Black Panther Appreciation: Wakanda Forever!

[XPac]

Think about it like this. If Wakanda existed before the first dynasty and the Nubians and Egyptions and knew about them, they might have adopted their gods. Which should please you since you like realism.

I'm not saying it can't be explained... just saying I'm not sure there was an actual need to retcon the Panther God into Bast. It seemed fine as it's own thing.

That said, if I'm understanding Coates story correctly here (and it's entirely possible I'm not) then the Wakandan gods were humans who became gods. So they might not actually be the Egyptian gods, who were born gods rather than becoming gods one day.

[Rumble]

The debut story of Man-Ape was the first sign all was not well within Wakanda. (House) Roy Thomas wrote that. Bless Kirby for giving us Houseroy, lol!

Don wrote Panther's Rage which not only debuted Killmonger, but clearly showed Wakanda had deep internal issues. Oh yeah, Wakandans did not like BP's American lover, Monica. The snobbish, xenophobia ways of the people existed back in the 1970s before Priest & Hudlin.

The fact T'Challa was educated outside Wakanda was an example of the land needing a ruler to look at things from a non-traditional perspective. After Klaw's invasion, Wakanda could not go exclusively back to the old ways of handling things. That explains T'Challa's brazen challenge of the fantastic Four in his debut story. That came from Stan & Jack in the 1960s.

Wakanda always had 99 problems....but being a perfect utopia ain't one.

The constant attempts to deconstruct Wakanda & its King needs to stop.

It's just lazy writing at this point. He needs to take his sunken place ass elsewhere.

How about we tell progressive stories that move Wakanda and T'Challa forward? That would make people actually want to live there or make it feel like a living breathing place, instead of Christopher Columbus history lessons marinated with tales of black women getting raped?

That issue of Ms Marvel did a better job of making Wakanda feel like a real place than Ta-nehisi has done in 1.5 years

[Ezyo1000]

It's just lazy writing at this point. He needs to take his sunken place ass elsewhere.

How about we tell progressive stories that move Wakanda and T'Challa forward? That would make people actually want to live there or make it feel like a living breathing place, instead of Christopher Columbus history lessons marinated with tales of black women getting raped?

That issue of Ms Marvel did a better job of making Wakanda feel like a real place than Ta-nehisi has done in 1.5 years

Many have done better for BP Wakanda then the entirety of Coates garbage.

[BBeeryan]

It's literally unbelievable and astonishing that an actual black person giving an opportunity to write the "captain america/batman/spider-man" of black heroes, would opt to make that character's mytho a metaphor for what racist white people did to native americans. Because apparently no way could africans living in africa be indigenous to the african soil they built their country on. No way can men and women co-exist without rape culture, that's just something that had to be introduced to ensure Black Panther could be some little kid's Spider-Man. Remember, Ta-Nehisi stated that as his goal.

Ultimately it's irrelevant, because nobody reads the comics and it's just about the movies and outside media. But just the principle of what this coon syndrome negro is doing is disgusting.

This truth is undeniable. People have been trying to defang him since I started reading comics. It's truly sad.

Yup, you're preaching to the choir.

But others prefer selective memory and pretending that Wakanda was always some idealized perfect society with no problems. And when you say "um... no. what about ___, ____ and ____"

they like "Nope! It doesn't count!"

"That was different!"

lmao aint no damn difference. Other than it didn't suck when Priest wrote it.

So you're saying it's not so much what Coates did, it's more of how he went about doing it?

MoS came through with that knowledge. Not looking god for Storm fans. Scan could be seen as an analog to Storm and Klaw.

How sway?

oh that's not bad news lolol. it was already established in issue 17 the belief the wakandans had in her allowed her to utilize divine power or become divine. this revelation that the Wakandan gods were heroes first doesn't change that.

Exactly this. Coates clearly established this is what she was basically doing on her own in Africa. But those were long lost memories of her days on the serengeti.

[Cville]

This truth is undeniable. People have been trying to defang him since I started reading comics. It's truly sad.

So you're saying it's not so much what Coates did, it's more of how he went about doing it?

How sway?

Exactly this. Coates clearly established this is what she was basically doing on her own in Africa. But those were long lost memories of her days on the serengeti.

What I'm saying is that a combination of being mutants/enhanced plus "belief magic" made mortals into gods. So the Orisha are not gods and neither would Storm or Klaw. Pure speculation, but something in the area lets say East Africa allows mortals to become gods if belief that they are is strong enough. BP didn't become one because the WK already give this belief to Bast. Im probably over analyzing. lol

[Rumble]

This truth is undeniable. People have been trying to defang him since I started reading comics. It's truly sad.

