The FLASH TV SERIES

[kingaliencracker]

At this point it's safe to assume that the Man in the Iron Mask is the Jay Garrick/Flash from yet another alternate Earth (let's call it Earth-3). Taking that as a given, though, there are still some significant questions to be answered when the final reveal comes.

1) Who actually invented the Velocity drug? Zoom/Zolomon or Garrick? And if it was Garrick, did he use it on himself? And if so, is he dying, like Zoom and Trajectory? If so, that might explain the generally lethargic, listless demeanor he's displayed whenever we've seen him in his cell (although that could just as easily be despair and hopelessness setting in).

2) Was the man Zoom showed Caitlyn in the park (when he was tying to throw her off the trail) really the Earth-1 Hunter Zolomon? Or was he Zoom's time remnant double in civilian clothes? The explanation Zoom gave Caitlyn for why there was no E1 Jay Garrick was that Zolomon--who was born Jay Garrick--lost his parents as a child and was put into the foster system at a young age and had his name changed. Well, guess who else lost his parents at a young age and was put into the foster care system? And, if my memory is correct (and it often isn't), at no point during the childhood Flashbacks did we ever hear L'il Zoom called by his name (I think his father calls him "Sport" or something like that). So is it possible (rhetorical question; of course it is) that E2 Hunter Zolomon was actually born as Jay Garrick? Because if so, and the man in the mask is E3 Jay Garrick, that would make Zoom his evil doppelganger.

That's my theory, and I'm sticking to it (unless I change my mind).

Here's my thought process...

I think originally they were going to have Zoom be an evil version of Jay, and Jay would be the Man in the Iron Mask.

Now, I think Zoom/Zolomon is going to be a totally separate entity from Jay Garrick - the REAL Jay, that is. I still think Jay is the Man in the Iron Mask, but I'm also open to the possibility that the writers may change their minds and it may be someone else, such as Eddie Thawne. I also think if the Man in the Iron Mask is Jay, it will be a different actor portraying him.

[signalman112]

Zoom origin 'A'.
Rest of the episde 'D'. Barry was VERY DUMB. He already proved that he was faster then Zoom. Take him out and lock him up and throw away the key.

Not of a very good week for the DC Shows by Greg Berlanti and Company. All 3 were drag down by: Silly relationship issues, hokey resoluations to the plot, dumb decisions
by the heroes.
As much as it makes me giddy that they have 4 shows going, It seems to me they have spread themselves very thin.
Either ditch a show(looks like SUPERGIRL is in danger of being axed) or hired more staff.
Plus Berlanti has RIVERDALE in the pipeline.

[Prime]

Zoom is a Wally West villain lol. I gotta say Hunter was Jay for a couple of years. Wells confirms this. So he only did it for Lol's??

[Jim Kelly]

The simplest answer for the Man in the Iron Mask is twins. It worked for Alexander Dumas.

As interesting as another Earth would be, I think it's too late in the season to introduce that wrinkle. Save it for season 3.

[longshot3]

I keep thinking the man in the iron mask will turn out to be John Wesley Shipp, maybe he's the real Jay Garrick!!

[Captain Smith]

The hope speech was just a plot device with some neuroscience blather from someone who took Psych 101. They were going to conquer the universe with it when anyone can get a pep talk and break the spell. Supergirl has true grit - the vision fight could have killed Non. Flash wimped out. Should have killed Zoom or went for him again rather than talking about a deal. A deal under coercion is not a deal. In hostage situations, the law will talk and talk to line you up for the shot.

[Den]

I love this show, but yeah, the latest episode was a big disappointment.

[90'sCartoonMan]

Wasn't feeling this one either. What really got me was the trap for Zoom, which was cool and worked perfectly, but then they put a boot on him that he could easily get out of? I don't know what's worse, that being the extent of Barry's plan to contain him or the fact that Zoom didn't break out of it much sooner. After that, the episode lost me, and I couldn't wrap my head around the time remnant stuff.

At least Cisco's scenes were good (he takes his midichlorians seriously), I'm looking forward to more Wally interaction with Team Flash, and Iris developing feelings for Barry can only mean Patty's return is just around the corner.

The show pretty much allows everyone to enable Barry's bad decisions. The closest they have right now is E2 Wells, but even then he pretty much gets made out to be the bad guy when he chooses not to help Barry in his stupid decisions.

Guess now we know why Henry hasn't been around in a while. He's usually the guy with the POV opposite Joe. As for Wells, I was expecting him to sabotage Zolomon the first chance he got.

And as per Greg Berlanti's twitter:

It looks like we're going to be getting the real Jay Garrick.

Some people may not like it, but I love how vocal Mark Waid is when criticizing things (like Man of Steel). I had a similar reaction. I mean, this is Jay Garrick, one of the very first superheroes EVER and this is the first time he's played a significant role in other media (closest to this was an episode or two of Batman the Brave and the Bold), and to make him some deranged killer from an alternate universe who only acts the part of a hero to snatch away people's hope is a huge disservice to the character. Bit of a relief to know they have further plans with a real version of Jay.

