Dick Grayson: Robin, Nightwing, Agent of Spyral - Appreciation

[oasis1313]

The Legion of Superheroes used to have a subgroup of members who formed its Espionage Squad. I think a Justice League Espionage Squad could be cool, especially if Dick led it. We could have Grayson and Nightwing.

[Godlike13]

The titans will never be alternative to the league, because Dc sells the league on being the big guns, the premier team with the premier heroes, there the major leagues the titans are the juniors. The titans only work as teens and the youngest generation.

Of course the JL is DC's top team and that isn't gonna change, but their mentality should still be for them to be trying to be an alternative to the league. They should be wanting, and hungry, to build their own brand. Be that young team of hot shots that want to make an impact and challenged for the championship. Not be future JL, or their farm team.

[Ascended]

DC can't put the Titans away. As much as, fans here would like to believe, the brand is popular outside the realm of the comic books and thriving. It's doing really well. The only problem with the brand is only in comics. This is because, they probably have very bad editors, who doesn't give a damn about the brand.

I'm not talking about outside media. DC only has so much say in that in the first place. Let them make the live action show and the cartoon and whatever else. They absolutely should. I hope I enjoy it! But none of that impacts print. Larger media has been shown to not increase floppy sales by any real degree (yes, there is an exception or two). So success out there doesn't do the book much good. Let it rest for a couple years, find a viable creative team and direction and purpose and roster (whatever that ends up looking like, it'll all be down to execution), and then bring it back. It's not really even that big a deal. It's been done with this franchise in the past. It's done with plenty of titles.

Titans sales arent even bad though.

But they aren't that great either, correct? I haven't looked at the sales data in quite a while, I honestly don't know where the book is at these days. If the sales are good, then......fine, the smart business says don't fix what isn't broken. But if the book is only churning out mid-level sales? The IP can do better than that, and maybe a break and reset isn't the worst idea.

[Assam]

But they aren't that great either, correct? I haven't looked at the sales data in quite a while, I honestly don't know where the book is at these days. If the sales are good, then......fine, the smart business says don't fix what isn't broken. But if the book is only churning out mid-level sales? The IP can do better than that, and maybe a break and reset isn't the worst idea.

It varies, but it's generally the 10th or 1tth best selling ongoing they've got, only beaten out regularly by the four Batman and Superman books, Justice League, Flash, Wonder Woman, Harley and Supergirl.

[Se7en]

Going from Grayson to Nightwing was always going to be a step down, the identity is cursed with regression and forever being in the shadow of the bat.

At this point only hope is another new identity/direction.

[Godlike13]

Creatively maybe, but that’s not inherently due to Nightwing, but beyond that it wasn’t really a regression. He kept Seeley, and was actually being published more then he was. It wasn’t like when he went from Batman to Nightwing. The stuff with Raptor was of Grayson quality even IMO.

[WonderNight]

Yeah thee nightwing id is like that wrestler who has the fanbase, popularity and skills to be a main event world camp but company just wants him to stay a midcarder so he can build up lesser characters and not step on the toes of there bigger characters.

Nightwing needs to build his own corner and mythos, so DC/WB/ATT would want to invest in him and not just be batmans no.1 sidekick/sub.

Hell just look at the DCEU, they would rather reboot with a young batman and completely break there canon then go with bringing in nightwing. because in there eyes there is nothing to nightwing on his own and he's just a glorified wingman/sidekick.

until DC/WB wants more out of the nightwing id other than Junior league batman, He will alway be in there eyes just batman little helper.

[Badou]

Of course the JL is DC's top team and that isn't gonna change, but their mentality should still be for them to be trying to be an alternative to the league. They should be wanting, and hungry, to build their own brand. Be that young team of hot shots that want to make an impact and challenged for the championship. Not be future JL, or their farm team.

