Anyone else hate the Wolverine and Jean romance from the Films in comparsion to the comics??

[steeplejack2112]

Awesome thread. I agree totally. I've told a lot of other people who have never read an X-men comic that what is going on on the screen is nowhere near what it's like in the book. I'm pissed that Cyclops was totally blown over in the movies. Of course to me, all of the movies except First Class seem to make Wolverine a big part of the story. Why not just call the movies Wolverine: And Some Other X-Men Thrown In for Good Measure. Sorry, I got off track of the main subject.

[grinningdemon]

Sure Wolverine can lead. He's only had 200 years of life experience.

He did plenty of "snarking at the leader" in those movies.

Anyway, he wouldn't necessarily have to be the leader in the event they reboot the character and build up to the Jean/Logan stuff in a proper way.

Cyclops could be the field leader.

I don't think there is a proper way to build this up...it does nothing good for either character or for Cyclops if he's only there to watch...even those that actually like the pairing mostly like it for the unrequited love and the triangle aspect...very few of them actually want to see them together...the lopsided Wolverine-centric movies are the only reason this has even become relevant...can I ask? were you actually a fan of the comics before the movies or did you come to the comics afterwards?

As for the 200 years life experience making him leadership material, Wolverine didn't remember most of that for most of the time he's been around in the comics or movies and most fans liked it better that way...and it still doesn't make him a good leader.

[Kikaze]

Sure Wolverine can lead. He's only had 200 years of life experience.

He did plenty of "snarking at the leader" in those movies.

Anyway, he wouldn't necessarily have to be the leader in the event they reboot the character and build up to the Jean/Logan stuff in a proper way.

Cyclops could be the field leader.

i do think a reboot is in order (the continuity doesnt make sense anymore, neither does tha characterization, way too many years of stories end up holding the franchise back).
its not a bad idea for cyclops to be the field leader but not married/engaged/whatever to jean grey, and her to be logan's girl or whatever.

also, leadership has to do with charisma (confidence, self-belief, charming personality that keeps the team glued together, vision that drives them, persistence that forces the team to push themselves harder), and team tactics. not with solo prowess. thats why in the military an officer with 1 year experience and 4 years training ranks higher than a 15-years-experienced grizzled veteran, and in many countries, soldiers that havent finished some academy are NEVER allowed to gain officer status no matter how much experience they have.

[HeSoSlim]

I don't think there is a proper way to build this up...it does nothing good for either character or for Cyclops if he's only there to watch...even those that actually like the pairing mostly like it for the unrequited love and the triangle aspect...very few of them actually want to see them together...the lopsided Wolverine-centric movies are the only reason this has even become relevant...can I ask? were you actually a fan of the comics before the movies or did you come to the comics afterwards?

As for the 200 years life experience making him leadership material, Wolverine didn't remember most of that for most of the time he's been around in the comics or movies and most fans liked it better that way...and it still doesn't make him a good leader.

lol Yes I liked the comics before the movies. I know the entire histories of the characters.

Who says a Jean/Logan direction would have to have anything to do with Cyclops?

Cyke could be focused on being the leader.

[grinningdemon]

i do think a reboot is in order (the continuity doesnt make sense anymore, neither does tha characterization, way too many years of stories end up holding the franchise back).
its not a bad idea for cyclops to be the field leader but not married/engaged/whatever to jean grey, and her to be logan's girl or whatever.

We'll have to agree to disagree on that...Scott/Jean were such a big part of the X-Men mythos for so long (and still are in the comics), it's not right to glaze over or ignore that in the films...and Wolverine is far more interesting on his own anyway.

[grinningdemon]

lol Yes I liked the comics before the movies. I know the entire histories of the characters.

Who says a Jean/Logan direction would have to have anything to do with Cyclops?

Cyke could be focused on being the leader.

Because ignoring such a big part of the characters and their histories does them ALL a disservice...and, if you take the love triangle aspect out of it, I doubt many would be interested in Jean/Wolverine...personally, I would love to see a proper film adaptation of the Phoenix Saga at some point...and subbing Wolverine for Scott in that would be pissing all over it even more than X-Men 3 did.

