Black Panther Appreciation: Wakanda Forever!

[Double 0]

To me, it's just another case of "Africans are monsters or victims". I mean, I'm not even going to criticize RJAAMAR's response, because that was the one the book was trying to elicit: that T'Challa is one of the "good ones".

This is why I really like that Wakanda is meant to be society of geniuses, instead of "T'Challa and his bloodline is awesome, everyone else sucks".

[XPac]

I cannot believe Wakandans are reacting that way. I'm so glad BP is not like them. I still remember the Avengers movie, the cartoons one, the Wakandan officials would not want BP to seek help from the outsiders.

Can't BP change the Wakanda rules?

Yeah, judging from that response it probably didn't surprise too many people when Gentle left Wakanda again to return to the X-Men.

But ultimately we have to remember that anyone not wearing tights and punching out bad guys is really just a prop to help tell stories. Just like the public in the MU version of the states, the average Wakandan really shows up on print just to make T'Challa took better or to help tell a story. It's just like in Civil War when the New Yorkers essentially all became anti-superhuman jerks. Same thing here.

In this case those specific Wakandans (and we shouldn't necessarily assume they represent the nation as a whole) were used to help tell a story of Gentle's feelings of isolation, and to a lesser extent show how much cooler T'Challa is than everyone else there.

[Mr MajestiK]

I cannot believe Wakandans are reacting that way. I'm so glad BP is not like them. I still remember the Avengers movie, the cartoons one, the Wakandan officials would not want BP to seek help from the outsiders.

Can't BP change the Wakanda rules?

What is it exactly that you're finding hard to believe?

The fact that Wakandan's are being written as being exceptionally discriminatory manner towards Nezhno?

Or that said discriminatory action on the part of Wakandan's was written in the well established manner and tone set by X-writers?

What is it you find hard to believe again?

The fact remains that as I stated previously, in the absence of a solo Black Panther book wherein a wide range of topics can be adequately explored, all Wakandan related appearances and references not written by Jonathan Hickman will more or less be uncomplimentary and disparaging towards T'Challa, Shuri and Wakanda.

And based on what's been establised in canon, T'Challa is in no position to be changing any rules in Wakanda as he's not ruling that nation at present.

She is....







Her name is Shuri.

You might have heard of her.

[RLAAMJR.]

Yeah, judging from that response it probably didn't surprise too many people when Gentle left Wakanda again to return to the X-Men.

But ultimately we have to remember that anyone not wearing tights and punching out bad guys is really just a prop to help tell stories. Just like the public in the MU version of the states, the average Wakandan really shows up on print just to make T'Challa took better or to help tell a story. It's just like in Civil War when the New Yorkers essentially all became anti-superhuman jerks. Same thing here.

In this case those specific Wakandans (and we shouldn't necessarily assume they represent the nation as a whole) were used to help tell a story of Gentle's feelings of isolation, and to a lesser extent show how much cooler T'Challa is than everyone else there.

So who among the Wakandans are fine with the outsiders? BP, Shuri, Dora Milaje. who else?

[XPac]

To me, it's just another case of "Africans are monsters or victims". I mean, I'm not even going to criticize RJAAMAR's response, because that was the one the book was trying to elicit: that T'Challa is one of the "good ones".

This is why I really like that Wakanda is meant to be society of geniuses, instead of "T'Challa and his bloodline is awesome, everyone else sucks".

I agree with this to an extent, but I also think this is a part of the genre beyond just T'Challa and Wakanda. I think generally speaking comics go out of their way to say that super heroes are smarter and better than everyone else. If you're not a super hero or a part of a super heroes supporting cast, you're a jerk or a moron or both.

Civil War to me was the best example of that. During Secret Invasion part of me was rooting for the freaking skrulls simply because the MU US citiezens came off looking so bad to me. I spent a good portion of that era thinking most of them deserved to be killed off.

The moral of the story usually is that super heroes are better than everyone else. Everyone else sucks.

[RLAAMJR.]

What is it exactly that you're finding hard to believe?

The fact that Wakandan's are being written as being exceptionally discriminatory manner towards Nezhno?

Or that said discriminatory action on the part of Wakandan's was written in the well established manner and tone set by X-writers?

What is it you find hard to believe again?

The fact remains that as I stated previously, in the absence of a solo Black Panther book wherein a wide range of topics can be adequately explored, all Wakandan related appearances and references not written by Jonathan Hickman will more or less be uncomplimentary and disparaging towards T'Challa, Shuri and Wakanda.

And based on what's been establised in canon, T'Challa is in no position to be changing any rules in Wakanda as he's not ruling that nation at present.

She is....







Her name is Shuri.

You might have heard of her.

I know who Shuri is. I have watched The Black Panther animated series through youtube because it wasn't shown in any of our channels here. I really made an effort to watch all the episodes in youtube because Storm was in it. BUt I dont know why people said that it wasn't a good animated series because I've actually enjoyed it very much.

I see. But Shuri can change the rules right?

Alright. I just wanted to confirm. Are the Wakandan people always written as not to be hospitable to outsiders or only some Wakandan officials, just like what I saw in Ultimate Avengers 2?

[Mr MajestiK]

To me, it's just another case of "Africans are monsters or victims". I mean, I'm not even going to criticize RJAAMAR's response, because that was the one the book was trying to elicit: that T'Challa is one of the "good ones".

This is why I really like that Wakanda is meant to be society of geniuses, instead of "T'Challa and his bloodline is awesome, everyone else sucks".

