Superman: Futures End #1 Preview / Discussion

[kidstandout]

except for the fact that he's literally not a human in the physical sense, he's a kryptonian. people are confusing human for sentient being.

[Blacksun]

except for the fact that he's literally not a human in the physical sense, he's a kryptonian. people are confusing human for sentient being.

being human is much more than have a human body

[misslane]

Clark Kent is a kryptonian pretending to be a human. One who goes out of his way to fool people into believing that Superman is a separate entity. Mild mannered, clumsy, glasses wearing, third-person speaking, Clark Kent is totally a mask to hide who he truly is.

Clark Kent is a mask that Clark Kent created. Clark Kent is not a being that lives or exists independently of Superman. Clark Kent is a real part of Superman and Superman is a real part of Clark Kent. Clark Kent truly is Clark Kent balancing the identity of Clark Kent and Superman.

In relation to Lois spilling the beans to the public, there's no difference between revealing the story of Superman pretending to be a human and Shazam pretending to be Superman. Why? Because the world has no clue who Superman is besides someone in the uniform with super powers who helps people.

There's a world of difference between revealing a hero's private civilian identity that endangers the innocent civilians in his life and revealing one hero is another hero.

If she can be a collaborator in the game Superman plays with the public, she can exercise discretion with Shazam.

No, she can't exercise discretion. Why? Because there is no ethical reason to conceal the charade from the public. Lois plays the game with Superman because she's protecting powerless humans from becoming targets. Billy was protecting a misguided attempt to honor a lost hero.

What are the glasses for?

The glasses exist for the same reason celebrities wear sunglasses and hats. It's a way to remain as anonymous as possible to maintain some semblance of an ordinary life. They are part of an identity Clark created for himself, and as such they are a real part of himself and his full identity.

[kidstandout]

being human is much more than have a human body

if i raise a dolphin, is she or he a human? "being human" is usually focusing on sentient capability. a human being means literally that.

[Lax]

Clark Kent is a mask that Clark Kent created. Clark Kent is not a being that lives or exists independently of Superman. Clark Kent is a real part of Superman and Superman is a real part of Clark Kent. Clark Kent truly is Clark Kent balancing the identity of Clark Kent and Superman.

Clark Kent is a mask that Superman created to hide the fact that he's an alien. He tries his absolute best to insure that the public thinks that Clark and Superman are two independent beings.

There's a world of difference between revealing a hero's private civilian identity that endangers the innocent civilians in his life and revealing one hero is another hero.

Not if you're working under the premise of "The public has the right to know the truth.", which is supposedly what this is all about for Lois, except that fluctuates depending on how she feels.

No, she can't exercise discretion. Why? Because there is no ethical reason to conceal the charade from the public. Lois plays the game with Superman because she's protecting powerless humans from becoming targets. Billy was protecting a misguided attempt to honor a lost hero.

Except horrible people aren't the only people in the world, there would be an awful lot of good folks who would protect and support them once their status became known. Not to mention powerless humans are always in danger, that's why Superman's job exists in the first place.

The glasses exist for the same reason celebrities wear sunglasses and hats. It's a way to remain as anonymous as possible to maintain some semblance of an ordinary life. They are part of an identity Clark created for himself, and as such they are a real part of himself and his full identity.

No, it's a disguise to fool the public into believing that he is a human because the truth is that he's not. He may want to be "just another guy" but that is not the case. The reality of this is an inconvenient truth for such a humble individual to face so pretending otherwise is the next best thing.

Humans don't have to pretend to be humans, they simply are.

[DochaDocha]

I'm actually not surprised. What surprised me more is when people were saying that this issue would indeed reveal it. Because a big revelation like that should and now will be covered in Futures End proper.

He'll probably finally talk about it to Constantine and we'll get a flashback.

Well, count me in as one of those stupid mofos who listened to everyone else!

[misslane]

Clark Kent is a mask that Superman created to hide the fact that he's an alien. He tries his absolute best to insure that the public thinks that Clark and Superman are two independent beings.

Clark Kent is a very real part of Superman's identity that Superman relies on to have a private life. Clark may want the public to view Clark and Superman are separate, but the truth is that they are not separate. Shazam and Superman are, however, separate beings.

Not if you're working under the premise of "The public has the right to know the truth.", which is supposedly what this is all about for Lois, except that fluctuates depending on how she feels.

