Avengers/New Avengers: Time Runs Out (with spoilers)

[KOSLOX]

I'm definately in the camp that if there's no body she probably wasn't killed. Just like they didn't kill Black Bolt after Thanos beat him in Infinity. They can probably use her.

I will say this though... if they wanted to streamline the BP mythos a bit by having T'Challa as the only Black Panther, now would probably be the time to do it. I'm not saying that's what they should do, or that it's something I want them to do (I personally prefer Shuri ruling Wakanda while he's more a champion myself), but I wouldn't be entirely shocked if they went that route.

I wanted Shuri to become the new White Wolf. But my guess is they'll use secret wars to do some soft reboots.

[Reviresco]

Namor is a king, so by definition he is a prick and a scumbag at bestt. Namor is not a hero he is a man with responsibilities and duties and can't afford the luxury of heroism.

Unlike most of the Heroes he is not a hypocrite about it

I'll agree, Namor is rarely a hypocrite, but I don't agree he doesn't try to be a hero and definitely for his people.

I doubt inversion Tony will last beyond secret wars. Could be wrong, because they might make Tony the antagonist in cap three

I don't know how long it will last. But I do know Marvel hasn't hesitated to trash comic book Tony, while his movies were making Marvel Studios the powerhouse it is.

[Mr MajestiK]

^^^Lol huh?

The way the story was written, he actually has a point.

[KOSLOX]

Given that both their nations are destroyed, after they both tried destroying each other, yeah that's about as even as I think it gets. They wanted a war and they got it.

What happened to Wakanda in the 8 month jump and what happened to his sister is more Thanos than Namor. If T'Challa wants a piece of Thanos, I'm sure he'll get his shot sooner or later.

Well there is that cover of Thanos beating Cap, Sue Storm, and choking T'challa over Namor's laid out body.

[Victor Freeman]

He'll dry his tears on all nine issues of Namor's last series.

Namor looked like he was ready to cry when Doom and especially Kristoff was straight up clowning him. Again, to me...Just by reading Hickman books and his style. Everything points to some form of retribution. In pretty much all of his works that have it...like East of West (Xiaolin, Death and the hunting of the chosen) or Secret Warriors(The Gorgon killing a god and the betrayal)..when a character says they are going to kill someone...it has happened. Might be different here, but there is no reason to disbelieve this is different. It might not be death, but it should be some form of revenge. He has not gotten any.

[Moose100]

The way the story was written, he actually has a point.

Like for the secrets he kept?

[XPac]

Well there is that cover of Thanos beating Cap, Sue Storm, and choking T'challa over Namor's laid out body.

Though we probably can't take covers too literally, the idea of the various factions of heroes coming together against Thanos is kind of nice. Even if it might imply them getting their behinds kicked in the process.

[KOSLOX]

I wonder how Secret Wars is going to fold into all of this. If that ends up being what it seems like it's going to be, it'll be like taking everything in the New/Avengers bucket and just dumping it out and seeing where the pieces land.

[Mr MajestiK]

Like for the secrets he kept?

Whose idea was it to stockpile WMD's and dangerous extra-terrestrials within Wakandas borders without bothering to tell the actual ruler of the country?

[Victor Freeman]

Given that both their nations are destroyed, after they both tried destroying each other, yeah that's about as even as I think it gets. They wanted a war and they got it.

What happened to Wakanda in the 8 month jump and what happened to his sister is more Thanos than Namor. If T'Challa wants a piece of Thanos, I'm sure he'll get his shot sooner or later.

This doesn't make sense. T'challa didn't and hasn't gotten anything. The reason those things happened is because he didn't do anything. Which is one of the points T'chaka was pointing out. You saying Wakanda is destroyed and Atlantis is destroyed doesn't refute anything. Namor is the one who lead them to Wakanda. Besides all the stuff prior to this saga. Namor is the focus of T'challa ire..and getting a piece of Thanos doesn't mean that Namor can't get what should be coming to him.

[Moose100]

I wonder how Secret Wars is going to fold into all of this. If that ends up being what it seems like it's going to be, it'll be like taking everything in the New/Avengers bucket and just dumping it out and seeing where the pieces land.

THats the thing its still completely unguessable I think it has something to do with the SHIELD series but it's anyones guess

[Reviresco]

This doesn't make sense. T'challa didn't and hasn't gotten anything. The reason those things happened is because he didn't do anything. Which is one of the points T'chaka was pointing out. You saying Wakanda is destroyed and Atlantis is destroyed doesn't refute anything. Namor is the one who lead them to Wakanda. Besides all the stuff prior to this saga. Namor is the focus of T'challa ire..and getting a piece of Thanos doesn't mean that Namor can't get what should be coming to him.

Namor didn't lead the Cabal to Wakanda. T'challa put the Cabal in Wakanda.

[Victor Freeman]

Namor didn't lead the Cabal to Wakanda. T'challa put the Cabal in Wakanda.

No, Namor sent PM and CG to Wakanda. That happened. He is on panel telling the entire Illuminati that is what he did, that's when they told him to scram.

[Reviresco]

How does Namor prop anyone up? If you said Wolverine, Cap, Thor, Hulk, Spiderman, Ironman or someone like that you would have a point. Namor, nah. Just keeping it 100. He's not really in a position to prop up another character.

I'm not the one who floated this really odd idea, imo, that because Black Panther has a movie, Namor has to die to spotlight Black Panther, so ask them.

The way Namor always does, by being awesome and entertaining. By his country and himself being a punching bag or whipping boy for T'challa and Wakanda. If he wasn't in this story, providing conflict, T'challa would be beyond dull and redundant.

It's simply this...he's in a story. He has a role in a story and it's playing out. But I don't think T'challa doing anything to Namor is going to suddenly be some sort of massive boon for the character.

Most the people agitating for Namor's death disagree with this. Apparently, from what I've read here, if he doesn't kill Namor, it somehow diminishes the character.

[Emma's Midriff]

No, Namor sent PM and CG to Wakanda. That happened. He is on panel telling the entire Illuminati that is what he did, that's when they told him to scram.

Let's not have this merry-go-round argument again.

Ultimately, the destruction of Wakanda was because that's where T'challa decided to put the Cabal.