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  1. #226
    Ultimate Member numberthirty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OBrianTallent View Post
    has anyone compiled the sales results for each issue of the finches' fun so far? I would be curious to see how the sales are flowing.
    Since June:

    - WW #41: 45,284
    - WW #42: 36.668
    - WW #43: 39,646
    - WW #44: 36,151

  2. #227
    Wonder Moderator Gaelforce's Avatar
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    - WW #41: 45,284
    - WW #42: 36.668
    - WW #43: 39,646
    - WW #44: 36,151
    - WW #45: 33,885

    Other than 43 (popular Bombshell variant month), the book has been in steady decline.

    -19% (Big drop following the end of the first Finch arc)
    +8% (Variant cover increase)
    -9%
    -6%

    The biggest significance is that, in only one year, the Finch's sales are already below where Azzarello's sales were on his last issues. One year ago:

    WW #34 35,744
    WW #35 35,968

    It represents a 21% drop from the Finch's 2nd issue (counting the first issue didn't seem fair as new teams first issues almost always get a bump)

  3. #228
    Extraordinary Member Dr. Poison's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gaelforce View Post
    - WW #41: 45,284
    - WW #42: 36.668
    - WW #43: 39,646
    - WW #44: 36,151
    - WW #45: 33,885

    Other than 43 (popular Bombshell variant month), the book has been in steady decline.

    -19% (Big drop following the end of the first Finch arc)
    +8% (Variant cover increase)
    -9%
    -6%

    The biggest significance is that, in only one year, the Finch's sales are already below where Azzarello's sales were on his last issues. One year ago:

    WW #34 35,744
    WW #35 35,968

    It represents a 21% drop from the Finch's 2nd issue (counting the first issue didn't seem fair as new teams first issues almost always get a bump)

    I'd be totally fine if DC decides to reboot the book with "The Legend of Wonder Woman" story as the new "cannon" going forward and move the creative team from that book over to this one.
    Currently Reading:Aquaman, Doomsday Clock, Freedom Fighters, Gotham City Monsters, Hawkman, Justice League, Justice League Dark, Shazam, Wonder Twins, Wonder Woman, & Young Justice.

  4. #229
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    On the positive side, as much as there can be any positive from a decline in sales, it actually gives DC more incentive to change the books creative team or direction .

  5. #230
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    On the positive side, as much as there can be any positive from a decline in sales, it actually gives DC more incentive to change the books creative team or direction .
    DC seems very slow to do it anyway.

  6. #231
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tayswift View Post
    DC seems very slow to do it anyway.
    Maybe they're planning to start a new volume and get the sales reset that can come with a new issue 1, and they're just waiting until after issue 50. Waiting for that would be understandable; Wonder Woman deserves to be one of the relatively few New 52 books that makes it to issue 50.
    Last edited by Silvanus; 11-27-2015 at 06:19 AM.

  7. #232
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silvanus View Post
    Maybe they're planning to start a new volume and get the sales reset that can come with a new issue 1, and they're just waiting until after issue 50. Waiting for that would be understandable; Wonder Woman deserves to be one of the relatively few New 52 books that makes it to issue 50.
    for me whatever, better be cancelled at last azzarello issue, than only be delivered only crap that only hurt sales and character credibility. It's only a number that mean nothing. Now I doubt DC will relaunch it

  8. #233
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    On the positive side, as much as there can be any positive from a decline in sales, it actually gives DC more incentive to change the books creative team or direction .
    I suspect the Finches are a placeholder for Snyder/Capullo and they'll be out as soon as Capullo finishes his 6-issue miniseries with Mark Millar which can take a while

  9. #234
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    I just finished Superman/Wonder Woman 23. I dropped Wonder Woman in August. But the impression of her character's depiction especially after Azarello and Soul left her respective titles has been of her either being an extremely violent character or a deer in a headlights character caught in a maelstrom of violence she has no idea what to do about... Which brings up a very important question. Who are her current books aimed at? What is the target audience?