You don't seem to understand there are ethical guidelines for journalists that specifically exempt reporters from revealing information that puts innocent people in danger. Essentially, the only reason why a journalist is obligated to reveal information, including a conflict of interest, is if the truth will save and protect more lives than concealing the lie. Lois pressed Billy to provide this sort of argument before she published her article, and Billy could not find a way to make a persuasive case for why maintaining Superman's symbol was more important than the truth.

Except horrible people aren't the only people in the world, there would be an awful lot of good folks who would protect and support them once their status became known. Not to mention powerless humans are always in danger, that's why Superman's job exists in the first place.

The rich canon of Superman stories in which Clark's identity has been revealed to the public do not support your optimistic promise.

No, it's a disguise to fool the public into believing that he is a human because the truth is that he's not. He may want to be "just another guy" but that is not the case. The reality of this is an inconvenient truth for such a humble individual to face so pretending otherwise is the next best thing.

Superman lives half his life as Clark because he is as much Clark Kent as he is Superman. The glasses are part of Clark's personality and enable him to live as quietly as he desires. The glasses are part of an entire package that keeps the humans close to Clark safe from harm.

Humans don't have to pretend to be humans, they simply are.

Clark isn't pretending to be human. He was raised human and his human identity is a genuine and treasured part of who Clark Kent is.

[neonrideraryeh]

Sounds like Lois cares more about the scoop than the consequences of revealing it. The only exceptions; as some users on here said, is when it suits her personal life to keep the secret. People act like Lois is some kind of angel, but she's always been out for her own interests. That is what makes her a flawed character; which is actually a good thing and doesn't mean you have to dislike them; if anything it makes it more interesting. It allows her to do solo stuff without being Superman's damsel in distress. Now, excuse me while I back out of the thread before I'm lynched.

Oh yeah, agreeing with Clark being part of Superman. He's not merely a mask, he's another part of Superman's oniony like layers of characterisation.

[Blacksun]

if i raise a dolphin, is she or he a human? "being human" is usually focusing on sentient capability. a human being means literally that.

that is a little too much, but there is cases of animals raised by another different animals that identify with the adoptive family. other day I ssaw a cow that thinks that she is a dog

Lois is not a angel, she has her own interests but she play the fair game. Male heroes get away doing much worse things. it's not like Lois destryed people lives revealing the truth

[misslane]

Sounds like Lois cares more about the scoop than the consequences of revealing it.

Actually, the plot suggests nothing of the sort. The reason she cared about the scoop was because she cared about exposing the truth to protect the public from a lying Justice League. If she had only cared about the scoop, she wouldn't have given Shazam a chance to explain himself.

The only exceptions; as some users on here said, is when it suits her personal life to keep the secret. People act like Lois is some kind of angel, but she's always been out for her own interests. That is what makes her a flawed character; which is actually a good thing and doesn't mean you have to dislike them; if anything it makes it more interesting. It allows her to do solo stuff without being Superman's damsel in distress. Now, excuse me while I back out of the thread before I'm lynched.

The only reason you'd be "lynched" is because you're talking nonsense with no proof to back up your outrageous claims. Lois has always been out for herself? Please. She doesn't do what she does as a reporter and secret keeper for selfish reasons, and Lois protecting Clark's secret is not the same as Lois protecting Shazam's secret. Y'all need to stop comparing apples and oranges in your rush for pitchforks to attack Lois unfairly. From the outside, Shazam and Superman are two different people just like Superman and Clark Kent, but the truth is that Shazam isn't Superman while Clark Kent is Superman. The truth Lois revealed was that Shazam was impersonating someone else -- a symbol and identity that someone else created and taking advantage of people's trust in that figure -- whereas Clark doesn't impersonate Superman. He is Superman. The same soul inhabits Clark Kent and Superman. The same soul does not inhabit Shazam and Superman. Superman, for him, is just a mask. Heck, with a mask anyone could now impersonate Superman.

[hellacre]

Actually, the plot suggests nothing of the sort. The reason she cared about the scoop was because she cared about exposing the truth to protect the public from a lying Justice League. If she had only cared about the scoop, she wouldn't have given Shazam a chance to explain himself.



The only reason you'd be "lynched" is because you're talking nonsense with no proof to back up your outrageous claims. Lois has always been out for herself? Please. She doesn't do what she does as a reporter and secret keeper for selfish reasons, and Lois protecting Clark's secret is not the same as Lois protecting Shazam's secret. Y'all need to stop comparing apples and oranges in your rush for pitchforks to attack Lois unfairly. From the outside, Shazam and Superman are two different people just like Superman and Clark Kent, but the truth is that Shazam isn't Superman while Clark Kent is Superman. The truth Lois revealed was that Shazam was impersonating someone else -- a symbol and identity that someone else created and taking advantage of people's trust in that figure -- whereas Clark doesn't impersonate Superman. He is Superman. The same soul inhabits Clark Kent and Superman. The same soul does not inhabit Shazam and Superman. Superman, for him, is just a mask. Heck, with a mask anyone could now impersonate Superman.

