Secret Origins 6 (Spoilers)

[Shimbo]

I loved these 12 pages. Sudzuka's art looked better than ever before, the colors were bright, the dialogue was deliciously campy, and this probably gave me one of my favorite panels of the run (When Diana tells Steve "That doesn't mean you didn't" with that mischievous expression on her face). I thought Diana was brilliantly characterized as a young girl with a strong sense of curiosity and adventure that wanted to explore more of the world. I liked that we got to see a little more of Hippolyta's longing for a child. I liked that Athena was finally reintroduced into the WW mythos and has been observing Diana for some time. And, like the 0 issue, I loved that this was a fun and more light-hearted story. I've greatly enjoyed Azzarello and Chiang's run, but this is just what I needed. I'm so excited for next week, but I also dread that the next creative team might not be able to live up to this glorious run. For all of you who didn't enjoy this run, I really hope you can at least appreciate the love and care for Diana that these creator have for her and that you enjoy the next creative team and their Wonder Woman stories. I hope to be able to continue reading this book into the new creative team, but even if I don't, I have this great run to reread.

[toastedbread]

The use of the word "ticket" along with the sinister grin on her face seems pretty obvious to me. Steve is obviously wounded, perhaps groggy so he may not be 100% coherent of what Diana is saying. It's true, Diana may like Steve as a friend but I don't think she ever felt more than that for him based on this story and some others. I feel like she lead him on in order to get a personal tour guide of Man's World and once she got familiar with the place, she cut him loose. She may not have meant to cause Steve deliberate harm but she didn't stop herself from giving him false hope in order to serve her agenda of wanting to get off the island and get accustomed to Man's World. This explains why Johns and Gates kept most of the very early part of Diana's relationship a secret.

I am legitimately fascinated by the number of misogynistic stereotypes you're managing to fit into this interpretation of a grin only you seem to have viewed as sinister.

[Blacksun]

I got the impression that hipollyta and zeus were already lovers before conceiving diana , and Hipollyta didn't wanted to have a kid with him, but she gave up trying to do the clay become a child and then gave up to her desires.

[Dr. Poison]

I am legitimately fascinated by the number of misogynistic stereotypes you're managing to fit into this interpretation of a grin only you seem to have viewed as sinister.

If you're trying to put me down by suggesting that I'm the only one who feels this way, that's kind of immature. We all have differing opinions. Mine just isn't the popular one around here. I can live with that.

[GlennSimpson]

If you're trying to put me down by suggesting that I'm the only one who feels this way, that's kind of immature. We all have differing opinions. Mine just isn't the popular one around here. I can live with that.

I'll say if your reading is a "10", I'm at about an "8".

It reads to me that Diana did see the rescue of Steve as an opportunity to push her agenda of getting off the island. That doesn't mean she didn't like him and all, just that that wasn't her main motivation.

I would argue that Steve probably read more into it than was accurate, and then she had to eventually give him a solid "no, really..."

Which all in all is a much more interesting, modern interpretation than "girl meets boy, falls in love with boy, functionally speaking follows boy home..."

[Dr. Poison]

I'll say if your reading is a "10", I'm at about an "8".

It reads to me that Diana did see the rescue of Steve as an opportunity to push her agenda of getting off the island. That doesn't mean she didn't like him and all, just that that wasn't her main motivation.

I would argue that Steve probably read more into it than was accurate, and then she had to eventually give him a solid "no, really..."

Which all in all is a much more interesting, modern interpretation than "girl meets boy, falls in love with boy, functionally speaking follows boy home..."

Oh, I agree that Diana cares for Steve but I don't think those feelings go beyond friendship from what we've seen. Do I think she plotted to make Steve fall for her romantically? No, but she comes across as a bit of an opportunist in this story by the way she acted in the panel where she replies to Hippolyta.

[Silvanus]

That's not campiness so much as it's out of character. Where would Hippolyta learn the expression "make a weekend of it", or Diana the phrase "ticket out of here"?

She most likely wouldn't; but, just speaking for myself, I don't care. For me, the over-the-top Silver Age style is a signal to understand the dialogue as light and at times intentionally silly, and I accept that signal and enjoy the absurdities. It's like if I were watching the Adam West Batman, I wouldn't critique it for using ridiculously unscientific "science" in describing one of Batamn's gadgets; I'd see that as part of the joke. In other words, it's supposed to be ridiculous; ridiculous things can be funny and fun. But, of course, if it bugs you, it bugs you.

[Blacksun]

I'll say if your reading is a "10", I'm at about an "8".

It reads to me that Diana did see the rescue of Steve as an opportunity to push her agenda of getting off the island. That doesn't mean she didn't like him and all, just that that wasn't her main motivation.

I would argue that Steve probably read more into it than was accurate, and then she had to eventually give him a solid "no, really..."

Which all in all is a much more interesting, modern interpretation than "girl meets boy, falls in love with boy, functionally speaking follows boy home..."

well not sure about the interpretation that Steve was more into her than she was into him (some suggest that she wasn't even into him), but from what I read from JL, trinity war and WW she was into him as much as he was into her.

