Hawkeye Appreciation

[OOTCS]

Do Skrulls Count? Cause of so: They both killed a whole lot more people.

Ohhhh you're right lol. I always forget to count the Skrulls!

[Sneakronicity]

So far every writer has ignored it. And it's easy enough to say that she was lying to make the Phantom Rider go away.

It looks like she and Spidey are breaking up, so that gives her and Clint an opening to get back together.

Even if Clint wanted a relationship with Natasha, I don't see her choosing him over Bucky, considering how strong her feelings are/were for Bucky, and the truth is that it doesn't make sense for Clint to ask for that. The reasons that he and Bobbi broke up—they couldn't agree on whether it's ever okay to kill, she was in a dark place and pushing him away—all apply to an even greater extent to Natasha. For all her talk, Bobbi's only ever killed one person that we know of (so she and Clint are even!). Natasha does it every other Thursday, and if Clint asked her to stop, she wouldn't get angry like Bobbi did; she'd just laugh.

I have the super unpopular opinion that neither Clint/Bobbi nor Natasha/Bucky should happen again any time soon, and not because I'm biased by my ship. Clint and Natasha are both fully developed characters in their own right, and have had multiple important relationships each. Neither of them have been defined by any one relationship, but both Bobbi and Bucky have. Has Bobbi ever really had chance to shine on her own without either being in a relationship with Clint, or having the shadow of that relationship looming over her? Even when she was in Secret Avengers, her introduction pointed out she was Clint's ex, as if that is her defining characteristic. Bucky made out a little better, but only because it was Natasha's character that suffered to develop his. The problem with that relationship for him is that it stagnates his character. He's so stuck in the past that he can never seem to move on from it, and being with someone who is a constant reminder of that horrible time, even if she's supposedly the only good thing about it, isn't healthy. I find the whole relationships disturbing and unhealthy personally, though I know I'm alone in that on these boards, but I do feel like Bucky needs to be with someone who isn't part of his past, someone who can truly help him move on.

As for Clint and Natasha, they are both strong characters on their own that a relationship between the two of them wouldn't damage either of them. Would it work in the long run? Probably not for the reasons you mentioned, but it would be interesting to see them try. They have both grown and changed so much since they were first together, and been through a lot together, and after Secret Empire if feel like they deserve some sort of payoff. Ultimately I'm just happy that they be recognized as important to each other in any capacity, romantic or not, and hope we at least get a heartfelt reunion when Natasha inevitably returns. A girl can dream, right?

[Matternativ]

I have the super unpopular opinion that neither Clint/Bobbi nor Natasha/Bucky should happen again any time soon, and not because I'm biased by my ship. Clint and Natasha are both fully developed characters in their own right, and have had multiple important relationships each. Neither of them have been defined by any one relationship, but both Bobbi and Bucky have. Has Bobbi ever really had chance to shine on her own without either being in a relationship with Clint, or having the shadow of that relationship looming over her? Even when she was in Secret Avengers, her introduction pointed out she was Clint's ex, as if that is her defining characteristic. Bucky made out a little better, but only because it was Natasha's character that suffered to develop his. The problem with that relationship for him is that it stagnates his character. He's so stuck in the past that he can never seem to move on from it, and being with someone who is a constant reminder of that horrible time, even if she's supposedly the only good thing about it, isn't healthy. I find the whole relationships disturbing and unhealthy personally, though I know I'm alone in that on these boards, but I do feel like Bucky needs to be with someone who isn't part of his past, someone who can truly help him move on.

As for Clint and Natasha, they are both strong characters on their own that a relationship between the two of them wouldn't damage either of them. Would it work in the long run? Probably not for the reasons you mentioned, but it would be interesting to see them try. They have both grown and changed so much since they were first together, and been through a lot together, and after Secret Empire if feel like they deserve some sort of payoff. Ultimately I'm just happy that they be recognized as important to each other in any capacity, romantic or not, and hope we at least get a heartfelt reunion when Natasha inevitably returns. A girl can dream, right?