There is a variable here though isn't there which you are stubbornly ignoring. The romantic feelings she always possessed for this great soul. Even if we ignore that, Lois' tactic here reminds me of those sensational type entertainment media/tabloids. Just scoop without responsibility or consequence as long as she breaks it. The other variable is Clark/Superman must have done something terrible, enough for him to go hide, and ignore the world and we have long history of Lois always willing to cut him slack because she has romantic feelings for him.

Lois's ethics in this story is questionable. She's arrogant here. The double standards are glaring. You're pro Lois so you're making excuses for her behavior. But it's hypocritical what she does. Barging in the man's home is bad enough but if she'd met with him and given Billy the chance to explain himself before breaking the story...then I'd say okay there is some effort to understand. But she doesn't. She's been around heroes and she knows what they struggle with.

Usually fans barely care about questions like this because journalism in comics is never really portrayed correctly. As Docha says in real life Lois and Clark would be fired but this is comics and they get a lot of free rein because heroes do hide behind masks. But if Lois is going to play Miss Moral Compass here, she should have been better to exercise some restraint and wisdom and the benefit of the doubt she always gave the alien Superman when he first came to town...extend it to Billy. It would have been even more believable for me that she does not have romantic feelings for Billy but she is willing to give him a chance to explain and if he couldn't explain then she does what she has to do. But she doesn't. That's the issue a lot of people are having with her behavior. It's got very little imo to do with she knows Clark's heart and soul etc. She actually does NOT know his heart and soul currently else she'd know where Superman is and she and the world would not have to ask the question. That symbol is kinda letting people down by vanishing but she's willing to crucify Billy for it.

[Blacksun]

Billy had a chance to explain himself before she published the article. but he didn't explained himself for Lois. So after she published the story she went to talk abou it a last time with him

[hellacre]

Billy had a chance to explain himself before she published the article. but he didn't explained himself for Lois. So after she published the story she went to talk abou it a last time with him

Why does he Have to? If Clark Kent does not have to tell everyone including his employers whose time he often uses to fly away and not do what he's actually paid for ( even before Lois knew his secret) why does Billy have to? This is laboring under the assumption she is some arbiter of good behaviour and Billy needs to be a good little boy because some people annoyed with him. She wants to break a story. She broke it. Some readers have a problem with the way she does it. Billy has to deal with his action or inaction. But we can all still have an opinion on matter, right? I don't think all high profile people whose names are bandied about by media feel they are obliged to explain themselves to any one journalist. They might pick and choose who they give a scoop to but it is usually done so they have some control on how a story breaks...much like what Superman use to do with Lois.

[misslane]

There is a variable here though isn't there which you are stubbornly ignoring. The romantic feelings she always possessed for this great soul.

No, you keep stubbornly trying to drag it into this conversation when it is totally irrelevant. We readers, like Lois, are looking at two different truths. The truth about Clark Kent would reveal to the public that Superman likes to have a private life and was raised human. The truth about Shazam would reveal that the Justice League concocted a lie and people were placing their trust in an impersonator.

Even if we ignore that, Lois' tactic here reminds me of those sensational type entertainment media/tabloids. Just scoop without responsibility or consequence as long as she breaks it. The other variable is Clark/Superman must have done something terrible, enough for him to go hide, and ignore the world and we have long history of Lois always willing to cut him slack because she has romantic feelings for him.

Seems like to me you're inserting a lot of personal bias into your judgmental attitude. Lois' tactic might remind you of sensational media types, but a close examination of the story shows that sensationalism and personal benefit were not Lois' motivations. Scoop without responsibility and consequences? Lois did consider the consequences and did give Shazam a chance to present a convincing argument. He did not. She ran with his secret, in contrast to past continuities when Clark revealed his secret, because Shazam was still withholding information and was potentially taking advantage of the public's trust in Superman for a league that, for all we know, is mostly gone or corrupted at this point.

Lois's ethics in this story is questionable. She's arrogant here. The double standards are glaring. You're pro Lois so you're making excuses for her behavior. But it's hypocritical what she does. Barging in the man's home is bad enough but if she'd met with him and given Billy the chance to explain himself before breaking the story...then I'd say okay there is some effort to understand. But she doesn't. She's been around heroes and she knows what they struggle with.

