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Thread: The FLASH

  1. #7501
    DC Comics Forum Mod The Darknight Detective's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elmo View Post
    Evil counterparts from the future have been done before in comics and movies and shows all the time. The problem is, this particular story isn't effective. We have seen so much of Barry blaming himself for different things. First it was for not realizing Wells was Eobard. Then it was for Ronnie's death. Then it was for not realizing "Jay" was Zoom/Hunter. Then he literally altered reality and caused aliens to attack earth, and changed the course of several people's lives. And as if that wasn't enough they had to make him a murderous speedster.

    There are MAJOR inconsistencies. Firstly, the idea that Barry becomes Savitar and kills Iris because he witnesses himself as Savitar killing Iris makes no sense. Even thinking about it hurts my brain. Something had to have come first that didn't involve Barry as Savitar. If Barry cannot become Savitar without seeing himself as Savitar, the show has created an impossible time loop here without any way to explain why Barry became Savitar in the first place. Because originally, there was no Savitar.
    Totally agree. Unless Barry is being controlled by someone/something else or his mind has been damaged in some way, I will never believe our Barry would ever in a million years wind up becoming Savitar.
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  2. #7502

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    So my guess is Emo Barry was pre-Savitar Barry, maybe 5-10 years shy of becoming Savitar. Just because the ep ended on a happy note doesn't mean it stayed that way or even somehow got worse when Current Barry left.

  3. #7503
    Ultimate Member numberthirty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nate Grey View Post
    So my guess is Emo Barry was pre-Savitar Barry, maybe 5-10 years shy of becoming Savitar. Just because the ep ended on a happy note doesn't mean it stayed that way or even somehow got worse when Current Barry left.
    While it's going to give me a headache even posting this, maybe "Emo" future Barry is inspired to take whatever steps lead to Savitar by the visit from "2017" Barry.

    Really no telling.

  4. #7504
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    It kind of feels like a jumping the shark moment where barry is already fighting himself only 3 seasons in. The reveal itself also makes no sense meaning how could any barry kill iris? Also did this evil barry get sent back in time somehow to the flashbacks we saw? I think I have more questions now that arent good and I doubt the show will answer them this late in the game.

  5. #7505

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    Quote Originally Posted by Carabas View Post
    Also, ice slide. Eat your heart out, X-Men movies.
    As I was watching that, I was thingking, "She's Iceman!"

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  6. #7506
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    Quote Originally Posted by Supernova View Post
    It kind of feels like a jumping the shark moment where barry is already fighting himself only 3 seasons in. The reveal itself also makes no sense meaning how could any barry kill iris?
    Three episodes left. We will see.

    Also did this evil barry get sent back in time somehow to the flashbacks we saw?
    No, he simply remembered them from back when he experienced them as good Barry.

  7. #7507
    Extraordinary Member Kirby101's Avatar
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    I get the feeling that when this is over, much of it still won't make sense. Best to try not to think about it after the finale and move on to next season.
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  8. #7508
    Fantastic Member jyamen's Avatar
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    Savitar could be one of Barry's time remnants gone insane.

  9. #7509
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    If Savitar is a bootstrap paradox, it brings up the question of entropy, which will build up through successive cycles of time.

    From Wikipedia:

    In statistical mechanics, entropy (usual symbol S) is related to the number of microscopic configurations Ω that a thermodynamic system can have when in a state as specified by some macroscopic variables. Specifically, assuming for simplicity that each of the microscopic configurations is equally probable, the entropy of the system is the natural logarithm of that number of configurations, multiplied by the Boltzmann constant kB. Formally,

    S = k B ln ⁡ Ω (assuming equiprobable states) .

    It's likely what's causing the build up of thermodynamic energy and might be why Savitar needs Killer Frost--as a kind of cooling system.

    From Wikipedia (I've bolded important elements in THE FLASH):

    Thermodynamic entropy is a non-conserved state function that is of great importance in the sciences of physics and chemistry. Historically, the concept of entropy evolved to explain why some processes (permitted by conservation laws) occur spontaneously while their time reversals (also permitted by conservation laws) do not; systems tend to progress in the direction of increasing entropy. For isolated systems, entropy never decreases. This fact has several important consequences in science: first, it prohibits "perpetual motion" machines; and second, it implies the arrow of entropy has the same direction as the arrow of time. Increases in entropy correspond to irreversible changes in a system, because some energy is expended as waste heat, limiting the amount of work a system can do.
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  10. #7510
    Astonishing Member David Walton's Avatar
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    You know, for a show that's billed as being inherently optimistic, THE FLASH seems really, really bleak.

  11. #7511
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    Glad Cecile and Joe are staying together, glad H.R. might get with the new scientist (Anne Dudek from House, always like seeing her get work). Even enjoying the Julian/ Caitlin romance drama and curious about what Jesse/ Wally got up to. It's like every relationship aside from Barry/ Iris is more intriguing. Not bad particularly, just sort've there.

    Called the likelihood of evil future Barry from Caitlins reaction to learning Savitars identity. Still really hope the reason why he is actually doing this isn't a let down. Is Barry getting force corruption from tapping into the dark side of the (speed) force. Or are they gonna use black lanterns or something else. Unless it's just an injury tied to Barry trying to change the timeline in this way?

  12. #7512
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    Quote Originally Posted by jyamen View Post
    Savitar could be one of Barry's time remnants gone insane.
    I really like that theory. The remnants seem to just disappear as the plot necessitates, that would be good.

  13. #7513
    Fantastic Member Ace Venom's Avatar
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    Barry as Savitar is something I believed was possible weeks ago. The implications of this are pretty enormous depending on how Barry came to be Savitar. Considering Jay Garrick knew of the existence of Savitar, this is incredibly convoluted. The only explanation that seems to make sense is Savitar is from the Prime Timeline.

  14. #7514
    Extraordinary Member Zero Hunter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Supernova View Post
    It kind of feels like a jumping the shark moment where barry is already fighting himself only 3 seasons in. The reveal itself also makes no sense meaning how could any barry kill iris? Also did this evil barry get sent back in time somehow to the flashbacks we saw? I think I have more questions now that arent good and I doubt the show will answer them this late in the game.
    I am thinking the same thing. If it is not a jumping the shark moment they are at least circling the hell out of that shark getting ready to jump. Hell they have been doing that for half this season. Between dumb plot twists and just bad ideas all around this show is getting hard to even watch sometimes. Making it be a future Barry is just so damn cheap. Suddenly Cisco is worried about his powers killing someone when he has not once showed that before? Barry CONSTANTLY just standing around looking like a moron while Killer Frost takes shots at him?

    The new tag line for this show should be "My name is Barry Allen and I'm the fastest man alive .......... except for when I am just standing around looking like dumbass which is probably 98% of the time".

    I am giving this show until the end of the season to make this whole stupid Savitar plot makes sense, but it better have a good pay off or I might just drop out. I did it with Arrow and I would have no problem doing it with Flash.

  15. #7515
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    Who else thinks Cisco is in love with Caitlin?

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