WW#6 Preview, Review and Spoilers discussion

[Brian Adkins]

Enjoyed how it makes what could easily be a commonplace superhero(ine) vs. super villain fight look and feel epic.

To echo others, the narration was a bit too much on a lot of pages. Would like to see the pages before they put all that in to see if it's better.

I enjoy the backups, they're amusing and harmless.

[Rightoya]

This is why I hate versus forums and those stupidly huge comic book fights with multiverses and planets or whatever. This is textbook mythic god **** and people will still complain just because the scale is comprehensible.

I don't even have a problem with what happened in this issue in that regard, but Wonder Woman shouldn't be a superhero who operates at a comprehensible scale level at all, except when she is extremely holding back.

[HestiasHearth]

This is why I hate versus forums and those stupidly huge comic book fights with multiverses and planets or whatever. This is textbook mythic god **** and people will still complain just because the scale is comprehensible.

I don't even have a problem with what happened in this issue in that regard, but Wonder Woman shouldn't be a superhero who operates at a comprehensible scale level at all, except when she is extremely holding back.

I don't necessarily want to see her "lassoing planets" (lol) but I have to agree that Diana should easily shrug off an obelisc being thrown at her. Having said that, this little detail did not keep me from enjoying the issue, and I certainly agree with bardkeep that the overall scene of the fight was absolutely awesome.

[Stanlos]

I don't necessarily want to see her "lassoing planets" (lol) but I have to agree that Diana should easily shrug off an obelisc being thrown at her. Having said that, this little detail did not keep me from enjoying the issue, and I certainly agree with bardkeep that the overall scene of the fight was absolutely awesome.

I thought on one YouTube vid the nerd guy tells that there was a herculean effort undertaken specifically to suborn Diana's awareness and make her vulnerable for single moment and that the attacks were tightly coordinated. Still waiting for my copy but that YouTube guy was very complimentary

[Rightoya]

I don't necessarily want to see her "lassoing planets" (lol) but I have to agree that Diana should easily shrug off an obelisc being thrown at her. Having said that, this little detail did not keep me from enjoying the issue, and I certainly agree with bardkeep that the overall scene of the fight was absolutely awesome.

I don't want to see her lassoing stars each other issue, i don't need to see her travel through solar systems in mere moments each other issue, and i definitively don't want to see her to become a Silver age-like superhero or that the planet is any time she fights in danger of getting atomized. But Wonder Woman now and then doing things like that, let alone just lassoing planets, should be definitively the norm, and is very much something that fits to mythical gods especially also in the greek mythology, let alone to DC superheroes of her caliber, heck Flash is far more ridiculous half of the time and even toned down expys like Invincible has Viltrumites fly with faster than light speed or destroy instable planets in groups or He-Man and She-Ra sending moons flying, let alone somewhat expys like Sailor Moon who literally reach Silver age levels, and to this day writers have far more the opposite proven of that specifically Wonder Woman herself or her stories get any better if she is powered down or comprehensible.

[Skytten]

I thought on one YouTube vid the nerd guy tells that there was a herculean effort undertaken specifically to suborn Diana's awareness and make her vulnerable for single moment and that the attacks were tightly coordinated. Still waiting for my copy but that YouTube guy was very complimentary

There is a coordinated attack which is explained in the book. Also it is a juiced up Giganta who throws the obelisk. So the force which Diana is hit with it is much more than the simple weight of the obelisk.

[Vordan]

I don't want to see her lassoing stars each other issue, i don't need to see her travel through solar systems in mere moments each other issue, and i definitively don't want to see her to become a Silver age-like superhero or that the planet is any time she fights in danger of getting atomized. But Wonder Woman now and then doing things like that, let alone just lassoing planets, should be definitively the norm, and is very much something that fits to mythical gods especially also in the greek mythology, let alone to DC superheroes of her caliber, heck Flash is far more ridiculous half of the time and even toned down expys like Invincible has Viltrumites fly with faster than light speed or destroy instable planets in groups or He-Man and She-Ra sending moons flying, let alone somewhat expys like Sailor Moon who literally reach Silver age levels, and to this day writers have far more the opposite proven of that specifically Wonder Woman herself or her stories get any better if she is powered down or comprehensible.

Thing is, Invincible or manga are not ongoing stories. They’re stories with endings in mind, Kirkman initially intended Invincible to operate like a Big 2 title where he’d hand the title off when he was done, but he quickly abandoned that once he realized how much more freeing it was to work towards and ending. Wondy will never end, bugging her to the extent she can casually blow up planets and lasso stars will only result in a nerf, because you can’t sustain a WW that powerful in an ongoing capacity.

[Rightoya]

Thing is, Invincible or manga are not ongoing stories. They’re stories with endings in mind, Kirkman initially intended Invincible to operate like a Big 2 title where he’d hand the title off when he was done, but he quickly abandoned that once he realized how much more freeing it was to work towards and ending. Wondy will never end, bugging her to the extent she can casually blow up planets and lasso stars will only result in a nerf, because you can’t sustain a WW that powerful in an ongoing capacity.

Since when have manga always a definitive end in mind, Dragonball exists since several decades and had Frieza blow up 2 planets in the second arc of the Dragonball Z era, and the still ongoing Dragonball Super even started with Goku putting the whole universe in danger with his punches, there are Wuxia novels with 1000s of chapters who have main characters powerful enough to give even Pertpetua a run for her money, there is the Silver Surfer as just 1 of many comic examples and much more, so why should Wonder Woman as a magical superhero who has alternate dimensions and universes, godly realms, subatomic universes, and the explicit idea that she typically holds back in her lore not be sustainable if she shows now and then that she can do something to astronomical bodies in a basically endless and crazy multiverse with basically endless timelines where her peer Flash as best example does pretty much more ridiculous things even on earth each other tuesday?

