DC Comic Sales March

[Confuzzled]

Meanwhile, the X-books have like 3 or 4 ongoing team books back in "Dawn of X" started. Yet, nothing complain about heavier workload happen at the X-Office. The same goes for the Avengers run.

TBF Marvel is WAY more dependent on X-Men and Avengers than DC is on any of their team books. There are 7 characters from the Bat franchise alone RN who are carrying long-running solo titles.

[skyvolt2000]

Meanwhile, the X-books have like 3 or 4 ongoing team books back in "Dawn of X" started. Yet, nothing complain about heavier workload happen at the X-Office. The same goes for the Avengers run.

I think the issue at DC is WHEN are those artist getting the scripts to even start drawing.

Along with how many other projects are some of them doing? Like a Jamal Campbell-as MANY covers as he does-how he does Superman must have been a miracle.

Along with probably pay rates are an issue.

[HsssH]

Well, he did only 6 issues so I guess not that big of a miracle.

[Leancarp900]

I've heard that DC's had trouble getting artists for team books because of the heavier workload. Recent team books like Doom Patrol, Outsiders, and Suicide Squad have been minis instead of ongoings, which probably helps with this, and of course JSA has it's own problems.

Yeah, Tom King said the same thing.

[skyvolt2000]

Could someone be kind enough to clarify when JL was at its peak in terms of sales? If I had to guess, it was probably in the late 90s/early 00s when DCAU JL and JLU were airing but I am just blindly spitballing.

Under McDuffie ill fated run-it was still a top 10-20 something book. Now his last issue was ranked 26 at 55K orders. However depending on what else came out that 55K could have gotten you a top 15-20 spot. By New 52 time the book was doing 40K.

Pretty much a Justice League book has been a 50 book.
The last issue of 2006 JLA was 75K orders.
Why hold off? This quote sums it up best

Covid layoffs and Didio's failed 5G resulted in people, both creators and editors, leaving. I think it's clear we are still dealing with the aftermath of these decisions. The only reason for example Williamson became their top writer is because of these decisions left a gaping hole in DC's editorial/creative rosters. The fact that bat-editorial has been decimated since Rebirth shows there's serious structural problems within that corner of DC.

I see, well I think that's part of it, but I also think that DC had some questionable hiring practices the last few years, in which at one point (it seems to have stopped) writers felt like they were getting hired on their political persuasion instead of merit.

Barring something morally serious, merit should be the only consideration when hiring writers at DC.

And where is this evidence that Conrad and the rest were NOT hired based on Merit?

How many folks under the good old boy network got gigs because of FRIENDS? Yet nobody wants to talk about that. Somebody kept giving Scott Lodbell work. Eddie Berganza long HOW LONG was he at DC? That women were kept away from him. JT Krul and his collection of badly done books. Cry for Justice anyone?

Vita was writing stuff long before DC even BOTHERED to hire Them. Becky was doing books for Vertigo and Darkhorse before sniffing Wonder Woman and did Gotham Academy-a book DC chooses to bury. Most of these folks had careers before coming to DC.

The writing pool is not as deep as it once was. Because of the FAILURE of DC to build up a talent pool of writers. Which is now made hard by the competition and crowd funding.

Most don't want to do that or never get asked. So what happens? You got Steelworks by Worf or Cyborg by a college student or the mess known as Tim Drake Robin and whatever that book is pretending to be the Outsiders. Joshua Williamson doing tons of books.

Vita and those folks are not chumps as with MANY before them-it tends to be the environment of the DC that is the issue. How many folks have crashed and burned here yet have done fine elsewhere?

G Willow Wilson-who is now loved for Poison Ivy did a mini called Vixen that had an issue CUT in 2007. She went to Marvel and worked on some book about a Muslim girl in the Swamps of New Jersey. That run broke Cassandra Cain's record as most solo issues by an Asian female among the big two. A book that wasn't suppose to make issue 7.
Was Wilson a bad writer at Dc? NO. She was given an impossible assignment with Vixen.

Sometimes its not the writer but the book that get. As we know some of these gigs are given to writers based on plots by EDITORS not pitches.

[skyvolt2000]

Well, he did only 6 issues so I guess not that big of a miracle.

For HIM-yes that is.

Still don't how he did 18 issues of Far Sector.

[Confuzzled]

I think the issue at DC is WHEN are those artist getting the scripts to even start drawing.

Along with how many other projects are some of them doing? Like a Jamal Campbell-as MANY covers as he does-how he does Superman must have been a miracle.

Along with probably pay rates are an issue.

I don't think that's the issue. Until recently, people kept saying DC pays better than Marvel.

Unless David Zaslav's cost-cutting tactics have trickled all the way down to the comics as well.

[Confuzzled]

I guess I should have been more specific. I prefer vigilante heroes over metahumans, so gritty for me just means a writer who can write a really good street fighting story with broken bones, dislocated shoulders ect....seems to have become a lost art at DC.

I see, well I think that's part of it, but I also think that DC had some questionable hiring practices the last few years, in which at one point (it seems to have stopped) writers felt like they were getting hired on their political persuasion instead of merit.

Vita Ayala, Becky Cloonan, Michael Conrad, & Meagan Fitzmartin to name a few have to be some of the worst writers I've ever come across at DC, and apparently it's just not me, because they sunk every title they worked on.