[HeSoSlim]

I actually don't care to see the Phoenix addressed in the movies anymore and I absolutely LOVE the Phoenix mythos. I'm curious as to what role you perceive the guy having in the story though, that couldn't be filled by Wolverine or any other male. Not sure how it was Cyclops' character that made that story what it was...

[grinningdemon]

I actually don't care to see the Phoenix addressed in the movies anymore and I absolutely LOVE the Phoenix mythos. I'm curious as to what role you perceive the guy having in the story though, that couldn't be filled by Wolverine or any other male. Not sure how it was Cyclops' character that made that story what it was...

The cornerstone of the story was the love story...aside from Jean, Scott was the most prominent character in the story and subbing anyone else in that role would be a betrayal of the source material...and a bad move anyway given the recent uptake in Cyclops' popularity (and the fact that he never got much attention in the movies before would only make it a bigger mistake as the character needs to be developed...and I kind of think, if they did reboot the franchise, they would try to make it a little more balanced this time around and not all focused on Wolverine since so many would still be missing Jackman.

That said, by your logic, what part of the Wolverine/Jean relationship would be essential to the films that couldn't be done with any other male character? It only got so much focus because Wolverine was the focus of all the movies...if he's not, then it's not necessary. It also reminds me of an old "What If?" story where they basically did sub Wolverine is Cyclops' role...and it ended with Phoenix blowing up the world.

And if you think they would use Jean and not address the Phoenix, you're fooling yourself.

[Kikaze]

..."its important" because his relationship with Jean and being leader of the x-men was THE ONLY THING THAT DEFINED cyclops under claremont, so if he isnt the definite leader and totaly owns Jean in a claremont-inspired film, he ends up overshadowed.

say what you will. i've read CC, and whenever he wanted to give cyclops some spotlight to avoid making him wallpaper he didnt know what to do(because claremont WAS a good writer and knew that wallpaper characters are a lame concept even if he didnt like scott). he either made a good speech , or had some chick drooling for him. in CC's good days, he had some moments with jean. but as a personality, he never realy got any character development.

[grinningdemon]

..."its important" because his relationship with Jean and being leader of the x-men was THE ONLY THING THAT DEFINED cyclops under claremont, so if he isnt the definite leader and totaly owns Jean in a claremont-inspired film, he ends up overshadowed.

say what you will. i've read CC, and whenever he wanted to give cyclops some spotlight to avoid making him wallpaper he didnt know what to do(because claremont WAS a good writer and knew that wallpaper characters are a lame concept even if he didnt like scott). he either made a good speech , or had some chick drooling for him. in CC's good days, he had some moments with jean. but as a personality, he never realy got any character development.

I think there was quite a bit of development early on both in his leadership role and in dealing with Jean's transformation...and I agree those two things were his defining characteristics then (leadership still is...and arguably Jean too)...but more than the character itself, it was a big part of the X-Men mythos since the beginning and leaving it out just seems wrong to me...I also think theirs was an epic love story formed the center of many big X stories over the years and I don't believe Wolverine/Jean could do that...there's a reason they never went that route in the comics...another thing, the rivalry between Wolverine and Cyclops stemming from Jean is far more interesting and compelling than Wolverine and Jean together would ever be...Cyclops/Wolverine are actually the more interesting part of the triangle...Astonishing X-Men #1 demonstrated that quite well.

[1bulma1]

I aprtially agree as well. wolverine has his own films so why the hell is he still the star of the xmen films. I love hugh jackman but when he hangs up as wolverine. I will like to see an xmen film as well.

[1bulma1]

we do not want wolverine and jean. WE WANT SCOTT AND JEAN.

[1bulma1]

Awesome thread.

THANK YOU

1bulma1 is Back.

I am just happen people are agree with me. the wolverine and jean thing in the film was plain annoying.

[maxi_miceli]

If they reboot the Wolverine character with a younger actor, they can start the Jean/Logan romance over and do it even better.

You know that that is already impossible right? because Jean and Scott are together at the end of Ends of future past and that's the rebooted universe

[Greg]

I've actually thought about this. But I've just accepted it for what it was despite the fact that they totally undermined Scott due to this. It never made sense story wise due to Logan really only knowing Jean for less than a week.

All that said, I did like their scenes and how it was used in the last Wolverine movie.