    I would be curious to read what other people think. For me, having so much violence in a Wonder Woman book and the way Wonder Woman responds to that violence just seem so wrong and off putting. I admit I am not a life-long fan of the character, but in my mind, yes Wonder Woman is a warrior, but she is also a very skilled diplomat. She is a character that asks questions first and punches later. And as someone who is smart, capable, experienced, she tries to find the best solution to a problem with violence as a last resort.

    Why is it so hard for her creative teams to portray that? Anyways, I hope Wonder Woman gets a complete revamp in time for her movie...

  10. #235
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pamp_Lusa View Post
    I suspect the Finches are a placeholder for Snyder/Capullo and they'll be out as soon as Capullo finishes his 6-issue miniseries with Mark Millar which can take a while
    What kind of bothers me is that creative teams with much better visions for their characters get sacked after 6-10 issues while the Finches are well in their second year of storytelling judging by the solicitations released. Sales have gone down considerably, too, and the only reason this book is still above 30K is because it's a marquee character and people will follow the book and retailers will order issues because it's Wonder Woman, and she is in BvS, and has a movie coming up. People over at DC are smart folks, so I'm sure they are well aware of what the sale figures mean... So what's up with holding on to that creative team, huh?

  11. #236
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    Quote Originally Posted by solletaire View Post
    What kind of bothers me is that creative teams with much better visions for their characters get sacked after 6-10 issues while the Finches are well in their second year of storytelling judging by the solicitations released. Sales have gone down considerably, too, and the only reason this book is still above 30K is because it's a marquee character and people will follow the book and retailers will order issues because it's Wonder Woman, and she is in BvS, and has a movie coming up. People over at DC are smart folks, so I'm sure they are well aware of what the sale figures mean... So what's up with holding on to that creative team, huh?
    I think DC want to keep Finch satisfied, so they let him and his wife stay on ww. david was a exclusive contract. sales are going down and DC is relying a lot on variant covers.

    DC will never let capullo and snyder get out of batman, it is DC cashcow.

  12. #237
    Extraordinary Member Dr. Poison's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by solletaire View Post
    I just finished Superman/Wonder Woman 23. I dropped Wonder Woman in August. But the impression of her character's depiction especially after Azarello and Soul left her respective titles has been of her either being an extremely violent character or a deer in a headlights character caught in a maelstrom of violence she has no idea what to do about... Which brings up a very important question. Who are her current books aimed at? What is the target audience?

    I would be curious to read what other people think. For me, having so much violence in a Wonder Woman book and the way Wonder Woman responds to that violence just seem so wrong and off putting. I admit I am not a life-long fan of the character, but in my mind, yes Wonder Woman is a warrior, but she is also a very skilled diplomat. She is a character that asks questions first and punches later. And as someone who is smart, capable, experienced, she tries to find the best solution to a problem with violence as a last resort.

    Why is it so hard for her creative teams to portray that? Anyways, I hope Wonder Woman gets a complete revamp in time for her movie...

    I'm not sure how I can understand your statement that Wonder Woman is more violent under Finch than Azzarello considering that in Azzarello's run, Diana did the following:


    - Beheaded 2 centaurs.
    - Impaled Strife with a broken liquor bottle.
    - Punched out Aleka who had not laid a finger on her.
    - Sexually assaulted Orion and threatened to castrate him.
    - Impaled and murdered Ares. I know folks will argue that she didn't want to do it but it was still quite violent to see Ares be shish-ka-bobbed.


    Dan Didio said about 6 months ago that they were very comfortable with the direction that Azzarello set and were moving forward with it so in light of all of this, I see the book is aimed at the same audience but perhaps expanded to those who want a slightly more mainstream Wonder Woman title.
    Currently Reading:Aquaman, Doomsday Clock, Freedom Fighters, Gotham City Monsters, Hawkman, Justice League, Justice League Dark, Shazam, Wonder Twins, Wonder Woman, & Young Justice.