I’m not ideologically aligned with any part of the political spectrum, so I don’t really care if a writer is left wing or right wing….I do care if they can write well though.

Today Frank Miller or Chuck Dixon would most likely not be hired by DC because of their personal politics, which is a shame because they can write 1000 times better than Becky Cloonan and Michael Conrad.
Barring something morally serious, merit should be the only consideration when hiring writers at DC.

Yeah no, I don't see any of Frank Miller's books breaking out today as they did in the 80s. Not the same political climate, not the same comics industry. Even Miller's politics have moved much more to the center over the years and he has said he would never write stuff like Holy Terror again.

Also, where are the Alan Moores, Grant Morrisons, Neil Gaimans, Chris Claremonts of today? At Marvel is where (Jonathan Hickman, Al Ewing, Kieron Gillen etc.)
Most of the comic legends from the past are what the right today would call "radical left".

*Also, Neal Adams's daughter convinced him to give Miller a chance because she felt sorry for him. Adams himself thought Miller's portfolio was awful. So much for being hired on merit lol

[Captain Nostalgia]

Under McDuffie ill fated run-it was still a top 10-20 something book. Now his last issue was ranked 26 at 55K orders. However depending on what else came out that 55K could have gotten you a top 15-20 spot. By New 52 time the book was doing 40K.

Pretty much a Justice League book has been a 50 book.
The last issue of 2006 JLA was 75K orders.
Why hold off? This quote sums it up best




And where is this evidence that Conrad and the rest were NOT hired based on Merit?

How many folks under the good old boy network got gigs because of FRIENDS? Yet nobody wants to talk about that. Somebody kept giving Scott Lodbell work. Eddie Berganza long HOW LONG was he at DC? That women were kept away from him. JT Krul and his collection of badly done books. Cry for Justice anyone?

Vita was writing stuff long before DC even BOTHERED to hire Them. Becky was doing books for Vertigo and Darkhorse before sniffing Wonder Woman and did Gotham Academy-a book DC chooses to bury. Most of these folks had careers before coming to DC.

The writing pool is not as deep as it once was. Because of the FAILURE of DC to build up a talent pool of writers. Which is now made hard by the competition and crowd funding.

Most don't want to do that or never get asked. So what happens? You got Steelworks by Worf or Cyborg by a college student or the mess known as Tim Drake Robin and whatever that book is pretending to be the Outsiders. Joshua Williamson doing tons of books.

Vita and those folks are not chumps as with MANY before them-it tends to be the environment of the DC that is the issue. How many folks have crashed and burned here yet have done fine elsewhere?

G Willow Wilson-who is now loved for Poison Ivy did a mini called Vixen that had an issue CUT in 2007. She went to Marvel and worked on some book about a Muslim girl in the Swamps of New Jersey. That run broke Cassandra Cain's record as most solo issues by an Asian female among the big two. A book that wasn't suppose to make issue 7.
Was Wilson a bad writer at Dc? NO. She was given an impossible assignment with Vixen.

Sometimes its not the writer but the book that get. As we know some of these gigs are given to writers based on plots by EDITORS not pitches.

I don't usually respond to your mad rants, but since you misquoted me. (Something you routinely seem to do to people)

I never listed G. Willow Wilson because I think she's a brilliant writer.

As you stated, she started at DC and it didn't work out, went to Marvel and prooved herself. In other words Merit.

The same can't be said for the rest...writing some mediocre stuff for the indies, doesn't mean you can cut it in the big leagues, and...

It most definitely doesn't mean you should be given the keys to the castle to write Wonder Woman & Robin and drive their sales down to historic lows right to the graveyard.

[Aahz]

I think the bigger problem are Editors, who are in the end of the day the people who decide who get's hired, what storylines are written and stuff like that.

[Confuzzled]

It most definitely doesn't mean you should be given the keys to the castle to write Wonder Woman & Robin and drive their sales down to historic lows right to the graveyard.

Since Damian stepped in, interest in Tim Drake dropped to a historic low as well. No Meghan Fitzmartin, no Drake Robin book in the first place.

Also, I like how you conveniently sidestepped my reply about Frank Miller being a pity hire on Neal Adams's own admission and having nothing to do with merit.

[Aahz]

Vita Ayala, Becky Cloonan, Michael Conrad, & Meagan Fitzmartin to name a few have to be some of the worst writers I've ever come across at DC, and apparently it's just not me, because they sunk every title they worked on.

At least Vita Ayala and Meagan Fitzmartin don't seem to get any titles at DC or Marvel at the moment.

[Badou]

We aren't talking enough about how consistent Poison Ivy has been in sales over the last two years. Probably the most consistently selling female title since Spider-Girl in the early 00s?

Her book is selling better than I think people would have guessed before its launch, but her book does have a lot of variant covers, right? I think every issue has a 1:25 and 1:50 incentive covers. A Nightwing only has a 1:25 every issue as a comparison.

[Aahz]

Her book is selling better than I think people would have guessed before its launch, but her book does have a lot of variant covers, right?

But it is still selling, I mean usually you wouldn't expect a Poison Ivy book to last for more than 12 issues.

[Badou]

But it is still selling, I mean usually you wouldn't expect a Poison Ivy book to last for more than 12 issues.

That is true, but it makes me curious how it sells in trade which kind of strips away a lot of the art/cover incentives.