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Thread: The FLASH

  1. #11776
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    I wonder if that Injustice Protocol will show up as a plot for Superman and Lois or Batwoman?

  2. #11777
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beantownbrown View Post
    They forgot to bring him back and kill him in Crisis, so they decided to do it in Season 8 instead!

  3. #11778
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    So apparently the Arrowverse Justice League have been fairly active off-screen (don't know where Sara found the time to be on another team giving all the Post-Crisis Legends stuff, but time travel) and fought Felix Faust. And something happened there (presumably Faust whammied someone) that made them enact Injustice protocols in case any of them ever went bad so the other members would be on-hand to stop them. So as to basically prevent the Arrowverse from becoming the Injustice universe.

    Would Meta-Dampeners not work? I guess there's always the possibility Barry could just find a way to get it off, but they've been effective against him in the past.

    Iris being the rational and sensible person trying to give Barry the benefit of the doubt and believing he's being framed while Cecile is losing it...I guess she has her history of mental illness and her powers make her grief for Joe more pronounced so it's harder for her to keep a level-head by comparison, although even Iris was convinced she was wrong until Allegra told her to stick to her guns.

    I liked the call-backs to Henderson's death and Jefferson comparing Barry to Gambi, which is high praise. The also put in that bit where Barry puts on black musicians and Jefferson assumes he's trying to impress him even though Barry just grew up in a black household and that's the music Joe got him into which the BL writers were planning to use in the potential Flash guest appearance on the show.

    I would hesitate to say Cecile knows Barry the best of almost anyone. I mean, Iris? Even Caitlin has interacted with Barry more than Cecile has interacted with Barry. I mean, I guess technically she's Barry's step-mom but still.

    Could Cecile think of no one better to help than The Top? Y'know, a known criminal and sociopath who sold out her own boyfriend? Who gets off on messing with people? And this is the person Cecile promise to help lift her parole restrictions? And then they take her to Team Flash's current headquarters and lets her see Chester and Caitlin, although I guess they made sure she didn't see any of the screens with Barry's face on it. And to the surprise of no one she ends up betraying them to Despero, although it doesn't end well for her either. I did find it kind of funny that Mirror Master was better at running a gang than she was and he wasn't even real.

    Iris spots the thread when she notices deteriorating time particles thanks to her sickness, and it turns out there's even a Negative Still Force. So, what, has Thawne mastered all the Negative Forces as a means to defeat Barry?

    I sometimes do forget Caitlin is a widow and she had to deal with losing Ronnie twice.

    Cecile "beat" Despero with the power of love, although it seems like it was just a projection and not the real him and he got the info he needed anyways so it didn't really matter that much.

    Flash vs. Black Lightning. I guess it's not Injustice without an unnecessary Superhero fight. I love when Jefferson caught the lightning throw and threw it back at Barry because of course he would.

    It all hits Barry how he's been acting when they knock over Oliver's memorial and he, with Jefferson's help, realizes Ollie would have never given up on him and that he wouldn't want Barry to give up either.

    It's kind of funny that the first time Ryan Wilder gets to interact with other heroes it's 10 years in the future and from a timeline that's probably going to get undone. Also I guess in 10 years Chester grows his hair out and Ryan Choi becomes The Atom.

    My God, Thawne actually pulled a "Return of Barry Allen," more or less. He turned Barry into the villain so he could become the hero and replace him, right down to stealing Iris as his wife. It's diabolical and such a Thawne thing to do. My only question is where Darhk fits into it.

  4. #11779
    Astonishing Member Captain Craig's Avatar
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    I've gotten caught up on Flash. I was down with Covid for a spell(despite the two shots) so tv backlog has set in on me. My smell is still not back yet, I'm told it could be weeks/months. Argh. Anyway.

    The set up through 3 episodes that Despero is actually the "hero" of the story is interesting. Clearly he's not, well, clearly to comic book readers for sure.

    Joe is dead? With so many characters bouncing around I'm sorry to say I hadn't noticed he wasn't around through 3 episodes until they said "he's dead". Seems like this will be part of overall arc, getting Joe back with a "fixed" timeline.
    That said the writing to me felt unnecessarily forced and cliche between Cecile and Iris about how to handle/interpret the data. Drama for the sake of drama proves to be bad as I saw it.

    Why can Iris see the decaying isotopes again? Does this have something to do with her time in the Mirror-verse or being the "mother" of the Forces? I honestly can't recall.

    The revelation of why Chester is a pacifist has probably been the best "chunk" of character growth for any character through these three episodes. He burned his friends house down. Ouch.

