Game of Thrones

[Gorthon616]

Spoilers for Episode 3.


Episode 3 imo is pretty mediocre. If you've been happy from the last season up til now, I think you'll enjoy it or at least be fine with it. But honestly for me, it's just disappointing. The episode felt like it was just tying up dangling plot threads, rather than the culmination of a multi-year, multi-season story arc. Like the thought process is "oh, the white walkers are still around? hmm... we need to figure out a way to wrap that up so we can move on with the story." Which, I guess is the battle for Westeros against Cersi?

I dunno. I always viewed the white walkers as being the primary story that was being built up across books with the battle for the throne simplying being the latest civil war in a series of civil wars.

Again, I think it's serviceable, but given how long they've taken both in the narrative and in real life, the only sadness i feel is that this is the result of a series that had been so promising at the start. The undead arrive at Winterfell and it's... basically every zombie horde scene that you've ever seen before. There's nothing really interesting about how the battle plays out, it just kind of relishes in the gratuity of what it is.

I'm also not really a big fan of how characters that the fans know and like are clearly written in that light. For example, Ned Stark was executed like a common criminal. But Jorah Mormont is given a hero's death? Sure, some people die, but frankly the cast is still too bloated. I mean, I like Ed, but it's not like there was anything really for him to do if he was alive. I mean, Vary's is still around doing absolutely nothing. There's just too many non-relevant fan favorite characters bloating the scenes, where I feel like killing them is just giving the character something to do, rather than being some substantive story decision. Also fan-favorite character strikes stoic hero fight moments against insurmountable odds just feel wrong. Again, Ned Stark got stabbed by some random solider in the leg and had a limp until he died like a common criminal. THAT'S GAME OF THRONES. This is your GM narrating your D&D campaign.

Which is fine, certainly that's something that people enjoy. It needed to resolve some story arc, move characters that have no purpose anymore out of the story, and continue the story of character that do have a purpose in the story. I guess I just thought it would do more than that.

[Hellion]

Well that just happened. (Spoilers ahead, I guess I should warn)

The Good:

The Dothraki charge into darkness was a brilliant visual that played with the audience's emotions. I got chills. Well-executed. The shots of the zombie army mobbing the defenders were great. It's just as terrifying as the action in Hardhome back in Season 5. We got some great dragon-on-dragon combat scenes that still looked cool despite the poor lighting. The surprise with Arya at the end was a nice twist and I'm okay with her being the one to pull it off.

The Bad:

After 8 seasons of buildup, the Night King is nothing more than a miniboss for Cersei and Euron??? The only thing more anticlimactic than this is when Steve Irwin was killed by a stingray.

All the main characters and all the useless characters survived, which was an incredible letdown. How the hell Grey Worm, Missandei, Varys, Samwell, Gilly, Podrick and Ghost managed to survive while Jorah and Theon did not infuriates me. I was pulling for Theon to live, but apparently the writers weren't clever enough to write a redemption arc that was completed by a long life of redeeming behavior instead of a last stand culminating in death. Maybe they can accomplish that with Jaime? (I rather doubt it). With Jorah goes Dany's conscience, so my hopes of Mad Queen Dany grow stronger.

The preview for next week shows Dany trying to inspire people to help her win the "final war." Lol, with what army you stupid cow? Unless you and the rest of the North were holding back tonight, the Dothraki, Unsullied, Knights of the Vale, Wildlings and Northmen were pretty much wiped out. Unless Yara Greyjoy has built up her own indomitable, teleporting fleet or the Riverlands gave birth to thousands of able-bodied men following the War of the Five Kings, the survivors of the Long Night are screwed.

I'll admit to being wrong about the Winterfell crypts. But the inconsistency of a wooden box being able to contain one wight while other wights are apparently able to punch through stone tombs is ridiculous. Too often in its later seasons, this show has been dictated by what D&D think would be cool. I'm reminded of the Dr. Ian Malcolm meme: "you were so concerned about whether or not you could that you never considered whether or not you should."

WHERE WERE THE TACTICS??? Despite making for a cool scene, the Dothraki cavalry would've been better served flanking the zombie masses. The Unsullied should have been the front line. The trenches should have been lit to begin with. There should have been more trenches and more fire, dividing the field up in sections for the purpose of dividing the undead army into more manageable sections. Maybe have had some of the trebuchets/catapults on the castle walls. When the wights display more intelligence than the living, I question the outcome of this episode.

