Uncanny Avengers #25 Spoilers/Discussion

[gurkle]

Yeah, if THAT PIECE OF INFO WAS STATED IN THE DIALOGUE, then the wording would not be off as it is now.

Well, Alex does mention that Xavier may still be alive in there.

Uncanny Avengers 025-012.jpg

[AcesX1X]

jim hammond roasts the actual hitler alive and he gets lauded as a war hero with statues and whole army bases named in his legacy.

magneto cinder blocks a functional nazi who is trying to start a new wave of concentration camps among other atrocities and he is "no better than him??"

WTF

[XPac]

And not everyone is Magneto.

Rogue said something similar when they were both in the Savage Land going up against megalomaniac Zala Dane. (And he ended up killing her too). At this point in literature the line itself is a tired, horrible cliche.

Course, it's from a woman who came up with the line: "Assemble their assess."

Rogues no poet, so I think we can give her a bit of a pass as far as using a somewhat cliched line given the circumstances.

[Stussyjones]

they are mad at a holocaust survivor killed a Nazi lol wtf.

[cranger]

I don't think Remender will be the first or the last writer to potray super heroes against killing even bad guys. I feel like a broken record here, but I think this is pretty much the expected response MOST heroes would have to someone smashing another persons head with a cinder block.

Not everyone is Wolverine.

While I think the heroes killing has become more common, this is a long held rule of the heroes. Writers tend to ignore it when they want to write violent stories but it still gets mentioned every once in a while. Part of the whole Schism in X-Men dealt with how characters like Storm did not like that Cyclops was willing to kill, since "X-Men do not kill".

[Mikekerr3]

It's the characters talking, not Remender, and isn't that really the position that most heroes would take - to condemn killing? And in this case, much of their outrage isn't just to do with killing the Skull but the idea that in killing the Skull Magneto is also potentially killing whatever might be left of Xaiver.

In real life heroes killing people like the Red Skull is considered heroic and necessary.

[Stussyjones]

Yep after reading this today's issue it's no wonder polaris is magnetos favorite child.

[XPac]

he's a nazi with the most powerful telepath's stolen brain who is standing in the middle of an active concentration camp.

all of these people have killed for far less crimes than this. it's ridiculous. why is magneto the only character in this issue with his priorities straight??

I'm not necessarily arguing that Red Skull doesn't deserve to die. What I am saying is that MOST heroes will object to killing someone in circumstances like that. Do I even have to explain that? We've seen this dozens and dozens of times in dozens and dozens of comics. It's the NORM for heroes to act that way.

If you disagee with their reaction fine... I'm just saying it's what any comic book reader at this point should frankly expect from MOST heroes (short of say Wolverine or Punisher).

And for Alex and Rogue in particular, I imagine if there's even a chance Xavier is still alive in there then on a personal level that would make it that much worse. Again, you can argue that they shouldn't necessarily prioritize Xavier in such a situation but it's nonetheless understandable they would react the way they're reacting. Rogue especially if she just talked to him.

[jen]

Rogue literally killed Wanda when she thought she was responsible for Xavier's death. Now she thinks she can save Xavier and Magneto took that from her. I am sure her choice of line in in character for Remender's Rogue. I don't know. He unleashed the Red Onslaught so now everyone is in big trouble.

[Double 0]

they are mad at a holocaust survivor killed a Nazi lol wtf.

Exactly! This whole scene just feels culturally tone deaf of the heroes. It goes beyond superheroics and mutants. Red Skull is super hitler.

Nevermind that this isn't the first time Magneto has tried to kill Red Skull. He just decided to make it quicker and more definitive this time.

[XPac]

they are mad at a holocaust survivor killed a Nazi lol wtf.

It's been mentioned a couple times, but the possiblity of Xavier being killed was likely also a factor.

Though yes, generally speaking heroes are against killing. I am surprised so many are surprised at that reaction.

[Prof. Warren]

In real life heroes killing people like the Red Skull is considered heroic and necessary.

Not by everyone. There will never be a consensus on whether killing is ever justified. I think most people reading UA #25 will cheer on Magneto but it'd be wrong to have every character be on board with what he did. As much as some will say taking lethal action is the only just course, others will refute that based on their own moral grounds.

[AcesX1X]

Rogue literally killed Wanda when she thought she was responsible for Xavier's death. Now she thinks she can save Xavier and Magneto took that from her. I am sure her choice of line in in character for Remender's Rogue. I don't know. He unleashed the Red Onslaught so now everyone is in big trouble.

this is perhaps rogue's most pathetic moment as a mutant and hero. i am ashamed of her.

[Stussyjones]

Exactly! This whole scene just feels culturally tone deaf of the heroes. Like it goes beyond superheroics and mutants.

Totally Agree

[magnuskn]

I don't think Remender will be the first or the last writer to potray super heroes against killing even bad guys. I feel like a broken record here, but I think this is pretty much the expected response MOST heroes would have to someone smashing another persons head with a cinder block.

Not everyone is Wolverine.

I am very much against casual killing by superheroes. However, the Red Skull, who has been wielding Xaviers telepathy as a weapon of mass hate indoctrination and who has been building concentration camps for mass murder is fair game. There is a degree of scale between "heroes" like the Punisher killing random drug dealers and a hero like Magneto killing a Hitler analogue and that scale is between petty crime and genocide.