    So I guess I forgot that Barry owned STAR Labs. What season was that? I'm just guessing one of the pass thru dying Wells left it to him. That said the city just marches in and shuts him down. I mean they just really have no security at that place. I get having them paged in from an outside gate is boring TV but wow, just anyone walks up in there(as plot/drama demands it). Also, assuming Barry has kept his ownership of STAR Labs hush hush from his day job isn't this radiation exposure something that would make news of some type? His name tied to the facility as owner is bound to get calls and background checks, right?

    Alas, Gideon, we knew you well.

    Jefferson Pierce and all his scenes were great to watch. He was still portrayed as sullen but without the baggage of Freeland the character felt a bit less depressed and joyless.

    Real world casting issues or in 2031 has Alex and Kelly split up, or gasp, did Flash kill Kelly? My instant thought during that scene was "where is Kelly?". Also, so Kate has never returned, even by 2031 to be Batwoman? *wink, wink* Dealing with actors you got now, I know.

    The whole issue with using 2031 as this future point is we already know from Arrow, which takes place in 2040 something and XS's future in 2049 is that Flash is still regarded as a hero. So the fact someone is mucking with the timeline makes perfect sense. However, Flash and timeline stories have been too heavy handed for 8 years now.
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  5. #11780
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    Thoughts on the latest episode.

    We are more than halfway through. This definitely felt like the bridge episode.
    Light on action, plenty of long speeches (it felt like a Supergirl episode).

    You really have a Barry with the beginning interactions with Jefferson, being almost
    hysterical with fear. Injustice? Please, God, no. That whole you are the best of us.
    Nothing against Barry, but well, has Black Lightning never met Superman? Might want
    to brush up on his superhero history.

    I found the whole Iris-Cecile argument more than a little over the top. Iris is just trying
    to ask some questions about her father's death, trying to figure out what is going on with
    her husband. Cecile went from 0 mph to 250 mph very fast. It proved pointless against Despero.

    I thought the sections with the temporal bubbles (perhaps there was another phrase, but my
    brain is just starting to function this morning) was well done. It also helped to explain what was going on.
    You have this sense that we will see Joe again. I hope so anyway.

    The final scenes with Reverse Flash were very well done. Of course, you knew it was coming, but still
    it had a powerful impact. I hope in the episodes to come that Barry is more level-headed. You finally had a sense
    that Barry wants to fix the timeline. Personally, this is something of a plot hole. I mean if you know something going on
    in 2031 is the problem, why not go fix it right away? Instead, we have gotten lots of meandering around.

  6. #11781
    DC Comics Forum Mod The Darknight Detective's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RobinGA View Post
    The final scenes with Reverse Flash were very well done. Of course, you knew it was coming, but still
    it had a powerful impact. I hope in the episodes to come that Barry is more level-headed. You finally had a sense
    that Barry wants to fix the timeline. Personally, this is something of a plot hole. I mean if you know something going on
    in 2031 is the problem, why not go fix it right away? Instead, we have gotten lots of meandering around.
    How can you fix the timeline when only Thawne gets to mess with it without penalties? We all know Barry can't do anything without disrupting things more. Of course, I assume that will be temporarily waived by the conclusion of this story arc.
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  7. #11782
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    Cliff notes:

    Can we do the Hall of Justice, some Justice? Like, sure it was under construction at the tail end of Crisis and just a big empty space, but it still is that. Could we not put up some fake walls, build like a more specific war room type of setting for the table to be to just feel more like this is a team, especially since they have contingencies if they go rogue, we get Faust namedropped, so you would think they have had some offscreen adventures.

    And they could not figure out or even think of Barry maybe being at the Hall if he was not anywhere else? Do they not know about the hall? I mean clearly they do cuz Chester knows it by name, so why did no one think to look there? Despero needed to a power boost for that?

    Loved the blow up between Iris and Cecile, just a great scene dealing with their respective grief and it causing them to clash. Great scenes between Barry and Jefferson (before the pointless SFX wasting ‘fight’ of course) Loved the building of their friendship in Crisis and the building upon it here.

    Thawne……I maintain that it is two soon for Thawne. Like we knew he was going to be a larger cause of shenanigans once we knew Cavanaugh was coming back. But I think it is way too soon since he was just in the finale. Thawne should be gone until the last two or three episodes to close out the series. Not just a season. THE. SERIES.

    But it is what it is, we shall see how things all shake out in the end with Despero being a patsy for Thawne, does he end up helping Team Flash beat him in the end or will they still have to take down Despero and then spoil Thawne’s plans.