Final Thoughts:

I really don't know how to feel about the rest of this finale moving forward. The final confrontation with the Night King and the army of the dead was so ineffectual and left no lasting impact on the plot (minus Dany's lack of an army, unless this is magically reversed next week). I feel like leaving Cersei as the final Big Bad was a poor decision, because the stakes are inevitably lower and her threat seems less substantial. But I guess writing the ending this way does encapsulate the human experience: our history has been and always will be a cycle of violence and greed perpetuated by our constant focusing on self-interests. If the Night King couldn't break that wheel, idealistic/entitled Dany sure as hell won't.

If they don't show Sansa reacting to Theon's death in the next episode, I'll probably have an aneurysm.

Does anyone know if Lord Royce survived? I don't think I saw him at all in this episode. Just wondering, since he's sort of key to Sansa's authority over the Vale.

[Divine Spark]

Hail to the queen in the North!

[Master Planner]

Seriously, it was by far the worst episode of the series. Total anti-climactic. What's the point of "those petty civil wars and power struggles are for nothing" if the big war to determine life and death of humanity, the war that was builded up for seven freakin seasons, ended in one episode. I have no words to describe how bad is the taste in my mouth after this episode.

[Madam-Shogun-Assassin]

More than that, he's something so awful they had to rally the wagons. Everyone allied against a threat so magnificent it couldn't be ignored. Even Jaime Lannister signed up for the Army of the Living, defying his beloved sister.

Now that's gone. Over. Fallout leaves all their divided ambitions and petty feuds to reemerge. I don't imagine it will be as simple as Lannister and Stark turning on each other again, but these new bonds will be tested. And, I suspect, cause serious problems for some. (Sansa and Tyrion seemed to be on the verge of something tonight, we'll see.)

The real drama isn't in the alliance. It's in what happens when the alliance is no longer needed. They won the war. But winning the peace may be the bigger trick.

For some people that's the problem. Like, we're back to this again. Just seems regressive and status quo like to me.

[Madam-Shogun-Assassin]

Well that just happened. (Spoilers ahead, I guess I should warn)

The Good:

The Dothraki charge into darkness was a brilliant visual that played with the audience's emotions. I got chills. Well-executed. The shots of the zombie army mobbing the defenders were great. It's just as terrifying as the action in Hardhome back in Season 5. We got some great dragon-on-dragon combat scenes that still looked cool despite the poor lighting. The surprise with Arya at the end was a nice twist and I'm okay with her being the one to pull it off.

The Bad:

After 8 seasons of buildup, the Night King is nothing more than a miniboss for Cersei and Euron??? The only thing more anticlimactic than this is when Steve Irwin was killed by a stingray.

All the main characters and all the useless characters survived, which was an incredible letdown. How the hell Grey Worm, Missandei, Varys, Samwell, Gilly, Podrick and Ghost managed to survive while Jorah and Theon did not infuriates me. I was pulling for Theon to live, but apparently the writers weren't clever enough to write a redemption arc that was completed by a long life of redeeming behavior instead of a last stand culminating in death. Maybe they can accomplish that with Jaime? (I rather doubt it). With Jorah goes Dany's conscience, so my hopes of Mad Queen Dany grow stronger.

The preview for next week shows Dany trying to inspire people to help her win the "final war." Lol, with what army you stupid cow? Unless you and the rest of the North were holding back tonight, the Dothraki, Unsullied, Knights of the Vale, Wildlings and Northmen were pretty much wiped out. Unless Yara Greyjoy has built up her own indomitable, teleporting fleet or the Riverlands gave birth to thousands of able-bodied men following the War of the Five Kings, the survivors of the Long Night are screwed.

I'll admit to being wrong about the Winterfell crypts. But the inconsistency of a wooden box being able to contain one wight while other wights are apparently able to punch through stone tombs is ridiculous. Too often in its later seasons, this show has been dictated by what D&D think would be cool. I'm reminded of the Dr. Ian Malcolm meme: "you were so concerned about whether or not you could that you never considered whether or not you should."

