What's Going On in the Final Page of "Superman: Doomed"?

[Lexrules]

So DC should use the same set of characters in same positions for all eternity? you know that would have gotten incredibly stale right?

Only thing that would make it stale is the lack of good writing.

[Pharozonk]

Unlike Lexrules, I have no qualms about characters aging. However, it shouldn't be feared. If Batman needs to be almost 50 in order to accommodate the 4 Robin history, then so be it. Let characters get older and let history continue to progress. Change shouldn't be completely re-starting history, but simply adding on to what has come before it.

[Pharozonk]

Reboot legion reboot legion reboot legion yyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee eeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh hhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11

NO MORE REBOOTS.

I don't want to end up with Waid's Threboot crap again. I rather enjoyed the Johns/Levitz Retroboot Legion until the Nu52.

[Lexrules]

If you're a fan of the Silver Age, that's cool and all. But as a Tim Drake mega-fan myself I vehemently disagree. :P

Having the characters frozen and unable to change or grow leads to absurdly stale and gimmicky stories.

it has nothing to do with Silver, Bronze, or any age. it has to do with having to many characters instead of focusing on selling markets of key characters and making it as easy as possible for new readers to pick up as well as older readers keep enjoying.

[Lexrules]

Unlike Lexrules, I have no qualms about characters aging. However, it shouldn't be feared. If Batman needs to be almost 50 in order to accommodate the 4 Robin history, then so be it. Let characters get older and let history continue to progress. Change shouldn't be completely re-starting history, but simply adding on to what has come before it.

Exactly. Like I said at least the older universe made sense of it if they had to age.

[RobinFan4880]

They were leaving because you had writers who had zero idea on what makes character like Superman tick and editors who were just as dumb. They still suffer from it, There is way to much leeway allowed to these writers and artist and unfortunately it starts at the top which is the problem.

The problem is not that they do not know what to do with Superman, it is that they are not allowed to do anything meaningful with the character.

[Sirzechs]

Please don't use the Robin timeline to prove points,
first there's 3 Robins.
-Dick Grayson became Robin after he was adopted by Batman which he was 15 until 4 years ago when Barbara became Batgirl he took up the Nightwing mantle
-Jason Todd wasn't Robin for long time as he was too stubborn and died.
-Tim Drake wasn't a Robin he was Batman's Partner and that was only for short while then moved to help other Teen Heroes but was still associated with batman.
-Damien was tanked grown and became Robin when Batman was lost in time 1 Year ago before.

Lot of you guys just don't want to accept all 4 can exist in 6 years.

[randomengine]

I just wish people would realize that this is about business and money... There is no more pre-new52 there is only the new52 it would be ridiculous and would be completely shutting out any new readers who jumped on with the new52 to just say "we are reverting back to pre-new52 so all the stories that you have gotten invested in and all the characters are gonna go back to having these ridiculously long and complex histories that date back 70+ years" The new52 was perfect for DC because it allowed people to become invested in these characters from the beginning of their history. The-new52 is here to stay and pre flashpoint is gone forever get over it no matter how much we want it back its gone. All this panel shows us is that there is a big story coming up (which we all know) involving the multiverse.

But that's not even entirely true. There is a linear chronology that leads from pre-Flashpoint to Flashpoint to New 52. Continuity wasn't erased because it exists in physical books and in our minds. Whether new readers like it or not there is a 70+ year history because fans exist and the companies want to make fans excited by referencing the past.

[RobertoDaCosta]

I don't get what any of this means...

Which basically should be the tagline for DC Comics.

lol this is so true!

[MikeMC005]

DC just give the people that continue to bitch about The New 52 a Pre New 52 book so we don't have to hear from them anymore.

It's getting old.

This. I couldn't agree more. Every time someone sneezes differently people get on their boxes and start the "This is where they bring back the pre-new52."

[RobinFan4880]

Yea, but that is not a real world. it's a comic book fictional world.

Hence why it took Dick 40 years to become Nightwing.

If you never allow characters to change and grow, then you wind up with a situation like Marvel where stories wind up not mattering as nothing that happens in them will ever resonate in future stories.

[Lexrules]

Please don't use the Robin timeline to prove points,
first there's 3 Robins.
-Dick Grayson became Robin after he was adopted by Batman which he was 15 until 4 years ago when Barbara became Batgirl he took up the Nightwing mantle
-Jason Todd wasn't Robin for long time as he was too stubborn and died.
-Tim Drake wasn't a Robin he was Batman's Partner and that was only for short while then moved to help other Teen Heroes but was still associated with batman.
-Damien was tanked grown and became Robin when Batman was lost in time 1 Year ago before.

Lot of you guys just don't want to accept all 4 can exist in 6 years.

Because they can't. Bruce is going to train these young kids for only 3 months and put them on the street with him. Kinda makes Bruce look more Bat$hit crazy then he already is doesn't it. And F that Red Robin garbage. If Tim Drake is around then he is Robin. Ridiculousness needs to be called out and that is ridiculous and one of the most stupidest things they did with this mess to call him anything else. People liked Tim for a reason, his origin and how he became ROBIN was a good part of why they liked him.

[Lexrules]

Hence why it took Dick 40 years to become Nightwing.

If you never allow characters to change and grow, then you wind up with a situation like Marvel where stories wind up not mattering as nothing that happens in them will ever resonate in future stories.

I could see your point and respect it. I just never seen the need to age these characters. They are timeless for a reason.

[Sirzechs]

Because they can't. Bruce is going to train these young kids for only 3 months and out them on the street with him. Kinda makes Bruce look more Bat$hit crazy then he already is doesn't it. And F that Red Robin garbage. If Tim Drake is around then he is Robin. Ridiculousness needs to be called out and that is ridiculous to call him anything else.

@Bold dem reasoning thou, weren't you the one just saying its a fictional world?

@Underline this from the dude that said Dick Grayson should be the only Robin, please make up your mind.

[Waterfall]

And this is exactly where the problem lies. The older demographic, use to it history considers changing history as "forcing diversity", not realizing that almost every aspect of human rights manage has been created by literally force. From slavery to the civil rights movement to today, things don't just happen naturally. This is further illustrated by how the comic book demographic was pre 52, according to the comic book panel of diversity in San Diego Comic Con, were 85% white males over the age of 27. That's extremely one sided. Why? Because diversity wasn't pushed, it made small sprinkles here and there but no radical changes that you see currently in the the new 52.

One of the biggest cricitism of the JLA was that the most important heroes were all white with one green alien, this was actually one of the reasons why John Stewart was chosen for the JL unlimited cartoon. due to the fact that it's heavily one sided.

And that goes back to my original discussion. Pre 52 was built around a time which tailored towards white male. These "iconic" characters teams and stories were tailored towards white men of the 1940's. But this isn't the 1940's. Last year was the first year in the school system where minority kids outnumbered white kids, DC is finally realizing that what would fly 40+ years ago can't fly today.

Marvel solves this problem by creating NEW characters for the already existing mantles, not ruining the iconic characters with rooted backgrounds.

As for DC I support the new Power Girl, she's not Karen after all.

Do stuff like that, don't piss of fans of a well rounded character. Besides ALWAYS white version gets the media exposure and this change cuts Wally's chances to become iconic 20 year runner in any other medium. This also pisses me off. I want to see Wally's story adapted to big screen someday just like Scott Lang's will be. What Wally doesn't have that Scott has?