So you're saying it's not so much what Coates did, it's more of how he went about doing it?

How sway?

Exactly this. Coates clearly established this is what she was basically doing on her own in Africa. But those were long lost memories of her days on the serengeti.

A bit of both perhaps.

1. In reference to the accusation that Wakanda was some perfect utopia before Ta-Nehisi's meddling, the truth of the matter is Priest and other writers long since debunked that shallow myth perpetuated by those who never read Black Panther before, as Anthony thoroughly elaborated on.

So on a superficial atmospheric level if someone were to say "Ta-Nehisi is simply adding inner turmoil and complexity to Wakanda", I say to that someone "you're full of horseshit and you're playing dumb by pretending all the prior examples "don't count"."

2. Then looking purely at what Ta-Nehisi did: Making Wakandans into metaphors for the anglo-saxons who committed the genocide and disenfranchisement of indigenous people, after an unsuccessful attempt of painting Wakandan males as rapists and T'Challa as a negligent who "doesn't want to be king" .

I'd say it's no longer an issue of "how he went about it", because IMO there's no ideal way of painting Wakandan males as rapists or painting Wakandans as Columbus in black face. That's just something Ta-Nehisi chose to do and did.

Maybe there's some crossover between the went about / did, and it may all be semantics.

[Old Man Ollie 1962]

The art of Justin Hunt. I had the pleasure of meeting him at my local comic book shop last week. I found him approachable, affable, and easy to converse with. Very talented artist.

[phumgano]

How long is Coates staying on for, another 5 years? Was that his plan.

[Ezyo1000]

A bit of both perhaps.

1. In reference to the accusation that Wakanda was some perfect utopia before Ta-Nehisi's meddling, the truth of the matter is Priest and other writers long since debunked that shallow myth perpetuated by those who never read Black Panther before, as Anthony thoroughly elaborated on.

So on a superficial atmospheric level if someone were to say "Ta-Nehisi is simply adding inner turmoil and complexity to Wakanda", I say to that someone "you're full of horseshit and you're playing dumb by pretending all the prior examples "don't count"."

2. Then looking purely at what Ta-Nehisi did: Making Wakandans into metaphors for the anglo-saxons who committed the genocide and disenfranchisement of indigenous people, after an unsuccessful attempt of painting Wakandan males as rapists and T'Challa as a negligent who "doesn't want to be king" .

I'd say it's no longer an issue of "how he went about it", because IMO there's no ideal way of painting Wakandan males as rapists or painting Wakandans as Columbus in black face. That's just something Ta-Nehisi chose to do and did.

Maybe there's some crossover between the went about / did, and it may all be semantics.

Spot on, people love to play dumb and act like: Priest didn't have inner turmoil happening within Wakanda, I mean that was a huge plot point throughout the entirety of his tenure, that's how his series started, T'Challa went to NY because a little girl from his tomorrow fund was killed and he roughed up those who did it, while he was there Wakanda was dealing with border skirmishes. Multiple times during the series it was brought up how the tribes didn't get along.

Hudlin had brought forth a more unified Wakanda, but they still had xenophobic tendencies, they still had inner turmoil. The difference was that Hudlin went and forced marvel and other people to recognize T'Challa and Wakanda as a character capable of standing with the big dogs by putting him in event's and crossover's.

However, people started claiming T'Challa was a Mary Sue and Wakanda was a Utopia and Wakandans were jerks because they had the cure for cancer and didn't share it with the rest of the world excuse excuse troll face etc.

But when Coates comes in with very offensive stereotypes and straight White guilt analog's for Wakandans as well as rape camps, inept king and government, forbidden lesbian love, suicide bombers, 3rd world stereotypical Africa, and Black dysfunction among others still. People jump on board that this is ground breaking work and he is showing a fleshed out Wakanda and making Tchalla more relatable and humanized. Aka Making the BP Mythos the safe negro as to not make white people uncomfortable.

The sooner the movie comes out, the better, hopefully Evan narcisse comes correct, and hopefully becomes the next Hudlin and breaks out with a new successful ongoing showcasing the real Tchalla while Coates fades away. Also looking forward to the BP annual and the one shots I hope something more comes for those as well

[Ezyo1000]

The art of Justin Hunt. I had the pleasure of meeting him at my local comic book shop last week. I found him approachable, affable, and easy to converse with. Very talented artist.