    Last edited by KabutoRyder; 12-01-2021 at 11:45 AM.
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  8. #11783
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Craig View Post
    Why can Iris see the decaying isotopes again? Does this have something to do with her time in the Mirror-verse or being the "mother" of the Forces? I honestly can't recall.
    She has a Speed Force sickness.
    So I guess I forgot that Barry owned STAR Labs. What season was that? I'm just guessing one of the pass thru dying Wells left it to him. That said the city just marches in and shuts him down. I mean they just really have no security at that place. I get having them paged in from an outside gate is boring TV but wow, just anyone walks up in there(as plot/drama demands it). Also, assuming Barry has kept his ownership of STAR Labs hush hush from his day job isn't this radiation exposure something that would make news of some type? His name tied to the facility as owner is bound to get calls and background checks, right?
    First episode of season 2 Thawne!Wells willed everything to Barry.
    Real world casting issues or in 2031 has Alex and Kelly split up, or gasp, did Flash kill Kelly? My instant thought during that scene was "where is Kelly?". Also, so Kate has never returned, even by 2031 to be Batwoman? *wink, wink* Dealing with actors you got now, I know.
    Kelly might be with Esme.
    Quote Originally Posted by RobinGA View Post
    We are more than halfway through. This definitely felt like the bridge episode.
    Light on action, plenty of long speeches (it felt like a Supergirl episode).
    Jefferson is good at speeches .
    You really have a Barry with the beginning interactions with Jefferson, being almost
    hysterical with fear. Injustice? Please, God, no. That whole you are the best of us.
    Nothing against Barry, but well, has Black Lightning never met Superman? Might want
    to brush up on his superhero history.
    Might be a mix of Pre and Post-Crisis memories. Ollie said that to Barry before he even really knew Superman and Flash was the closest thing Earth-1 had to a Superman pre-Crisis.
    The final scenes with Reverse Flash were very well done. Of course, you knew it was coming, but still
    it had a powerful impact. I hope in the episodes to come that Barry is more level-headed. You finally had a sense
    that Barry wants to fix the timeline. Personally, this is something of a plot hole. I mean if you know something going on
    in 2031 is the problem, why not go fix it right away? Instead, we have gotten lots of meandering around.
    Barry tries to avoid time traveling when he can help it.
    Quote Originally Posted by KabutoRyder View Post
    Cliff notes:

    Can we do the Hall of Justice, some Justice? Like, sure it was under construction at the tail end of Crisis and just a big empty space, but it still is that. Could we not put up some fake walls, build like a more specific war room type of setting for the table to be to just feel more like this is a team, especially since they have contingencies if they go rogue, we get Faust namedropped, so you would think they have had some offscreen adventures.
    I guess if they ever had a reason to use it as more than just a bunker they might feel like spending the budget to spruce it up although when most of what they do is off-screen...
    And they could not figure out or even think of Barry maybe being at the Hall if he was not anywhere else? Do they not know about the hall? I mean clearly they do cuz Chester knows it by name, so why did no one think to look there? Despero needed to a power boost for that?
    Yeah, that would've been my first thought as to where Barry went too.
    Loved the blow up between Iris and Cecile, just a great scene dealing with their respective grief and it causing them to clash. Great scenes between Barry and Jefferson (before the pointless SFX wasting ‘fight’ of course) Loved the building of their friendship in Crisis and the building upon it here.
    It's just nice to see Jefferson again .
    Thawne……I maintain that it is two soon for Thawne. Like we knew he was going to be a larger cause of shenanigans once we knew Cavanaugh was coming back. But I think it is way too soon since he was just in the finale. Thawne should be gone until the last two or three episodes to close out the series. Not just a season. THE. SERIES.
    I think this will probably be the last time we see Thawne for a while.

  9. #11784
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    Alright, that ending really (wait for it!) flashed me.

    I really wonder how Thawne could've turned Barry's allies THIS much against him. I mean seriously, he and Iris?

    I sincerely hope Despero will finally end him.

  10. #11785
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Craig View Post
    I've gotten caught up on Flash. I was down with Covid for a spell(despite the two shots) so tv backlog has set in on me. My smell is still not back yet, I'm told it could be weeks/months. Argh. Anyway.

    Why can Iris see the decaying isotopes again? Does this have something to do with her time in the Mirror-verse or being the "mother" of the Forces? I honestly can't recall.

    So I guess I forgot that Barry owned STAR Labs. What season was that? I'm just guessing one of the pass thru dying Wells left it to him. That said the city just marches in and shuts him down. I mean they just really have no security at that place. I get having them paged in from an outside gate is boring TV but wow, just anyone walks up in there(as plot/drama demands it). Also, assuming Barry has kept his ownership of STAR Labs hush hush from his day job isn't this radiation exposure something that would make news of some type? His name tied to the facility as owner is bound to get calls and background checks, right?