WHERE WERE THE TACTICS??? Despite making for a cool scene, the Dothraki cavalry would've been better served flanking the zombie masses. The Unsullied should have been the front line. The trenches should have been lit to begin with. There should have been more trenches and more fire, dividing the field up in sections for the purpose of dividing the undead army into more manageable sections. Maybe have had some of the trebuchets/catapults on the castle walls. When the wights display more intelligence than the living, I question the outcome of this episode.

Final Thoughts:

I really don't know how to feel about the rest of this finale moving forward. The final confrontation with the Night King and the army of the dead was so ineffectual and left no lasting impact on the plot (minus Dany's lack of an army, unless this is magically reversed next week). I feel like leaving Cersei as the final Big Bad was a poor decision, because the stakes are inevitably lower and her threat seems less substantial. But I guess writing the ending this way does encapsulate the human experience: our history has been and always will be a cycle of violence and greed perpetuated by our constant focusing on self-interests. If the Night King couldn't break that wheel, idealistic/entitled Dany sure as hell won't.

If they don't show Sansa reacting to Theon's death in the next episode, I'll probably have an aneurysm.

Does anyone know if Lord Royce survived? I don't think I saw him at all in this episode. Just wondering, since he's sort of key to Sansa's authority over the Vale.

THANK YOU!!! I agree with everything you said here.

[Forseti]

I'm glad they did this in a single episode. I wasn't hopeful for a quick resolution after the first two. Half the season left for the more interesting stuff, sounds fine to me.

[Divine Spark]

[Emperor-of-Dragons]

Half the season left for the more interesting stuff.

Pfftt...like what? lol

[Emperor-of-Dragons]

Seriously, it was by far the worst episode of the series. Total anti-climactic. What's the point of "those petty civil wars and power struggles are for nothing" if the big war to determine life and death of humanity, the war that was builded up for seven freakin seasons, ended in one episode. I have no words to describe how bad is the taste in my mouth after this episode.

I wouldn't go that far, as action set peices goes its pretty good despite poor visibility. Narratively it was anticlimactic

[Forseti]

Pfftt...like what? lol

Antagonists that talk.

The Night King was an awful villain. Nothing behind it at all. He was created to kill humans. That's his entire back story and motivation. It boggles the mind how people assumed he was the main bad guy. He was just a plot element to make Cersei appear to have the upper hand in the actual story. That much was obvious as soon as Cersei indicated she had no intention to join the "fight for the living".

[Master Planner]

I wouldn't go that far, as action set peices goes its pretty good despite poor visibility. Narratively it was anticlimactic

Production wise,it was great. But that's the power of the show now. Narrative and plot wise, the episode was the worst, because it drops the whole core of Martin's plot into garbage. The whole point of the saga was that humanity's petty grudges are that. Petty. Humanity is too myopic to see the danger that, if unchecked,it could wipe them out. Having the whole White Walker plot end in one episode,after such build up, it's the textbook of anti-climactic.

[Emperor-of-Dragons]

Production wise,it was great. But that's the power of the show now. Narrative and plot wise, the episode was the worst, because it drops the whole core of Martin's plot into garbage. The whole point of the saga was that humanity's petty grudges are that. Petty. Humanity is too myopic to see the danger that, if unchecked,it could wipe them out. Having the whole White Walker plot end in one episode,after such build up, it's the textbook of anti-climactic.

Oh, I totally agree with that. Cause Wasn't the whole point of the show that all those political games are pointless and the larger threat renders them silly?

[Emperor-of-Dragons]

Antagonists that talk.

The Night King was an awful villain. Nothing behind it at all. He was created to kill humans. That's his entire back story and motivation. It boggles the mind how people assumed he was the main bad guy. He was just a plot element to make Cersei appear to have the upper hand in the actual story. That much was obvious as soon as Cersei indicated she had no intention to join the "fight for the living".

Like said elsewhere Cersei isn't that good of a villain either. She doesn't merit being a main antagonist. She imo should have died during season 7 at the latest.

[Forseti]

Oh, I totally agree with that. Cause Wasn't the whole point of the show that all those political games are pointless and the larger threat renders them silly?

No, the whole point seems to be that even in the face of obviously pending global doom, some people will still be assholes and continue screwing over everyone else for their personal gain. Some people might see a metaphor there for the current political climate in our real world.