) which was basically 616 but with a "modern" (now dated!) twist. This isn't RYV (and I loved the series) which was basically what if 616 branched off in a different direction. This isn't Life Story (which I don't love but I appreciate as a well-crafted story) which is basically 616 in real time. It's not Spider-Verse and its ad naseam twists on "what if X were bitten." 616 is amazing and spectacular, don't get me wrong. But it's like a Greek myth by now. And it's stopped being about Peter Parker the character with OMD, and now it's more about remixing the myth over and over. Since OMD, how many clone stories? How many Kravens and plays on the word "Last Hunt?" Goblin legacies? Superior was basically KLH taken to extremes and with the entire supporting cast forced to carry the idiot ball and minus the heart and soul at the center of KLH. There hasn't been anything truly original interjected into Peter's character in 616 since...JMS and the idea of totems, IMO. And that's because, again, Peter Parker has been placed in statis since OMD and he's not allowed to change, he's not allowed to grow, he's not allowed to acknowledge his last adventure may have left some scars, he's basically a two-dimensional cartoon character who factory resets at the end of every arc instead of being a living, breathing human character. He certainly can't be self-aware. He just runs around in circles. And that hindered Zdarsky (loved Spider's Shadow, but that was a What If), it hindered Tom Taylor (I really liked Friendly Neighborhood), it definitely hindered Spencer (who I also liked a lot).

Reason 2: Ultimate Spider-Man starts right away with a self-aware Peter, who acts like a believable human being with human emotions and goals and motivations, not a static cartoon character. Ultimate Spider-Man immediately builds a believable world and populates it with other believable human characters who have their own emotions and goals, they're not just objects rotating around Peter that don't have lives of their own. This world has stakes. Visceral, understandable stakes. We know what Peter is risking. We know what Ben and Jonah are risking. We know what Tony is risking. We're immediately engaged in what they want and why in a way that has been vastly missing from 616 for a long time.

And this ISN'T 616. I think people expecting this book to be the usual 616 remix is going to be disappointed. I'm not expecting Gwen or Venom or Black Cat to show up just because this is Spider-Man book so there must be a Gwen version and a Venom version and a Black Cat version. I'm expecting Hickman to tell his own original story, and if they show up it's because they are germane to that. And if they are expecting good 'ol Peter Parker, blockhead, who can never kick the football because of flanderized Parker luck, who must always walk under a cloud of tragedy - I have a feeling they are going to be greatly disappointed as well. This is a different Peter, who has already been tested by tragedy (losing his parents as a teen, losing May) and who has a whole world that has been stolen from him (and his kids' futures) to fight for. We'll see if that's where Hickman is going!

Reason 3: Ultimate Spider-Man is well-written. The craft is evident. The pacing is great. The dialogue sounds natural. The kids sound like kids (Richard reminds me of one of my favorite 11 year olds, who also loves to read and is okay with being who he is). The art is terrific - Checchetto is terrific at character expressions and "acting." And it's literary. This isn't to say that there haven't been well-written Spider books in 616 in the last 15 years. But Ultimate asks of its readers. Or maybe, a better way is to say it offers. It offers subtext, themes, metaphors. There are parallels to be drawn to 616, and parallels to be drawn to the real world. It's thought-provoking, if you want it to be. You can also read it straightforward and get a decent comic book yarn if you like, although if you are looking for superhero shenanigans this first issue would be disappointing. But if you want to read deeper - this book is very rewarding. I didn't expect to still be thinking about scenes in the comic days after I read it, yet I am. It's so much fun to watch smart but thoroughly human characters do smart but thoroughly human things in a well-plotted story, and I have faith in Jonathan Hickman that this will continue.

I'm not as familar with Miles's books, but I will say Cody Ziglar is killing it lately.

Can you expand on what you mean by subtext, themes, metaphors and parallels to the 616 and the real world?

All sorts of work is made by people who craft it around a larger message. Today I was listening to an interview with the screenwriter of The Family Plan, a Mark Wahlberg action comedy, which does not have great reviews but seems to be doing well on streaming and he noted that the story was meant to have a particular metaphor (the movie's about a family man who used to be a secret agent and gets targeted by his old enemies; the metaphor is for people in our lives don't know how cool we used to be.) It's not a guarantee of artistic success, but if it lands, that can elevate something competent into something profound.