Game of Thrones

[Sparta]

In the battle of Winterfell, I'd say Beric, Podrick, Yohn Royce, Edd Tollett, Alyse Karstark, Lyanna Mormont, Maester Wolkan will die. Maybe Varys? He'll eventually get killed but maybe not this early. Theon's an interesting one, dying to protect Bran sounds fitting but I also see him fighting Euron post "Fall of Winterfell"

[MiddleMan]

How do you know that she is willing to kill him?

I haven't seen any signs of that.

Perceptions are relative though.

Meet a powerful woman and you'll know that look

She sees Jon as a threat.....full stop

[stargazer01]

Remember when Dany risked her life and her dragons to go save Jon in season 7?

She did it because she cared about him. And she learned he was a honorable man. Why would she want to kill him now? Besides, Jon doesn't want to be King and he believes in her. To me it's a match made in heaven, especially if she gets pregnant and the baby survives.

[MiddleMan]

They're related, like the family tree has no branches related

Its gross

One of em probably gonna die

[bobellis75]

Remember when Dany risked her life and her dragons to go save Jon in season 7?

She did it because she cared about him. And she learned he was a honorable man. Why would she want to kill him now? Besides, Jon doesn't want to be King and he believes in her. To me it's a match made in heaven, especially if she gets pregnant and the baby survives.

He may decide he should be king if she's going to rule with an iron fist. (or decide that she shouldn't be queen)

It's not like scenarios can't shift. All is fair in love and war.

[ZeroBG82]

Remember when Dany risked her life and her dragons to go save Jon in season 7?

She did it because she cared about him. And she learned he was a honorable man. Why would she want to kill him now? Besides, Jon doesn't want to be King and he believes in her. To me it's a match made in heaven, especially if she gets pregnant and the baby survives.

She saved him because she cared for him and he was a powerful and important ally. Now he's a threat. If his heritage becomes public it won't matter if he wants the throne or not. As a male heir he has a superior claim.

Cersie, recall, is the first independently ruling queen Westeros has ever had. Dany can't be queen while Aegon Targaryen exists. The lords of Westeros would never accept her while there is a male alternative. Not without rivers of blood and dragon's fire, anyhow.

Jon isn't known for his ability to keep secrets. He hates lying. He could have lied to Cersei about pledging to Dany and couldn't. Jon CAN'T keep this to himself. Even if he wants to. Honor and duty above all.

Which leaves Dany in a pickle. She believes she should be queen. Is meant to be. Jon stands in her way. She's killed men who have stood in her path to the throne before (see seasons 3-7 in particular). She's kiled men for less, if it challenges her perceived right to the throne (see the Tarly men last season).

Jon has never been in a more dangerous situation than he is right now, between Dany and the Iron Throne. And I say that remembering full well that he was once murdered.

[stargazer01]

He may decide he should be king if she's going to rule with an iron fist. (or decide that she shouldn't be queen)

It's not like scenarios can't shift. All is fair in love and war.

I have a really hard time seeing Jon turning against her. And I don't think she's a villain. I think they'll work it out somehow because both want what's best for the rest. If Dany just wanted the throne, she'd have it already.

[stargazer01]

She saved him because she cared for him and he was a powerful and important ally. Now he's a threat. If his heritage becomes public it won't matter if he wants the throne or not. As a male heir he has a superior claim.

Cersie, recall, is the first independently ruling queen Westeros has ever had. Dany can't be queen while Aegon Targaryen exists. The lords of Westeros would never accept her while there is a male alternative. Not without rivers of blood and dragon's fire, anyhow.

Jon isn't known for his ability to keep secrets. He hates lying. He could have lied to Cersei about pledging to Dany and couldn't. Jon CAN'T keep this to himself. Even if he wants to. Honor and duty above all.

Which leaves Dany in a pickle. She believes she should be queen. Is meant to be. Jon stands in her way. She's killed men who have stood in her path to the throne before (see seasons 3-7 in particular). She's kiled men for less, if it challenges her perceived right to the throne (see the Tarly men last season).

