Game of Thrones

[Flash Gordon]

It's just weird to me that they chose to play the conflict surrounding Jon's parentage the way they are doing. The obvious, if cliched, angle of all the plotters and schemers trying to push him and Dany together for the sake of uniting the realm, and the two of them pushing back against it because they hate each other. If they actually love each other like the show is intent on telling us, then it shouldn't really matter who has the stronger claim. If history is any precedent joint rule is often quite a stable solution to dynastic woes, such as with Ferdinand and Isabella or William and Mary.

I really can not understand the logic for them NOT being together.

They're stronger together.

[Madam-Shogun-Assassin]

This video echoes my issues, though some are petty. But otherwise nail on head.

[MindofShadow]

It's just weird to me that they chose to play the conflict surrounding Jon's parentage the way they are doing. The obvious, if cliched, angle of all the plotters and schemers trying to push him and Dany together for the sake of uniting the realm, and the two of them pushing back against it because they hate each other. If they actually love each other like the show is intent on telling us, then it shouldn't really matter who has the stronger claim. If history is any precedent joint rule is often quite a stable solution to dynastic woes, such as with Ferdinand and Isabella or William and Mary.

Line of succession complicates this a bit.

They can't produce an heir.

For "stability" reasons, (for the realm as Vary's says constantly but doesn't really mean), Jon on the throne married to another strong house makes the most sense since you can produce a Targ heir.

A barren queen means you are right back to civil war the second she dies.

Didn't Tyrion bring up the lack of heir issue one episode? I can't remember what came of it.

But I am fully expecting neither on the throne at this point. sUbVeRt ExPeCtAtIoNs. Both are dying or one of them is dying and the other one is exiling themselves (Dany back to essos or Jon to the wildings/wall/far north)

There is literally no way this ends satisfactory. There isn't enough time to wrap up all of what happened the last X number of years.

Oh wlel, the bloodbath next episode should be fun regardless, as long as its daytime lol. We can all cheer when Euron finally dies right?

[Madam-Shogun-Assassin]

Line of succession complicates this a bit.

They can't produce an heir.

Like I said earlier, People theorized that Dani wasn't barren, because of a throwaway line Jon says. But like I said that was a red herrington keep people hooked on the Jon/Dani "romance". But I guess they would need that red herring cause people would have stopped being invested in Dani a long time ago for this very reason. This whole season been red herrings, even the earlier superb seasons (retroactively). But they were better plotted.

[XPac]

It's just weird to me that they chose to play the conflict surrounding Jon's parentage the way they are doing. The obvious, if cliched, angle of all the plotters and schemers trying to push him and Dany together for the sake of uniting the realm, and the two of them pushing back against it because they hate each other. If they actually love each other like the show is intent on telling us, then it shouldn't really matter who has the stronger claim. If history is any precedent joint rule is often quite a stable solution to dynastic woes, such as with Ferdinand and Isabella or William and Mary.

It a complete void, it absolutely would't matter because Jon doesn't want the throne and Dany likely would get what she wants anyways since she clearly wears the pants in the relationship like Vary implied.

The problem is a LOT of people would prefer Jon on the throne over Dany. Certainly the people up in the north, and even Danys closest advisors at this point. Tyrion still is supporting Dany verbally, but deep down I think it's clear that he actually agrees with Varys that Jon is the better choice for the Iron Throne. And everyone who knows Jon and Dany likely knows that gener and marriage be damned, Dany would be running the show if they did a joint marriage. Dany will not be willing to play second fiddle to Jon even if that's Jons preference.

People will conspire to put Jon on the throne whether he wants it or not. And that's a civil war in the making. Odds are people in Westeros who are already distrustful of the Targereans will be even moreso if/when she nukes Kings Landing. And a large portion of Danys support base was decimated battling the Night King. A good deal more will likely be lost dealing with Cersi. She won't be in a strong position even if she wins.

If Dany were OKAY with Jon ruling instead of her, things might be okay. Or if her forces were at 100%, it wouldn't matter what anyone else thought since she would be powerful enough to control Westeros even without support from the North. But as it stands, it's a problem. Literally everyone that knows the truth wants Jon on the throne, and as the secret gets out because of Sansa's big mouth, it'll only become more of a problem.

[KNIGHT OF THE LAKE]

episode 4 leaked early.

The report was before the leak and honestly IMDb ratings are a terrible metric. The whole reason Shawshank is number one is because Godfather and TDK fans mass spammed 1 star ratings to make a point. It has nothing to do with quality

[KNIGHT OF THE LAKE]

I really can not understand the logic for them NOT being together.

They're stronger together.

Does Dany want to rule with someone who

1. Has a better claim and could very likely be treated as the true ruler while she takes the Rhaeny’s/Visenya role to Jon’s Aegon

2. Has better ties to massive chunks of the realm like the North.

Also there is the question of whether Jon would want to marry Dany now that he knows they are related. It’s different in the North.

[Madam-Shogun-Assassin]

It a complete void, it absolutely would't matter because Jon doesn't want the throne and Dany likely would get what she wants anyways since she clearly wears the pants in the relationship like Vary implied.