This is dope by the way. Great art

[C_haos]

I don't know what the fuss is about this issue. I think it like last issue was solid and Kirk's art was an added bonus the scene of the mother coming down on the winged panther was gorgeous.

I didn't have a problem with the people who would become Wakandans and there issue with the Originators. I think it ties in to all the stories/myths from all over the world about the spirits/nature and mans natural folly. I think an interesting point to make was that this wasn't an origin about Wakanda per se but about their Orishas a subtle distinction but leaves wiggle considerable wiggle room for a potential positive outcome for involved parties. I suspect a compromise may be in order of some sort the themes with this story arc actually parallel Avatar: LoK season 2 fairly close would be interesting if BP just leaves the portals open allowing free reign like Korra did.

The second arc and in general has been more focused and streamlined then the first. BP in this issue was resourceful, charismatic, and engaging all without throwing a punch. Shuri was everything and more able to discuss her faults and move forward . I really like how their relationship is portrayed in this issue. The inclusion of Thunderball is interesting yet again he may have a bigger part to play.

As far as future issue I am not going by the solitcs anymore they don't seem to be accurate at all this one mentions BP fighting former gods but that didn't happen and neither did the return of cadre of villains. They seem to be an issue ahead but even then the descriptions are a little off.

The one thing that is kind of clearing up is the timeline, So for Wakanda we have the Rise of Bast and Orishas/Defeat o Originators | Bast meeting Bashenga | Vibranium meteor being drawn by Wakandan sages | Bashenga becoming BP and protecting mound

[C_haos]

[B]

But when Coates comes in with very offensive stereotypes and straight White guilt analog's for Wakandans as well as rape camps, inept king and government, forbidden lesbian love, suicide bombers, 3rd world stereotypical Africa, and Black dysfunction among others still. People jump on board that this is ground breaking work and he is showing a fleshed out Wakanda and making Tchalla more relatable and humanized. Aka Making the BP Mythos the safe negro as to not make white people uncomfortable.

I don't see how any of those things listed make BP or Wakanda "safe. Especially when combined with the juxtaposition of other aspects with which has shown Wakanda in with a strong military, a staunch judicial system, a spiritual/tech advanced populace, positive portrayal of lgbt, a confident king, familial bonds. It paints the picture of something that is more like the world outside are window

[Cville]

So if Uncle Ben turned out to be one of those guys who held a person captive in the basement, how would Spiderman fans react?

[Ezyo1000]

I don't see how any of those things listed make BP or Wakanda "safe. Especially when combined with the juxtaposition of other aspects with which has shown Wakanda in with a strong military, a staunch judicial system, a spiritual/tech advanced populace, positive portrayal of lgbt, a confident king, familial bonds. It paints the picture of something that is more like the world outside are window

Lol you don't see how it makes BP or Wakanda safe?
Coates has taken all the positive things about BP and Wakanda and "fixed" them into offensive stereotypes. It can be much clearer then that. So you think that the world outside our window from BP Should be an offensive western view point of Africa and Black's in general? Because that what Coates thinks. He deflated Tchalla because he seems to have thought Tchalla has always been portrayed as "awesome awesome awesome" so he deconstructs him after he just had 8+ year's of poor handling and deconstruction. Then he starts taking cool aspects of Priest run and Hudlins and starts taking away from them with this poor view of black males "A man with that many beautiful women around him couldn't possibly not take advantage of that" he then takes a nation that has more respect and giving women high positions in their society as equals and has a mostly female supporting cast of capable women and turns it into Black dysfunction. Men are evil rapist, or inept uncaring fools and women are just poor victims that must rally together to fight the evil Black man. Contrived plots and he is inserting crap that literally goes against the mythos, you know the one telling Jewish guys came up with and shown more respect for and apparently more woke then Coates.

Safe negro and his safe negro nation is what Coates is trying to portray. They aren't any better then the rest of the world, they are colonists who took over the indigenous peoples land and drove them out in chains, while also having another Black man earlier in the Issue in chains and being told he is a slave to Wakanda... I mean this is safe negro syndrome running full throttle and it's Insulting. ESPECIALLY with Coogler and T'chadwick coming correct and showing a powerful, positive, inspiring, and amazing Black panther for little boys and girls to look up to. They are making Tchalla into some kids Spiderman (or really I should say into some kids Black Panther), Coates is making BP into Black people's white guilt

[Cville]

Just a reminder of the Coates mind set. Came out around #6

Funny enough the interviewer is Evan N.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/io9.giz...1786632598/amp