To me, it's less about criticizing anyones response and more of pointing out the blatant innacuracies, hypocrisy and general chicanery inherrent in a lot of the stuff that's been written about Wakanda by anyone other than Kirby, McGregor, Priest, Johns, Hudlin, McDuffie, Liss and Hickman.

Outside of all of the above cited authors, every other writer (almost exclusively all hailing from the X-office) have always used Wakanda as a foundation from which to paint a wholly one-sided (and false) image of a nation of people hostile to mutants in particular or outsiders in general.

The Fantastic Four have been guests in Wakanda on numerous occasions and it's not as if there are a plethora of stories set in the 616 MU that have established the Wakandans as being anything but hospitable to people who come to them with peaceful intentions.

Wakanda has never invaded any of her neighbouring countries or attempted to take over the world at any point in their 616 MU history to date but for some unfathomable reason, they recieve levels of hate from some segments of readership that even the likes of Doom are somewhat immune from.

[Mr MajestiK]

I know who Shuri is. I have watched The Black Panther animated series through youtube because it wasn't shown in any of our channels here. I really made an effort to watch all the episodes in youtube because Storm was in it. BUt I dont know why people said that it wasn't a good animated series because I've actually enjoyed it very much.

I see. But Shuri can change the rules right?

Alright. I just wanted to confirm. Are the Wakandan people always written as not to be hospitable to outsiders or only some Wakandan officials, just like what I saw in Ultimate Avengers 2?

Since you know who Shuri is, why would you be wondering why T'Challa "can't change the rules?"

As would be the case in any nation, there are some Wakandan's who remain ever suspicious of outsiders which shouldn't really come as a suprise to anyone familiar with what happened to T'Challa's father when he let his guard down and allowed the man who murdered him and eventually came to be known as the villain, Klaw into his personal space.

There are also Wakandan's who are open to interacting with the outside world as eveidenced by T'Challa, Shuri and Onome.

[UltimateTy]

To me, it's less about criticizing anyones response and more of pointing out the blatant innacuracies, hypocrisy and general chicanery inherrent in a lot of the stuff that's been written about Wakanda by anyone other than Kirby, McGregor, Priest, Johns, Hudlin, McDuffie, Liss and Hickman.

Outside of all of the above cited authors, every other writer (almost exclusively all hailing from the X-office) have always used Wakanda as a foundation from which to paint a wholly one-sided (and false) image of a nation of people hostile to mutants in particular or outsiders in general.

The Fantastic Four have been guests in Wakanda on numerous occasions and it's not as if there are a plethora of stories set in the 616 MU that have established the Wakandans as being anything but hospitable to people who come to them with peaceful intentions.

Wakanda has never invaded any of her neighbouring countries or attempted to take over the world at any point in their 616 MU history to date but for some unfathomable reason, they recieve levels of hate from some segments of readership that even the likes of Doom are somewhat immune from.

Yeah it irks me, these are the Wakandans with the Fantastic Four in FF #54

[XPac]

I know who Shuri is. I have watched The Black Panther animated series through youtube because it wasn't shown in any of our channels here. I really made an effort to watch all the episodes in youtube because Storm was in it. BUt I dont know why people said that it wasn't a good animated series because I've actually enjoyed it very much.

I see. But Shuri can change the rules right?

Alright. I just wanted to confirm. Are the Wakandan people always written as not to be hospitable to outsiders or only some Wakandan officials, just like what I saw in Ultimate Avengers 2?

At the time that specific story was occuring, T'Challa was actually in charge. But as far as changing the rules... it really isn't about changing that so much as it is changing people's opinions. And that's not something even a King can do.

T'Challa can force people to "welcome" Gentle (as he sort of did in that scene), but he can't force them to truelly like or accept him. Kings don't get to dictate that sort of thing.

Mutant issue aside, I think T'Challa has spent a good portion of his history as a character attempting to get Wakanda to be more open to outsiders. And I think he's been fairly sucessful at it. But the issue of Wakanda and it's issues with "outsiders" still pops up from time to time, and likely always will.

[Mr MajestiK]

Yeah it irks me, these are the Wakandans with the Fantastic Four in FF #54

Now, this scan definitely put a smile on my face.

[Leo Raine]

Quick question for you folks: Can somebody tell me when T'Challa and Luke Cage met? When Cage shows up in Hudlin's run, he talks about finally meeting his hero. But they fought together in Priest's run (and when they speak, T'Challa says it's good to see him again) so I know that had to be a mistake. It seems like there's a good chance they'd run into each other in NY during T'Challa's early Avenger/schoolteacher days. Anybody know for sure?

[RLAAMJR.]

At the time that specific story was occuring, T'Challa was actually in charge. But as far as changing the rules... it really isn't about changing that so much as it is changing people's opinions. And that's not something even a King can do.

T'Challa can force people to "welcome" Gentle (as he sort of did in that scene), but he can't force them to truelly like or accept him. Kings don't get to dictate that sort of thing.

Mutant issue aside, I think T'Challa has spent a good portion of his history as a character attempting to get Wakanda to be more open to outsiders. And I think he's been fairly sucessful at it. But the issue of Wakanda and it's issues with "outsiders" still pops up from time to time, and likely always will.

I see. By the way, i Bast still alive?

[Leo Raine]

Yeah it irks me, these are the Wakandans with the Fantastic Four in FF #54

Gotta love those old comics. Looks like playing baseball with Reed would be pretty frustrating.
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[Shaunyc]

Wakanda's distrust of outsiders makes sense based on their isolationist history, but i think that gives us a great environment for good storytelling. There's got to be some conflict...