[toastedbread]

If you're trying to put me down by suggesting that I'm the only one who feels this way, that's kind of immature. We all have differing opinions. Mine just isn't the popular one around here. I can live with that.

I think you're the only person on this thread who found her grin sinister, yes, but more importantly I think you keep repeating that as though it's a fact (and a central one in your theory) when faced with opposition to the interpretation instead of explaining why. You're right, being the only one with an opinion doesn't render it wrong, but it usually helps to explain where that opinion comes from.

So far you've presented little to no textual evidence of your assertions other than your gut instinct because you didn't like the lady's smile. Suddenly her entire history with Steve is suspect! Why that hussy must have led him on! Kicked him to the curb as soon as she had no more use for him!

Women, amiright?

Honestly I have no idea what your opinion on women, media stereotyping or the gender-biased and presumptive use of phrases such as "leading him on" are. I don't know you. But I do know what you said earlier in this thread, and that's how what you're saying is coming across.

I'm not trying to put you down personally. I am trying to put down the gendered assumptions in your thesis.

[DragonPiece]

It was okay, but nothing spectacular. I really dug the art, and I liked Athena's design. It was missing the whimsy and magic of Diana and Steve's first meeting... it seemed like Diana saw Steve more as a "ticket" off the island rather than a love-at-first-sight sort of thing.

Which is how it was for the new 52 since he obviously comes across as not liking him like that in Justice League.

[Silvanus]

there's nothing suggesting that WW deceived Steve just to know better the man's world and after that kicked him out

It reads to me that Diana did see the rescue of Steve as an opportunity to push her agenda of getting off the island. That doesn't mean she didn't like him and all, just that that wasn't her main motivation.

Yep, I agree with both of these statements. At this particular moment, whatever attraction she already feels for him is a less powerful motivating force than her long-standing desire to leave the island. Bur that doesn't mean that she deceives him or that she couldn't later have become close to him for reasons other than his "usefulness."

No, but she comes across as a bit of an opportunist in this story by the way she acted in the panel where she replies to Hippolyta.

This seems like a more nearly supportable claim than saying that she was manipulative. Still, I think Diana was just being honest. She really wanted to go to Man's World, and she wasn't going to be dishonest and pretend that her only motivation was helping this stranger. Knowing her, that probably would have been motivation enough; after all, she's quick to help Zola in #1 when Zola is still a stranger. But she has a more exciting motivation for helping Steve get back to Man's World, and she's not hiding that. For me, this is no more opportunistic than getting paid to be a nurse or a social worker--and I don't find that opportunistic at all (even if one wouldn't do the work without the pay.)

[Dr. Poison]

I think you're the only person on this thread who found her grin sinister, yes, but more importantly I think you keep repeating that as though it's a fact (and a central one in your theory) when faced with opposition to the interpretation instead of explaining why. You're right, being the only one with an opinion doesn't render it wrong, but it usually helps to explain where that opinion comes from.

So far you've presented little to no textual evidence of your assertions other than your gut instinct because you didn't like the lady's smile. Suddenly her entire history with Steve is suspect! Why that hussy must have led him on! Kicked him to the curb as soon as she had no more use for him!

Women, amiright?

Honestly I have no idea what your opinion on women, media stereotyping or the gender-biased and presumptive use of phrases such as "leading him on" are. I don't know you. But I do know what you said earlier in this thread, and that's how what you're saying is coming across.

I'm not trying to put you down personally. I am trying to put down the gendered assumptions in your thesis.

It sounds to me like you're suggesting that I'm ok with a man raping a woman because she "led him on," which, I assure you is not the case. The case I'm making it based on the fact that we haven't seen any real evidence to support Diana having deep romantic feelings for Steve in the New 52. There's no denying that she cares for him but I think it was in a platonic sense much like she cares about the Flash or Aquaman. As for Diana's grin being sinister, I say that because it reminds me of the type of grin that the Joker would sport. Plus, given the Amazon community's stance towards men, would it really be that much of a stretch for Diana to see Steve(at least upon first meeting him) that he, as a man, is simply a means to an end? After all, that's what the Amazons sex raids are all about.

[GlennSimpson]

well not sure about the interpretation that Steve was more into her than she was into him (some suggest that she wasn't even into him), but from what I read from JL, trinity war and WW she was into him as much as he was into her.

Perhaps she loves him like a brother...

[Silvanus]

As for Diana's grin being sinister, I say that because it reminds me of the type of grin that the Joker would sport.

Really? What's the similarity? To me, she just looks excited.

Capture.jpg

Granted, her teeth are showing. Does this look sinister too?

[GlennSimpson]

Just for comparison.

Capture.JPG

Arguably the downturned eyebrows give it that look. If it was just pure joy or whatever, the eyebrows would be more upturned.

".\ /." is naughty.
"/. .\" is happy (well, it comes out worried here, but you get what I mean).