    Alas, Gideon, we knew you well.

    Real world casting issues or in 2031 has Alex and Kelly split up, or gasp, did Flash kill Kelly? My instant thought during that scene was "where is Kelly?". Also, so Kate has never returned, even by 2031 to be Batwoman? *wink, wink* Dealing with actors you got now, I know.

    The whole issue with using 2031 as this future point is we already know from Arrow, which takes place in 2040 something and XS's future in 2049 is that Flash is still regarded as a hero. So the fact someone is mucking with the timeline makes perfect sense. However, Flash and timeline stories have been too heavy handed for 8 years now.
    Iris has some kind of time sickness that caused her to jump to different timelines. Apparently she can see force particles as well.

    Eobard Wells left STAR Labs to Barry in his will- it was stated in the first episode of Season 2.

    I feel we knew this Gideon hardly at all. In fact, I thought that the Monitor destroyed her when he fried the pedestal right before Crisis. Though I wonder- since Gideon came from the future, if everything Thawn's done is undone by the end of the crossover, would she be restored, or stay deleted?

    I take it this future will be deleted at the end of the crossover, probably along with Thawne. Or maybe how Barry beats Thawne is what brings back Eddie.

  11. #11786
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Darknight Detective View Post
    How can you fix the timeline when only Thawne gets to mess with it without penalties? We all know Barry can't do anything without disrupting things more. Of course, I assume that will be temporarily waived by the conclusion of this story arc.
    That was before. Now Barry has LEVELED UP!!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by KabutoRyder View Post
    Cliff notes:
    Can we do the Hall of Justice, some Justice? Like, sure it was under construction at the tail end of Crisis and just a big empty space, but it still is that. Could we not put up some fake walls, build like a more specific war room type of setting for the table to be to just feel more like this is a team, especially since they have contingencies if they go rogue, we get Faust namedropped, so you would think they have had some offscreen adventures.
    I'll do you one better- can we just make the Hall of Justice the new base for The Flash? Let's leave STAR Labs, which still has a hole in the roof (I swear I thought they fixed that)? I get that maybe they want to only use the Hall for crossovers, but even Oliver got a new secret lair after a few seasons. Hell, Supergirl got a new base for just the last season. Let's spruce up the hall, put the table in a conference room, and use the rest for Barry and his team.

  12. #11787
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    Quote Originally Posted by AnakinFlair View Post
    That was before. Now Barry has LEVELED UP!!!!



    I'll do you one better- can we just make the Hall of Justice the new base for The Flash? Let's leave STAR Labs, which still has a hole in the roof (I swear I thought they fixed that)? I get that maybe they want to only use the Hall for crossovers, but even Oliver got a new secret lair after a few seasons. Hell, Supergirl got a new base for just the last season. Let's spruce up the hall, put the table in a conference room, and use the rest for Barry and his team.
    Better yet, can supergirl and her crew just give them her headquarters? I didn't see much of it, but it seemed better than the warehouse that sits empty most of the time.

  13. #11788
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    Quote Originally Posted by protege View Post
    Better yet, can supergirl and her crew just give them her headquarters? I didn't see much of it, but it seemed better than the warehouse that sits empty most of the time.
    I agree, in that it was kind of ridiculous to give us a new base just for your last season (though maybe they planned it before they knew they were getting canceled). But at the same time, it would be weird to see Barry and Co. in the Tower every week, and not see Kara, or Alex, or any of the others. You can only give so many weak excuses before you really start to wonder where everyone else is.

  14. #11789
    Moderator Frontier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AnakinFlair View Post
    That was before. Now Barry has LEVELED UP!!!!
    For the record that line was not used in this episode .
    I'll do you one better- can we just make the Hall of Justice the new base for The Flash? Let's leave STAR Labs, which still has a hole in the roof (I swear I thought they fixed that)? I get that maybe they want to only use the Hall for crossovers, but even Oliver got a new secret lair after a few seasons. Hell, Supergirl got a new base for just the last season. Let's spruce up the hall, put the table in a conference room, and use the rest for Barry and his team.
    I thought Crisis fixed the hole.

    To be honest the Hall of Justice does seem like a good alternative to STAR Labs.

  15. #11790
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frontier View Post
    For the record that line was not used in this episode .

    I thought Crisis fixed the hole.

    To be honest the Hall of Justice does seem like a good alternative to STAR Labs.
    I did too! But I swear halfway through season 7, the hole reappeared again. Unless I was mistaken.

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