Oh. My. God. Lois did give Billy a chance to explain. He remained silent. And for the last time, there are no double standards because the secrets are different. Clark doesn't impersonate Superman. He is Superman. Clark's secret isn't obscuring or protecting an organization that has power and can take advantage of the public's trust. It's protecting a small collection of civilian loved ones.

It's got very little imo to do with she knows Clark's heart and soul etc. She actually does NOT know his heart and soul currently else she'd know where Superman is and she and the world would not have to ask the question. That symbol is kinda letting people down by vanishing but she's willing to crucify Billy for it.

Okay, you've misunderstood. When I mention Clark's heart and soul, I don't do it to imply any special knowledge, intimacy, or whatever. I literally am just using those as ways to explain the difference between one person with a disguise (Clark Kent) and one person impersonating another person. When there's one person with a disguise, there is one heart and one soul involved, and they all belong to the same person. With impersonation, it's one person with their heart and soul co-opting someone else's heart and soul, as it was Clark who made Superman the symbol that it is.

In addition, Superman does not wear a mask for good reason. From Earth One:



Just by wearing a mask Shazam's Superman raised suspicion about whether he was the real Superman or what had happened to Superman. It was an imperfect and untenable solution.

Season 9 of Smallville further illuminates the issue of symbols and impersonators as they relate to Superman. Throughout that season the S-Shield as Clark's heroic symbol was explored. Not only did Wonder Twins, Zan and Jayna, use the symbol but so did Zod. Shazam's Superman mask poses the same potential problems. If there is no face and no accountability, then anyone can take advantage of the symbol.

Chloe: You know, Clark, you need to get to work on some serious spin-doctor magic, because whoever's posing as The Blur is genius at marketing and self-promotion. He's co-opted your brand.
Clark: I'm not a brand. The Blur has a blog.
Chloe: And apparently, you Twitter and you're on Facebook, where you have 10,000 friends, by the way. You've come quite a long way since being scarecrowed in high school.
Clark: Why would somebody go through so much trouble to discredit me?
Chloe: Now, here's the hitch. I think he's actually trying to help you. I discovered five messy, but successful, saves obviously not done by you.
Clark: Whether this person means well or not, they need to be stopped... before someone gets hurt.

Zan: We just wanted to help fuel The Blur's legend.
Chloe: Okay, about the helping. Right idea, wrong execution. Look, I've been where you guys are. I get it. You're just a couple of mega fans who really want to make a difference, but you are single-handedly destroying what The Blur stands for.

Clark: Don't believe in me. Believe in the shield and what it represents. Most importantly, believe in yourselves.
Jan: But...we're not the hero. You are.
Clark: That depends on you. Metropolis doesn't need more Blur fans. It needs people who are willing to do exactly what you did today.

Superman is more than a symbol. When he died in the "Death of Superman" no one tried to pretend otherwise. The way to handle it is to maintain truth and uphold Superman's legacy by being the best version of yourself you can be.

[misslane]

Why does he Have to? If Clark Kent does not have to tell anyone including his employers whose time he often uses to fly away and not do what he's actually paid for ( even before Lois knew his secret) why does Billy have to?

Billy has to explain himself because it is the only way for Lois to make a well-informed ethical decision. Before she published her expose, Lois gave Billy the opportunity to explain why revealing the truth would cause potential harm or discomfort that outweighed the public's need for information. According to the Society of Professional Journalists' Code of Ethics, journalists must "balance the public’s need for information against potential harm or discomfort." All Billy could offer as a defense was the weak argument that the public needed to be inspired by Superman's symbol.

This is laboring under the assumption she is some arbiter of good behaviour and Billy needs to be a good little boy because some people annoyed with him.

No, this is laboring under the assumption that all journalists are tasked with making ethical choices. Journalists abide by a code of ethics that have established guidelines for how to manage these kinds of messy issues. Billy needed to make a case for why the maintaining the deception was more important than the public's right to know the truth about their public figures.

She wants to break a story. She broke it. Some readers have a problem with the way she does it. I don't think all high profile people whose names are bandied about by media feel they are obliged to explain themselves to any one journalist. They might pick and choose who they give a scoop to but it is usually done so they have some control on how a story breaks...much like what Superman use to do with Lois.

People in power must explain themselves to journalists because, just like everyone else, their right to anonymity and confidentiality must be considered based on balancing the public's need for truth and the need to protect subjects from potential harm.