Superman vs Hulk (absolute historical peak versions)

[Matt the Manly]

If Earth 2 Superman was on par with PC Superman, I am surprised he flew the kid through a red sun to begin with. By rights he should have been more than capable of roflstomping the kid into submission by just flicking him lightly.

Thats... the point
earth 2 superman was not on PC levels. he fought evenly with kal el
Prime on the other hand strangely managed to retain his powers, moving around planets and stuff
or was suppsed to anyway before conner ( regular superboy) made him bleed


Prime was incredibly inconsistent. on one hand he was supposed to be as powerful as a PC Kryptonian , on the other , his feats didnt match up

[Matt the Manly]

See, that only holds up if you think of DC as a place that understands continuity and/or avoids massive PIS. But it's not such a place.

Exactly.
Suffice to say though Kal L, was visibly below PC levels. DC pretended Prime was at PC Levels....except when he wasnt

[Cthulhu_of_R'lyeh]

See, that only holds up if you think of DC as a place that understands continuity and/or avoids massive PIS. But it's not such a place.

Cthulhu understands not this ... kon-tin-ewity.

[Cody]

Thats... the point
earth 2 superman was not on PC levels. he fought evenly with kal el

Wat? You just said he was not at pc levels, yet he fought evenly with PC Superman. That would more or less make him at PC Superman level.

Which involves my next point: if both were PC Kryptonians, then by rights; even if Prime was at PC Kryptonian level, at best he should only be as strong as PC Superboy, meaning he would be quite a bit weaker than a fully grown PC Superman and treated like absolute trash.

Granted Prime was never actually shown to be at PC levels but you know.

Now I know the idea of Prime actually giving Earth 2 Superman a fight is hugely SMvFL and Prime is the most inconsistent character ever written by DC. All I am trying to find out with this is how strong Earth 2 Superman was during pre and post crisis.

[big_adventure]

Exactly.
Suffice to say though Kal L, was visibly below PC levels. DC pretended Prime was at PC Levels....except when he wasnt

Yup

Cthulhu understands not this ... kon-tin-ewity.

Double Yup.

[Tanrage]

One thing that annoyed the hell out of me was that Prime was originally explicitly not Yellow Sun powered (He was able to break out of a red sunlight jail that rendered E1 Supes powerless) and was strongly hinted to actually be powered by electromagnetism instead. Come IC this was all ignored of course.

[big_adventure]

One thing that annoyed the hell out of me was that Prime was originally explicitly not Yellow Sun powered (He was able to break out of a red sunlight jail that rendered E1 Supes powerless) and was strongly hinted to actually be powered by electromagnetism instead. Come IC this was all ignored of course.

Hey, if you are only annoyed to hell about one thing about Prime, well, you are like 3 standard deviations less annoyed than the mean.

[Tanrage]

Hey, if you are only annoyed to hell about one thing about Prime, well, you are like 3 standard deviations less annoyed than the mean.

It's one of many things things, it's just one that doesn't get mentioned enough!

[The Drunkard Kid]

The confusion about Superboy Prime's levels compared to the actual PC Kryptonians is adorable in light of the fact that Post-Crisis Darkseid is technically the same exact guy as Pre-Crisis Darkseid since he kept from getting erased and rebooted at the end of Crisis on Infinite Earths.

[Pendaran]

If Earth 2 Superman was on par with PC Superman, I am surprised he flew the kid through a red sun to begin with. By rights he should have been more than capable of roflstomping the kid into submission by just flicking him lightly.

Infinite Crisis basically treated as a hilarious suggestion how powerful Earth 2 Superman had been depicted as previously.

[Matt the Manly]

Wat? You just said he was not at pc levels, yet he fought evenly with PC Superman. That would more or less make him at PC Superman level.

Kal el in this case refers to post crisis superman
Earth 2 Superman was portrayed as post crisis supermans equal, in the post crisis era

Which involves my next point: if both were PC Kryptonians, then by rights; even if Prime was at PC Kryptonian level, at best he should only be as strong as PC Superboy, meaning he would be quite a bit weaker than a fully grown PC Superman and treated like absolute trash.

they had , all 3 of them , lost their powers at this point

Granted Prime was never actually shown to be at PC levels but you know.

Now I know the idea of Prime actually giving Earth 2 Superman a fight is hugely SMvFL and Prime is the most inconsistent character ever written by DC. All I am trying to find out with this is how strong Earth 2 Superman was during pre and post crisis.

basically Dc remembered that earth two superman was supposed to be equal to earth one superman in both pre and post crisis era


What they decided to conveniently forget was that earth one supermans power levels had dropped drastically in the post crisis era

For some reason again, they decided to be inconsistent with that logic too with regards to Prime, who had been portrayed as, at best earth one supermans equal upto Crisis on Infinite Earths, but come infinite crisis, he was allegedly operating on a higher level

[Guy Smiley]

Which involves my next point: if both were PC Kryptonians, then by rights; even if Prime was at PC Kryptonian level, at best he should only be as strong as PC Superboy, meaning he would be quite a bit weaker than a fully grown PC Superman and treated like absolute trash.

Ah, but PC Kryptonians weren't all the same - they somewhat explicitly worked differently from universe to universe - thus stories like the one in which Superman is attacked by a berserk Superboy, fresh from some mind-altering escapade in the 30th century. A few Legionnaires then show up to help Superman subdue Superboy, with Superman mentioning that he never had powers at that age, and also that Superboy is actually stronger than he is.

Similarly, Prime was, IIRC, from a dimension implied to be ours, and despite that quickly grew in power to the point that he was supposedly one of the stronger Supermen back in CoIE.

Basically, not all PC Kryptonians were created equal. If they were from the same dimension, you'd be right, but once transdimensional Kryptonians come into the picture, all age/gender/whatever comparisons are out.

[daBronzeBomma]

I've been reading some of the Hulk v Thor thread and didn't know these two were considered that close in overall power.

And it sounds like Thor has had some incredibly powerful versions of himself , especially with that enchanted hammer Mjolnir.

Since Absolute Historical Peak (AHP) Superman vs AHP Hulk turned out to be cosmic curb-stomp,

What about AHP Superman vs AHP Thor? Any better fight there?

[butterfingers158]

What about AHP Superman vs AHP Thor? Any better fight there?

What are we counting as AHP for Thor? He has a couple versions that are Odin level and I don't think even PC Supes can beat Odin.

[Cody]

What are we counting as AHP for Thor? He has a couple versions that are Odin level and I don't think even PC Supes can beat Odin.

Basically Superman Prime would be a contender. But that's it.