New 52 WonderWoman is an attempt to make Diana more appealing to a male audience? Agree or disagree?

[Blacksun]

To be fair he said 'most,' even then, is there even prove that these characters have a female majority fanbase?

of course not, hard to know it when dc/marvel surveys aren't of public knowledge.

If only Mr. Azzarello had been allowed to write a Wondy-Orion romance, it might have shown that Diana's real power. Orion was a prisoner of his heritage and its ugliness, as son of Darkseid, and she freed him to a higher level of self-appreciation.

It's one of the themes of the run: WW showing that people can be better by believing in theirselves

[brettc1]

To be fair he said 'most,' even then, is there even prove that these characters have a female majority fanbase?

Indeed. There is no reliable data to show the number of male to female readers but I think anecdotal evidence still supports the idea that guys make up the huge bulk of super hero comic readers. I would estimate 75%+, and that is probably conservative.

[Blacksun]

Indeed. There is no reliable data to show the number of male to female readers but I think anecdotal evidence still supports the idea that guys make up the huge bulk of super hero comic readers. I would estimate 75%+, and that is probably conservative.

comic conventions is 50/50. Comics must be one of the market harder to get info about the consumers.
Ms Marvel I'm sure the ratio is much better than 75% male, specially on the digital sales that was reported that it was doing about the same that print sales.

[ed2962]

So trying to give Wonder Woman a broader appeal is a bad thing? Many of us comic book fans forget that the character doesn't belong to us. If you want her to thrive for years to come she may have to have a wider appeal. If she becomes too much of a fringe character she could definitely have a bleak future as Warner Bros. will be more reluctant to push her. They already have little faith in her as is. I don't want to see Carol Danvers or Black Widow over take Wonder Woman in 20 years because they've had more mainstream appearances than her.
You're favorite version of the character is still out there. He'll, Wonder Woman '77 is on it's way. But in order to bring in new fans she may have to be more of a character that is enjoyed by both boys and girls. A lot of comic book readers discovered comics through main stream outlets like tv shows and movies. Or casual fans who are drawn in by event books. So having a broad marketable appeal is important. Once they discover the character they can delve into old stories and find out more about them and figure out why they are so iconic. Then they can choose for themselves what version they prefer.
As far as Azz's run goes I love it. Geoff Johns' version of Diana is terrible. A simpleton who prefers to hack and slash her way out of problems. He really tried to make her lady Thor. Azz's run has captured the essence of the character. She has embraced her enemies and turned one time adversaries into allies and she's done so with her compassion and bravery. Almost everyone standing behind her as she goes into battle with The First Born was at one time an enemy. Wonder Woman changing lives with love.

I think the question is coming from a similar place as the concern over David Finch's comments from a couple of months ago...that some of the things that made WW unique and are being downplayed in order to make her more "acceptable" to a certain segment of the audience. The perfect society of women is no longer perfect, Diana now has ties to men that she didn't have before (amazon bros, Zeus) ,etc ...these things in theory aren't terrible ideas, but I can see how someone might think they lessen the previous female empowerment/independence message slightly.

Sorta like the "mod" version of WW. Who no longer has powers or Amazon sisters and had to learn material arts from a dude named I Ching. On one hand Denny O Neal made her more contemporary, but some folks thought that he stripped her of everything that made her fun and unique.

One thing I can think of ( and this doesn't prove anything one way or another, but I think it adds to the over all discussion), was seeing a fan review the Blood collection on You Tube. He gave it a glowing review and mostly went on about how he enjoyed the interpetations of the gods. However, he also said that he was glad that he could finally read Wonder Woman without all the "psuedo-feminist bullshit" and that this somehow made her character "more" feminist.

[Pinsir]

comic conventions is 50/50. Comics must be one of the market harder to get info about the consumers.
Ms Marvel I'm sure the ratio is much better than 75% male, specially on the digital sales that was reported that it was doing about the same that print sales.

Comic movies as well are probably 50/50 too. It just seems to be that comics themselves are male dominated.

[brettc1]

comic conventions is 50/50. Comics must be one of the market harder to get info about the consumers.
Ms Marvel I'm sure the ratio is much better than 75% male, specially on the digital sales that was reported that it was doing about the same that print sales.

My wife goes to comic book conventions with me. She doesn't read comics, though.

Highest sales in July were for Rocket Racoon, around 290K. Lets say some folks got double issues but the book still sold to 250K readers.

Ms Marvel's sales in the same month were 36K.