Was the man Zoom showed Caitlyn in the park (when he was tying to throw her off the trail) really the Earth-1 Hunter Zolomon? Or was he Zoom's time remnant double in civilian clothes? The explanation Zoom gave Caitlyn for why there was no E1 Jay Garrick was that Zolomon--who was born Jay Garrick--lost his parents as a child and was put into the foster system at a young age and had his name changed. Well, guess who else lost his parents at a young age and was put into the foster care system? And, if my memory is correct (and it often isn't), at no point during the childhood Flashbacks did we ever hear L'il Zoom called by his name (I think his father calls him "Sport" or something like that). So is it possible (rhetorical question; of course it is) that E2 Hunter Zolomon was actually born as Jay Garrick? Because if so, and the man in the mask is E3 Jay Garrick, that would make Zoom his evil doppelganger.

That's my theory, and I'm sticking to it (unless I change my mind).

That's a good point, we don't know what his original name was and what the names "Hunter Zolomon" and "Jay Garrick" mean on Earth 2. This could tie into the Man in the Iron Mask, but due to the disappointing revelations in this episode, I'm not getting my hopes up.

[Frontier]

Wasn't feeling this one either. What really got me was the trap for Zoom, which was cool and worked perfectly, but then they put a boot on him that he could easily get out of? I don't know what's worse, that being the extent of Barry's plan to contain him or the fact that Zoom didn't break out of it much sooner. After that, the episode lost me, and I couldn't wrap my head around the time remnant stuff.

I think he assumed the boot would work because:

A. It worked on him when Patty used it.

B. It was presumably designed for use against Speedsters.

So on that front I could understand why Barry would be confident in it, though he should've had a plan in-case Zoom had a way of getting out of it given how powerful and skilled he is. Just because Barry couldn't do it, doesn't mean Zoom can't.

Some people may not like it, but I love how vocal Mark Waid is when criticizing things (like Man of Steel). I had a similar reaction. I mean, this is Jay Garrick, one of the very first superheroes EVER and this is the first time he's played a significant role in other media (closest to this was an episode or two of Batman the Brave and the Bold), and to make him some deranged killer from an alternate universe who only acts the part of a hero to snatch away people's hope is a huge disservice to the character. Bit of a relief to know they have further plans with a real version of Jay.

I can understand it, but I was at least hopeful or willing to believe that the creators had that kind of plan before Berlanti outright came out and said it because I couldn't believe they would just do that to Jay or use him like that without a plan (especially with the man in the iron mask in play), nor would DC let them do that.

[kalorama]

The simplest answer for the Man in the Iron Mask is twins. It worked for Alexander Dumas.

As interesting as another Earth would be, I think it's too late in the season to introduce that wrinkle. Save it for season 3.

There's really nothing to introduce. They've already established that the multiverse exists and that there are multiple alternate versions of Earth, beyond E1 and E2. They don't need to go into deep detail about what another alternate Earth is like in order to use it as a plot device.

[The Darknight Detective]

Some people may not like it, but I love how vocal Mark Waid is when criticizing things (like Man of Steel). I had a similar reaction. I mean, this is Jay Garrick, one of the very first superheroes EVER and this is the first time he's played a significant role in other media (closest to this was an episode or two of Batman the Brave and the Bold), and to make him some deranged killer from an alternate universe who only acts the part of a hero to snatch away people's hope is a huge disservice to the character. Bit of a relief to know they have further plans with a real version of Jay.

Which is why Waid shouldn't have posted anything until he got all of the facts straight, IMO, since it seemed pretty apparent to me that Jay wasn't the Jay.

[Ace Venom]

Which is why Waid shouldn't have posted anything until he got all of the facts straight, IMO, since it seemed pretty apparent to me that Jay wasn't the Jay.

You're also talking about the same person (Waid) who publicly threw a tantrum in a movie theater when he watched Man of Steel. That there's another Jay Garrick shouldn't have been spoiled and I have a feeling it'll all work out just fine once it's all explained.

[kalorama]

You're also talking about the same person (Waid) who publicly threw a tantrum in a movie theater when he watched Man of Steel. That there's another Jay Garrick shouldn't have been spoiled and I have a feeling it'll all work out just fine once it's all explained.

But the "spoiler" (such as it was because, really . . . ) wasn't on Waid. Berlanti was under no obligation to respond to Waid's tantrum, and certainly not in a way that tipped his hand for what was upcoming on the show. He could (and should) have just ignored him.

[AdamFTF]

I keep getting the feeling that Earth-2 on this show isn't exactly Earth-2. It's a world where everyone of consequence is either powerless or evil. It really feels a lot more like Earth-3.

[Sighphi]

But the "spoiler" (such as it was because, really . . . ) wasn't on Waid. Berlanti was under no obligation to respond to Waid's tantrum, and certainly not in a way that tipped his hand for what was upcoming on the show. He could (and should) have just ignored him.

Stuff moves fast on the net. So before that became a thing and every website was posting on it, he made the choice to release some info.

Besides, pretty sure half of the people watching the show still had theories moving around that Zoom is not Jay.