[HestiasHearth]

I don't want to see her lassoing stars each other issue, i don't need to see her travel through solar systems in mere moments each other issue, and i definitively don't want to see her to become a Silver age-like superhero or that the planet is any time she fights in danger of getting atomized. But Wonder Woman now and then doing things like that, let alone just lassoing planets, should be definitively the norm, and is very much something that fits to mythical gods especially also in the greek mythology, let alone to DC superheroes of her caliber, heck Flash is far more ridiculous half of the time and even toned down expys like Invincible has Viltrumites fly with faster than light speed or destroy instable planets in groups or He-Man and She-Ra sending moons flying, let alone somewhat expys like Sailor Moon who literally reach Silver age levels, and to this day writers have far more the opposite proven of that specifically Wonder Woman herself or her stories get any better if she is powered down or comprehensible.

Trust me, I agree 100 % with you. I wrote "I don't necessarily want to see her 'lassoing planets' " because that visual has become sort of an ongoing thing on this board whenever the topic of "Wonder Woman always gets jobbed/nerfed by DC Comics" comes up. But yeah, there are things I would certainly do if I were writing her stories that would establish beyond a shadow of a doubt that she could lasso a planet if she had to & that she would NOT be messed up by a normal human-made bullet hitting her neck. And trust me, she would certainly not be affected by Batman kicking her torso, like in that ridiculous pic someone posted above. That would be like an ant trying to kick an elephant in its torso.

[Vordan]

Since when have manga always a definitive end in mind, Dragonball exists since several decades and had Frieza blow up 2 planets in the second arc of the Dragonball Z era, and the still ongoing Dragonball Super even started with Goku putting the whole universe in danger with his punches, there are Wuxia novels with 1000s of chapters who have main characters powerful enough to give even Pertpetua a run for her money, there is the Silver Surfer as just 1 of many comic examples and much more, so why should Wonder Woman as a magical superhero who has alternate dimensions and universes, godly realms, subatomic universes, and the explicit idea that she typically holds back in her lore not be sustainable if she shows now and then that she can do something to astronomical bodies in a basically endless and crazy multiverse with basically endless timelines where her peer Flash as best example does pretty much more ridiculous things even on earth each other tuesday?

Feel free to go ahead and do that - we all have our own preferences for how strong the heroes should be and no opinion on that front is “wrong” - just recognize that won’t stop the writers from having her get shot with bullets and fall over when their own story calls for it. Dragon Ball has an ending, Super takes place prior to it. Also Super has utterly nonsensical power levels, Broly was able to go toe to toe with SSB Goku and Vegeta in his base SS form, precisely because of how ridiculous the power creep has gotten. Silver Surfer does not regularly have an ongoing because writers complain about his power levels and his stories are rarely about feats. They’re more in line with comics like Gaiman’s Sandman where the character is all powerful and the conflicts deal more with mental or moral battles. Diana’s storylines are about fights, and there’s no tension if she can one shot her opponents.

As for the Flash, Flash regularly jobs and gets beat up in ways his powers would seemingly preclude because if he was written to his logical extent he would never be in any danger. The Speed Force is constantly dying or being infected because of how OP it is. Or to use Superman as an example, PKJ buffed him to be so fast he can travel across a universe in a blink of an eye. He still has repeatedly been surprised and hurt by attacks when his reflexes should be so fast that nothing can touch him. The power levels are always going to serve the story, that’s my point.

[bardkeep]

I don't even have a problem with what happened in this issue in that regard, but Wonder Woman shouldn't be a superhero who operates at a comprehensible scale level at all, except when she is extremely holding back.

If you start at 100, there's no room to escalate. In the span of 6 issues we've already seen her go from taking out soldiers and smashing tanks to taking out a goddess and throwing the Washington Monument like a spear. We already know this is just the beginning of a story that spans the entire run and will only get bigger from here.

Power levels always scale to the challenge the hero's facing. Superman often faces off against city-level threats and gets hurt. The Flash notoriously gets hurt by regular bullets all the time. I like when Diana's written really powerful but I find it boring when characters only face ridiculous-scale threats and there has to be struggle along the way.

I thought on one YouTube vid the nerd guy tells that there was a herculean effort undertaken specifically to suborn Diana's awareness and make her vulnerable for single moment and that the attacks were tightly coordinated. Still waiting for my copy but that YouTube guy was very complimentary

Yeah, Sovereign's narration mentioned that Circe was beefing up a max-height Giganta and Angle Man and Psycho were expending so much effort keeping her still and vulnerable that it knocked them out. Plus, even though she gets banged up, she still immediately goes and wins a fight with Grail.

Also Super has utterly nonsensical power levels, Broly was able to go toe to toe with SSB Goku and Vegeta in his base SS form, precisely because of how ridiculous the power creep has gotten.

And even Goku in DBS has been scratched up by bullets and shot through by a laser gun.

On that note, that would be a good way to explain inconsistencies in her durability - bring back Marston's "converting mental energy to physical power" concept and have it function like Dragonball ki, where she and to an extent all of the Amazons can scale up through focus. She maintains her lower "base" level when she's up against regular humans, which is why she has to block bullets. But I digress...