Assuming half the people buying Ms Marvel were female, and the female comic buyers make up 25% of the total market [which I am doubtful of, but anyway], that means about 25% of all the women who buy comic books bought Ms Marvel that month. The same month it would mean less than 8% of the male comic buyers were paying for the title.

But then the books sales slump to 32K next month. Ouch.

If like numbers of men and women dropped the title, it means Ms Marvel's sales to women dropped from 25% of all buyers to 20%. In other words, 1 in every 5 women who bought the book in July didnt bother in August.

What happened?

All of this is purely hypothetical. Personally I think, with some slight variation, Ms Marvel follows the same trends as all super-books, with mostly male readership.

[brettc1]

Comic movies as well are probably 50/50 too. It just seems to be that comics themselves are male dominated.

It's true,there were a fearsome amount of teenage girls in the screenings of Captain America Winter Soldier!

I don't know about 50/50 though. A lot of ticket sales rely on repeat viewings and I think most of the women only go once. Just my take.

[Blacksun]

It's true,there were a fearsome amount of teenage girls in the screenings of Captain America Winter Soldier!

I don't know about 50/50 though. A lot of ticket sales rely on repeat viewings and I think most of the women only go once. Just my take.

Just once? I know some fangirls that go much more than once for movies they really like, not my case. it has chris evans, seb stan really can't ask for eye candy...wait there is anthony mackie too.

Ms Marvel #1 is on 7th printing, I think only JL new 52 #1 had a 7th printing. and there was 2nd prinitng from other issues too. I think many women are discovering comics with Ms marvel, many comic shops saying that there is new women readers searching for ms marvel. Really hard to have a better look when there isn't info about it, but marvel is really trying to reach this public, DC too.

[brettc1]

But she is immortal, it's being said in Azzarello's run.

Gods are immortal, and she is currently a god.

If she stops being the god of war...

[brettc1]

Just once? I know some fangirls that go much more than once for movies they really like, not my case. it has chris evans, seb stan really can't ask for eye candy...wait there is anthony mackie too.

Ms Marvel #1 is on 7th printing, I think only JL new 52 #1 had a 7th printing. and there was 2nd prinitng from other issues too. I think many women are discovering comics with Ms marvel, many comic shops saying that there is new women readers searching for ms marvel. Really hard to have a better look when there isn't info about it, but marvel is really trying to reach this public, DC too.

The question then becomes of the women going to see the movies, what percentage are fan girls, eye-candy fans, and girls just out with their male partners.

[brettc1]

Can I also just add that after the audible sigh in Thor when Hemsworth came out of the shower with no shirt on, my wife in not allowed to accompany me to Marvel movies.

I make no apologies.

[mego joe]

I'm neither a woman nor a gay man, but I've always had an affection for Wonder Woman, sort of like I have an affection for good wine or beer. I think the thing that Azzarello did was tell an interesting story with a new interpretation of the Greek Pantheon and put WW as a supporting character in it. She is not the main focus. She is part of an ensemble. By minimizing her and building the world around her he made her relevant. At least that's my take on it. I learned more about the Nu 52 WW from the early JL issues, but the WW comic has told an interesting story, but not focused on WW.

[mego joe]

Just once? I know some fangirls that go much more than once for movies they really like, not my case. it has chris evans, seb stan really can't ask for eye candy...wait there is anthony mackie too.

Ms Marvel #1 is on 7th printing, I think only JL new 52 #1 had a 7th printing. and there was 2nd prinitng from other issues too. I think many women are discovering comics with Ms marvel, many comic shops saying that there is new women readers searching for ms marvel. Really hard to have a better look when there isn't info about it, but marvel is really trying to reach this public, DC too.

My teenage daughter and some of her friends call Evans Capt. McHotpants. And they don't even read the comics....and yes she saw Winter Soldier in the theater 3 times. And both my daughters, teen and preteen love both Cappy A flicks. I guess I've done something right....

Yeah, they watched CA: TFA on DVD weekly for a while...and the Avengers...can't believe we went to Winter Soldier in the theater together...and we are anxiously awaiting the next Avengers film. And yes, it's mostly due to Evans' Cap.

[Silvanus]

Gods are immortal, and she is currently a god.

If she stops being the god of war...

Lennox and Cassandra seem not to have aged very much. (Sirracca didn't either, but that could be because she was "dead.") So it seems like in the DCU demi-gods are at least long-lived.

[BlackFeath]

Lennox and Cassandra seem not to have aged very much. (Sirracca didn't either, but that could be because she was "dead.") So it seems like in the DCU demi-gods are at least long-lived.

Yeah, and also Hercules (we saw him only in Aquaman, but we saw him) is still alive after thousand of years, and he is not old.