What's up with the pure hatred for Tim Drake nowadays?

[Bat-Meal]

It's a balance, you have to give the character flaws so that they have interesting conflicts, but these flaws should not alienate the majority of the audience.

Well yes, it is a balance as you said - and Tim is clearly out-of-balance IMHO.

[Oberon]

Well yes, it is a balance as you said - and Tim is clearly out-of-balance IMHO.

Been reading this thread and feel Tim is a lot like Bette in these respects - but she too has been taken out of the picture, or rarely thought of.

Like the alt future that had them together, years ago,

maybe someone should do that.

points against: Bette is more Dick's age, but hey

Babs was older than Dick way back, so?

[Aahz]

Like the alt future that had them together, years ago,

I still think that that was originlly supposed to be Steph and they just changed that at the last minute to Bette, after the Batoffice killed Steph in Wargames...

[witchboy]

Been reading this thread and feel Tim is a lot like Bette in these respects - but she too has been taken out of the picture, or rarely thought of.

Like the alt future that had them together, years ago,

maybe someone should do that.

points against: Bette is more Dick's age, but hey

Babs was older than Dick way back, so?

One of the video games had Babs and Tim married. I've never gotten over that.

[Will Evans]

I still think that that was originlly supposed to be Steph and they just changed that at the last minute to Bette, after the Batoffice killed Steph in Wargames...

Nah, that was Geoff doing more of his legacy schtick with Bette becoming Batwoman from Kate. Plus it was in a Titans title, where Bette has priority

[Aahz]

Not that was Geoff doing more of his legacy schtick with Bette becoming Batwoman from Kate. Plus it was in a Titans title, where Bette has priority

More likely Kathy, since that version of Bette creates Kate.

[Bat-Meal]

Been reading this thread and feel Tim is a lot like Bette in these respects - but she too has been taken out of the picture, or rarely thought of.

I don't think it's the same. Bette gets ignored by editorial entirely whereas Tim gets plenty of screen time, plus I'm not aware of Bette being actively hated by a large chunk of the audience - she's not disliked just forgotten about.

[James Cameron]

One of the video games had Babs and Tim married. I've never gotten over that.

The Arkham series, I never even knew Tim/Babs was a thing in that universe until I played Arkham Knight. Pretty disappointing

[MarkRodriguez09]

So are both Tim and Damien Robin now, or does Damian use a different name? It seems Tim is Robin nowadays instead of Red Robin.

[Jackalope89]

So are both Tim and Damien Robin now, or does Damian use a different name? It seems Tim is Robin nowadays instead of Red Robin.

Tim is Robin, again, along with Damian. In story, only the vaguest of reasons was given for demoting himself from Red Robin back to Robin. The Drake name was laughed at, because it was just his surname. And then doubly so when Bendis doubled down with "Drake" being from the duck, not the dragon variant. So dropping that name was fine. Now, going back to Robin, when Damian was in the middle of a well liked run (and thus cutting it short), to say nothing of the stories for Tim as well during that time.

[Bat-Meal]

Tim is Robin, again, along with Damian. In story, only the vaguest of reasons was given for demoting himself from Red Robin back to Robin. The Drake name was laughed at, because it was just his surname. And then doubly so when Bendis doubled down with "Drake" being from the duck, not the dragon variant. So dropping that name was fine. Now, going back to Robin, when Damian was in the middle of a well liked run (and thus cutting it short), to say nothing of the stories for Tim as well during that time.

The Duck suit was a good laugh though.

[marhawkman]

"Impulse likes words!" lol WUT?!?!?

[marvelprince]

Zero sum? I literally said, "at times". Not all the time, but a few times, he has. That doesn't make me a hater, just acknowledging how events have played out. I'm someone that wants every character to be able to have their own niche, to have their own stories told, without stepping on other characters' toes, but still able to crossover with certain story elements too. That includes Tim. But trying to stuff Tim back into the Robin brand, when its already occupied with its own storyline, because "Tim was written to be Robin" or something like that, is stepping on toes. Western comics are not a growing platform, at least not in viable way for the time being. So doing something like that, is going to hurt the brand and both characters, like it or not.

Dick, Jason, even Steph have all found their own niche after Robin (though Steph lost hers, but its still a beloved run as Batgirl, and she's still well regarded as Spoiler). Damian is the current Robin, and finding his own way. Tim has had his time in the role, but misplaced nostalgia, bad writing, and taking not adding anything thats good to him, has held him back. What worked for him in the 90s, isn't working for him now. The less said about Fitzmartin's run, the better. And being the "every man" has clearly gone out the window with no parents, being made angsty/edgy, and other such traits that are either done to death, or are unpopular to read to begin with.

Right now, the best that can be said of Tim's current run, is that Fitzmartin isn't writing him anymore. That's how far his character has fallen.

I have seen Tim fans want to kick other characters out of their own titles so Tim could have their name, in a vain attempt to "renew" him. But if Tim can't move comics as Robin, one of the most well known hero names there is, no chance in hell does he do it as a lesser known name. It may simply be time to shelve Tim until an actual plan for him comes along for him. Maybe have him as a background character for a while, going back to his everyman roots as a college student or private eye.

Ok so you should be able to name a few times that Tim has been pushed another Robin out of a story? Care to name them? Again, Tim being and acting in the capacity as Robin does nothing to impact Damian operating as Robin. Chip is able to tell stories with Tim in one book, Williamson can tell another story with Damian in another title. When half the line is Batman books there is more than enough room for these characters to coexist.

[marvelprince]

Tim is Robin, again, along with Damian. In story, only the vaguest of reasons was given for demoting himself from Red Robin back to Robin. The Drake name was laughed at, because it was just his surname. And then doubly so when Bendis doubled down with "Drake" being from the duck, not the dragon variant. So dropping that name was fine. Now, going back to Robin, when Damian was in the middle of a well liked run (and thus cutting it short), to say nothing of the stories for Tim as well during that time.

We really worried that Duck's aren't fearsome in a family with Robins, canaries, bluebirds and larks? And watch some videos of ducks trying to mate. They get pretty vicious. Plus they fly and swim. Ducks > dragons.

[Rac7d*]

Been reading this thread and feel Tim is a lot like Bette in these respects - but she too has been taken out of the picture, or rarely thought of.

Like the alt future that had them together, years ago,

maybe someone should do that.

points against: Bette is more Dick's age, but hey

Babs was older than Dick way back, so?

its easy to phase out bette .the family has so many batgirls already she isnt missed
5 years ago, it proably would have casued some ruckus at first but Tim could been removed, it defintly would have helped duke out
but then the rebrand