That's pretty much the reason why I thought it was a good idea that Bobbi was with Parker.
Other than Hunter he is a "legit" character so to speak and it's a whole new chapter for her.

[OOTCS]

I'm definitely sympathetic to the argument that Bobbi needs some time by herself so that she can be defined outside of her relationship to Clint. But I think that's an argument that could have been made better 7-8 years ago, when they broke up. At the end of Widowmaker, it seemed like there was an implicit promise that eventually they would find their way back to each other. It would have been great if Marvel had used that time apart to do something great with her, but in reality, she was turned into a background character for a long time, until very recently. In New Avengers and Agents of SHIELD, she didn't have any of her own storylines, and with the exception of Secret Avengers, the writers didn't use her much until recently, when she became mentor to Silk and liason to Parker Industries and got a short-lived solo series. At this point, her resume has filled out, so to speak, and I think it's been long enough.

Don't get me wrong--I don't want her to be a supporting character/girlfriend in Clint's book, but I don't think that being a supporting character/girlfriend in Spider-Man's book is any better. If she could stay on in Amazing Spider-Man as Spidey's superhero partner while she dated Clint on the side in that and other books (and he dated MJ on the side, although that's a conversation for a different thread, I guess), I'd consider that a win-win.

(Also, seeing Bobbi and Peter as working partners at the same time as Clint and Natasha are working partners (with Bobbi and Clint dating, sorrynotsorry I can't help how much I love them as a ship) would be a cool parallel because she first appeared as Mockingbird in a team-up with Spider-Man, in the same way that Clint was brought into the costumed hero/villain/whatever world as a team with Natasha.)

[Freud]

I'm definitely sympathetic to the argument that Bobbi needs some time by herself so that she can be defined outside of her relationship to Clint. But I think that's an argument that could have been made better 7-8 years ago, when they broke up. At the end of Widowmaker, it seemed like there was an implicit promise that eventually they would find their way back to each other. It would have been great if Marvel had used that time apart to do something great with her, but in reality, she was turned into a background character for a long time, until very recently. In New Avengers and Agents of SHIELD, she didn't have any of her own storylines, and with the exception of Secret Avengers, the writers didn't use her much until recently, when she became mentor to Silk and liason to Parker Industries and got a short-lived solo series. At this point, her resume has filled out, so to speak, and I think it's been long enough.

Don't get me wrong--I don't want her to be a supporting character/girlfriend in Clint's book, but I don't think that being a supporting character/girlfriend in Spider-Man's book is any better. If she could stay on in Amazing Spider-Man as Spidey's superhero partner while she dated Clint on the side in that and other books (and he dated MJ on the side, although that's a conversation for a different thread, I guess), I'd consider that a win-win.

(Also, seeing Bobbi and Peter as working partners at the same time as Clint and Natasha are working partners (with Bobbi and Clint dating, sorrynotsorry I can't help how much I love them as a ship) would be a cool parallel because she first appeared as Mockingbird in a team-up with Spider-Man, in the same way that Clint was brought into the costumed hero/villain/whatever world as a team with Natasha.)

Honestly I think we need a new Hawkeye and Mockingbird book where they eventually end up together again. Could also work because they made such a big thing about Bobbi not feeling like she belonged with the Avengers, and at the moment that seems to apply to Clint too, to a certain extent.

[Sneakronicity]

sorrynotsorry I can't help how much I love them as a ship

Hey, no judging. That's exactly how I feel about Clint/Natasha, so I understand this feel.

[cc008]

Don't get me wrong--I don't want her to be a supporting character/girlfriend in Clint's book, but I don't think that being a supporting character/girlfriend in Spider-Man's book is any better. If she could stay on in Amazing Spider-Man as Spidey's superhero partner while she dated Clint on the side in that and other books (and he dated MJ on the side, although that's a conversation for a different thread, I guess), I'd consider that a win-win.

That would also potentially give us more Spider-Man/Hawkeye team ups and that's what they call a win-win-win.