The problem is a LOT of people would prefer Jon on the throne over Dany. Certainly the people up in the north, and even Danys closest advisors at this point. Tyrion still is supporting Dany verbally, but deep down I think it's clear that he actually agrees with Varys that Jon is the better choice for the Iron Throne. And everyone who knows Jon and Dany likely knows that gener and marriage be damned, Dany would be running the show if they did a joint marriage. Dany will not be willing to play second fiddle to Jon even if that's Jons preference.

People will conspire to put Jon on the throne whether he wants it or not. And that's a civil war in the making. Odds are people in Westeros who are already distrustful of the Targereans will be even moreso if/when she nukes Kings Landing. And a large portion of Danys support base was decimated battling the Night King. A good deal more will likely be lost dealing with Cersi. She won't be in a strong position even if she wins.

If Dany were OKAY with Jon ruling instead of her, things might be okay. Or if her forces were at 100%, it wouldn't matter what anyone else thought since she would be powerful enough to control Westeros even without support from the North. But as it stands, it's a problem. Literally everyone that knows the truth wants Jon on the throne, and as the secret gets out because of Sansa's big mouth, it'll only become more of a problem.

Like someone else said elsewhere, Varys is just D&D's mouth peice at this point tbh lol. He's going to be laying it on thick next episode.

[SpiderClops]

The report was before the leak and honestly IMDb ratings are a terrible metric. The whole reason Shawshank is number one is because Godfather and TDK fans mass spammed 1 star ratings to make a point. It has nothing to do with quality

I agree Imdb sucks. But that's not it. It also rated lower than Unbowed, Unbent, Unbroken on Rotten Tomatoes. It is also the only other episode that is not fresh on RT.

[Theleviathan]

HAR! Book Euron is cool but silly. He wears an eye patch despite not actually missing an eye, like someone who's trying way too hard to be unique. I will admit that when he was introduced on the show in Season 6, the way D&D had him portrayed, I thought they were making some kind of commentary on Donald Trump.

Ha! Forgot about the eyepatch. Anyone who thinks the show has made Ramsey or Euron ridiculous didn't pay attention to the books. Those guys might as well come on to every page with Benny freaking Hill music.

[XPac]

Does Dany want to rule with someone who

1. Has a better claim and could very likely be treated as the true ruler while she takes the Rhaeny’s/Visenya role to Jon’s Aegon

2. Has better ties to massive chunks of the realm like the North.

Also there is the question of whether Jon would want to marry Dany now that he knows they are related. It’s different in the North.

I do think Jon would be willing to marry her if it meant stability in the realms, like Tyrion is hoping it might. But again, I just don't think that's ever a possibility because he has the stronger claim to the throne. Unless Dany is willing to play second fiddle to Jon, at this point marriag wouldn't help much.

[SpiderClops]

Ha! Forgot about the eyepatch. Anyone who thinks the show has made Ramsey or Euron ridiculous didn't pay attention to the books. Those guys might as well come on to every page with Benny freaking Hill music.

I've only read the first two. I don't know if I'm ever going to read them all. But if Ramsey and Euron are somehow worse in books, that would be something.

[XPac]

Ha! Forgot about the eyepatch. Anyone who thinks the show has made Ramsey or Euron ridiculous didn't pay attention to the books. Those guys might as well come on to every page with Benny freaking Hill music.

According to Mythbusters, there's actually a reason a pirate might wear an eye patch even with both eyes. It gives you instant night vision. It's a plausible myth, so it's not confirmed they actually did that.

[MindofShadow]

Does Dany want to rule with someone who

1. Has a better claim and could very likely be treated as the true ruler while she takes the Rhaeny’s/Visenya role to Jon’s Aegon

2. Has better ties to massive chunks of the realm like the North.

Also there is the question of whether Jon would want to marry Dany now that he knows they are related. It’s different in the North.

Yeah, it wouldn't work at all because of those reasons.

Dany is a conqueror from Essos with armies from ethos (including savages) who likes to burn people to death with a big scary dragon (although those people tend to deserve it)

Jon actually lived here, raised as a lord (bastard lord but still), has the better claim via bloodline, immediately has an ally in the northern kingdom, has a cute pet dog (that he ignores lol), and nobody hates him lol.


still am curious what the "sweet" part of the bittersweet ending is going to be. This isn't going to end fun, outside of watching Euron and the Mountain die

[XPac]

Yeah, it wouldn't work at all because of those reasons.

Dany is a conqueror from Essos with armies from ethos (including savages) who likes to burn people to death with a big scary dragon (although those people tend to deserve it)

Jon actually lived here, raised as a lord (bastard lord but still), has the better claim via bloodline, immediately has an ally in the northern kingdom, has a cute pet dog (that he ignores lol), and nobody hates him lol.


still am curious what the "sweet" part of the bittersweet ending is going to be. This isn't going to end fun, outside of watching Euron and the Mountain die

The "happily ever after" ending would be Jon and Dany getting married and ruling the kingdom together. Not gonna happen.

The most believable "good" ending would be Jon on the Iron Throne and bringing peace to Westeros, with something tragic happening to Dany.

Most likely ending is that both Jon and Dany end up dead, and either some random third person ends up on the Iron Throne or no one ends up on it.