Jon has never been in a more dangerous situation than he is right now, between Dany and the Iron Throne. And I say that remembering full well that he was once murdered.

The way I understand it, Jon has more claim to the throne NOT because he's male but because he's the child of the first born of the Mad King. I think it still works that way, it's why Prince Harry is farther in the line than William's children.

Also, Dany just had her first reaction to the big news. She needs to process it all. If she ever loved and respected Jon like she said, then will not turn against him. This discovery is so new to her.

[ZeroBG82]

The way I understand it, Jon has more claim to the throne NOT because he's male but because he's the child of the first born of the Mad King. I think it still works that way, it's why Prince Harry is farther in the line than William's children.

Also, Dany just had her first reaction to the big news. She needs to process it all. If she ever loved and respected Jon like she said, then will not turn against him. This discovery is so new to her.

We've been explicitly told, and shown, that male heirs supercede female claimants. Myrcella was older than Tommen, yet when Jofrey died the throne devolved to his younger brother, not his sister.

Jon's existence voids Dany's claim, under Westerosi law. The exact mechanics aren't even that important.

And it's true, she hasn't had any time to process it. The show is clearly building to her choice. What move will she make? But her first, instinctual reaction is alarming as all hell. That isn't the response of caring lover, it's the response of a threatened despot.

And it absolutely fits how she has been presented thus far. She's a divine right monarch. The question before the program now is, can she be more? Or will she fall into the trap of her own pride?

[MiddleMan]

The way I understand it, Jon has more claim to the throne NOT because he's male but because he's the child of the first born of the Mad King. I think it still works that way, it's why Prince Harry is farther in the line than William's children.

Also, Dany just had her first reaction to the big news. She needs to process it all. If she ever loved and respected Jon like she said, then will not turn against him. This discovery is so new to her.

its both, he's the first born AND male

even if he wasn't firstborn, the line of succession still recognizes male heirs as primary claim holders

she already processed it, which is why the first words out of her mouth weren't "oh I have another family member" or "oh Ive been shagging my nephew"

it was "oh, you have a stronger claim to the Iron throne"

shes processed it as much as shes going to

[AndrewCrossett]

Even if Dany doesn't turn against Jon, it's still a crushing revelation for her. Her entire life, since her brother died, has been based around believing that she was the rightful ruler of the Seven Kingdoms.

I think a time will come on the show where she has a chance to turn against Jon or not (e.g., rescue him or let him die) and that choice could go either way. Personally I think she will not give in to the temptation to be rid of him. I think it will be moot anyway because she won't survive.

In any case, Jon will have quite a time convincing the lords he is who he says he is. They MIGHT accept Sam's documentation that Rhaegar and Lyanna had a legitimate child together, but they only have Bran's say-so for proving that child was Jon. (Lord Howland Reed might have something to say about it, though.)

[Jackalope89]

Yeah, even without the White Walkers and their horde of undead, Dany has become a wildcard to him. Its not because he has any interest in the Iron Throne itself, but he told her because he believed she should know. I mean, the guy already gave up one throne for her. But her first reaction was that he had a superior claim to hers.

Whoever survives the upcoming battle, its going to be telling on where things stand between them. Though, if Dany's advisors consider and put forward Davos' proposal of marriage, Jon could also put forward that they rule together as equals. He's honest and known for it that Dany would believe him, insuring she still gets to rule. While at the same time, the North gets someone who grew up there to also be in charge, and maybe not full independence, but maybe something like semi-independent?

[KNIGHT OF THE LAKE]

The way I understand it, Jon has more claim to the throne NOT because he's male but because he's the child of the first born of the Mad King. I think it still works that way, it's why Prince Harry is farther in the line than William's children.

Also, Dany just had her first reaction to the big news. She needs to process it all. If she ever loved and respected Jon like she said, then will not turn against him. This discovery is so new to her.

Rheagar was the crown prince. Jon is Rheagar's legitimate son

[Flash Gordon]

She won't turn on Jon, when it comes down to it.

[Johnny Peril]

The way I see it the Targaryens took the Seven Kingdoms by conquest and lost them by conquest so their claims should be below Gengry's.