[OOTCS]

Honestly I think we need a new Hawkeye and Mockingbird book where they eventually end up together again. Could also work because they made such a big thing about Bobbi not feeling like she belonged with the Avengers, and at the moment that seems to apply to Clint too, to a certain extent.

As long as it doesn't just feel like a repeat of New Avengers: The Reunion, then I'd be all for it. I don't want it to feel like one more round on the ferris wheel, you know?

Hey, no judging. That's exactly how I feel about Clint/Natasha, so I understand this feel.

I'm glad we can relate to the same feeling, even while hoping for different outcomes. Fandom can be tricky that way, but at the end of the day, we all just want our favorite fictional characters to be happy.

That would also potentially give us more Spider-Man/Hawkeye team ups and that's what they call a win-win-win.

Yes! Isn't Hawkeye scheduled to appear in one or another Spidey book in the next few months, anyway?

[cc008]

Yes! Isn't Hawkeye scheduled to appear in one or another Spidey book in the next few months, anyway?

I'll have to check when I get home from the gym.. I've recently picked up both Amazing and Spectacular Spidey, so that would be wonderful.

Unrelated: I was at my LCS yesterday (picked up ToS 101, loved it) and noticed Hawkeye on the cover of Ewing's The New Avengers. Is Clint prominent in that? Worth reading at all?

[Matternativ]

As long as it doesn't just feel like a repeat of New Avengers: The Reunion, then I'd be all for it. I don't want it to feel like one more round on the ferris wheel, you know?



I'm glad we can relate to the same feeling, even while hoping for different outcomes. Fandom can be tricky that way, but at the end of the day, we all just want our favorite fictional characters to be happy.



Yes! Isn't Hawkeye scheduled to appear in one or another Spidey book in the next few months, anyway?

I only know of the Peter Parker one. Did anyone check that out btw?

I'll have to check when I get home from the gym.. I've recently picked up both Amazing and Spectacular Spidey, so that would be wonderful.

Unrelated: I was at my LCS yesterday (picked up ToS 101, loved it) and noticed Hawkeye on the cover of Ewing's The New Avengers. Is Clint prominent in that? Worth reading at all?

Here, that's the only worthwhile scene if you wanna check that book out for Barton only.
That and one were he shoots while standing on a Quinjet wing which is pretty cool.

He did have a subplot in it with Songbird but it can be summed up in two sentences or so.
spoilers:

She reveals herself as a double Agent for Shield and betrays the team, even attacks him which leads to the scene above were he is without his weapon. Turns out she's actually a triple agent in the end but she can't tell him. She is sad, he is pissed. The end.

end of spoilers

Then CW II happened and he was off the team. Obviously.

[cc008]

Thanks for that! Unfortunate it wasn't more worthwhile, but I guess I won't have to spend anything on finding that out now.

[cc008]

Yes! Isn't Hawkeye scheduled to appear in one or another Spidey book in the next few months, anyway?

All I've found is an appearance on a cover of Spider-Man/Deadpool for April:

[Matternativ]

Thanks for that! Unfortunate it wasn't more worthwhile, but I guess I won't have to spend anything on finding that out now.

Yeah. It wasn't a bad read though but Clint clearly was just added to the mix because Marvel told Ewing to.
He literally introduced himself to the team with: "Hey I'm Clint. Your super secret Shield spy."(or something similar) since he was added to the team from Shield to keep an eye out on the new AIM.

All I've found is an appearance on a cover of Spider-Man/Deadpool for April:

Haha. I'm sure he'll play a big role in that if the Cover is anything to go by

[cc008]

Haha. I'm sure he'll play a big role in that if the Cover is anything to go by

I hope he has some involvement! Hawkeye vs Deadpool is one of my favorite minis ever

[Matternativ]

I hope he has some involvement! Hawkeye vs Deadpool is one of my favorite minis ever

That was a fun one, yes. I wish they'd have ever told us whether Clint was under the unfluence of Black Cat's curse or whatever it was or if it was just his usual bad luck.