  13. #238
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Poison View Post
    Dan Didio said about 6 months ago that they were very comfortable with the direction that Azzarello set and were moving forward with it so in light of all of this, I see the book is aimed at the same audience but perhaps expanded to those who want a slightly more mainstream Wonder Woman title.
    That might be where it's meant to be "aimed," but the book seems to be missing that target; as Gael pointed out, the book's sales after only one year are now lower than Azzarello's after three years. My impression from forum posts is that Azzarello's fans are no happier with the book than any other part of the readership.

    Perhaps this is partly because her violence in Finch's run has sometimes seemed so misdirected and poorly controlled--like when she attacks Swamp Thing for no good reason, or when she attacks the bug creature without asking questions first. To me, this contrasts with some of your Azzarello examples--like when Diana stops and walks away after punching Aleka just once, even though Aleka had been turning her people against her. Or when she "impales" Strife's hand--doing no real physical damage, and not even making the goddess say "ouch"--but then just lets Strife walk away after she had threatened Zola's baby (and even though she had recently caused the Amazons to kill each other.)

    And, in Finch's run, not only is her violence not under control, but when she's not being violent, she's still not in control. As solletare pointed out, she seems like a deer in the headlights, or like she's just tossed around by adversaries and by circumstances. So, if she's losing Azzarello's audience, perhaps it because that audience liked seeing a Diana who was (in general, most of the time) more in control of herself and more influential on others.

    - Beheaded 2 centaurs.
    Just for the record (though I'm not sure how much it really matters), she's not shown to have "beheaded" either of them. She kills one of them violently off-panel; we just see the blood, not the actual manner of killing. The other was still alive (if you can call these reanimated dead horses "alive") when last seen.
    Last edited by Silvanus; 12-04-2015 at 07:28 AM.

  14. #239
    Extraordinary Member Dr. Poison's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silvanus View Post
    That might be where it's meant to be "aimed," but the book seems to be missing that target; as Gael pointed out, the book's sales after only one year are now lower than Azzarello's after three years. My impression from forum posts is that Azzarello's fans are no happier with the book than any other part of the readership.

    Perhaps this is partly because her violence in Finch's run has sometimes seemed so misdirected and poorly controlled--like when she attacks Swamp Thing for no good reason, or when she attacks the bug creature without asking questions first. To me, this contrasts with some of your Azzarello examples--like when Diana stops and walks away after punching Aleka just once, even though Aleka had been turning her people against her. Or when she "impales" Strife's hand--doing no real physical damage, and not even making the goddess say "ouch"--but then just lets Strife walk away after she had threatened Zola's baby (and even though she had recently caused the Amazons to kill each other.)

    And, in Finch's run, not only is her violence not under control, but when she's not being violent, she's still not in control. As solletare pointed out, she seems like a deer in the headlights, or like she's just tossed around by adversaries and by circumstances. So, if she's losing Azzarello's audience, perhaps it because that audience liked seeing a Diana who was (in general, most of the time) more in control of herself and more influential on others.



    Just for the record (though I'm not sure how much it really matters), she's not shown to have "beheaded" either of them. She kills one of them violently off-panel; we just see the blood, not the actual manner of killing. The other was still alive (if you can call these reanimated dead horses "alive") when last seen.


    The good thin about Finch is that both of your examples of her portrayal of Diana's violence are from her first arc and neither Swamp Thing or the bug creature "said ouch" so they don't count just like Strife's impalement doesn't count for you, right?. Since then, Diana hasn't done anything all that violent so Finch seems to have learned from her mistakes where as violence was present through almost all of Azzarello's run.
    Currently Reading:Aquaman, Doomsday Clock, Freedom Fighters, Gotham City Monsters, Hawkman, Justice League, Justice League Dark, Shazam, Wonder Twins, Wonder Woman, & Young Justice.

  15. #240
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    Moved post to new thread on "Finch/Azzarello Comparisons and Contrasts."
    Last edited by Silvanus; 12-04-2015 at 07:12 PM.

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