The problem is that the Titans will forever be that young team. They will always be made up of younger characters or "next generation" characters and that will forever position them as being lesser than the league regardless. The best championship they can challenge for is the junior varsity title because the JL are over competing in the varsity league. This becomes more and more of a problem the older characters like Dick get because you realize the limitations the Titans brand has when it comes to using adult heroes. If Dick was still a teen and part of the youngest DC generation this wouldn't be a problem, but because the Titans as a brand is rooted in "younger generation" heroes like Dick will never be looked at as first line heroes in big stories or events. He is stuck behind league heroes where he constantly gets trapped in stories like he is in now.

The idea that a Booster Gold or a Black Lightning are ever going to join the Titans is never happening. The team will forever be locked into characters that were already Titans or are younger generations of other heroes while first gen or equivalent heroes will always step over the Titans to interact with the League and join that team.

[phantom1592]

I wish they would just embrace the Superfriends idea that I grew up with. There's no reason that Batman AND Robin couldn't have been founding members of the League... or even for Robin to be a member after founding. As a kid the idea that Robin was a JLA member was just cemented because Batman and Robin were always partners and a solid team.

It would be a lot easier for Dick to get some more respect if he was a founding member who went off to start a team of his own with the titans and to get folded back in now that way.

Like people have been saying, The four pillars of the DC universe known throughout the world are Superman, Wonder Woman, Batman and Robin.


I mean, they keep rebooting the universe and trying to retcon the membership ANYWAY... hopefully next time they'll put Robin in there.

[Godlike13]

The Titans don’t have to actually be better then the JL, just cooler. They should be trying to drop the junior varsity perception, regardless if the JL is the top team, instead of embracing it like the current series is. The people in charge of the Titans comics just don’t want to put any effort behind it for some reason, and are content with Abnett just filling page space. Even though they are investing all this money to produce a TV show. Something I quite frankly just do not understand.

Regardless the JL is not going to do a damn thing for Dick. There is far more opportunity for Dick with the Titans then there is with the JL. As garbage as the current series is, and as much as Dick would be better off away from Abnett who is purposely trying to sabotage his character. The Titans brand is still one of DC’s most successful team brands, and Dick being the face of that brand will lead to more opportunity then a fleeting stint on the JL is going to.

[Vinsanity]

The Titans don’t have to actually be better then the JL, just cooler..

IT could be. It isn't.

Honestly I'm on the boat of Dick Grayson should be a solo hero now.

[Aahz]

I wish they would just embrace the Superfriends idea that I grew up with. There's no reason that Batman AND Robin couldn't have been founding members of the League... or even for Robin to be a member after founding. As a kid the idea that Robin was a JLA member was just cemented because Batman and Robin were always partners and a solid team.

It would be a lot easier for Dick to get some more respect if he was a founding member who went off to start a team of his own with the titans and to get folded back in now that way.

Like people have been saying, The four pillars of the DC universe known throughout the world are Superman, Wonder Woman, Batman and Robin.


I mean, they keep rebooting the universe and trying to retcon the membership ANYWAY... hopefully next time they'll put Robin in there.

Retcon like that don't really work, simply becasue we have at this point 50 something years of Justice League stories without Robin being a member. I mean the are trying that with Cyborg for Years and across all the Media, and it didn't really worked out.

I think in general that you can't really make a team, that is equal of the JLA in the current version with all the A-listers on the team. That could only work JL had roaster like in the Detroid or JLI era, and I don't think that DC will do something like that anytime soon.

I think the only real alternative to Titans for Dick could be the JSA, if they can bring it back in for similar to pre flashpoint. The "Spin off" Justice League Teams have (with the exception of Justice League Dark), never really been successful in recent years, and most of the other teams are to obscure.

[Black_Adam]

This status quo would be fine if this was dick just starting out as nightwing and it was still 1995. But a dick that's post Dickbat/Grayson in 2018 should be beyond this.

Nightwing right now should be a full on League member, Globetrotting badass JL infiltrator of spy and crime organizations, his own man that sits at the table with the DCU premier ADULT heroes and should be really close to all 3 trinity members. guest star JL member books. have a role in events and not put tubes or tide to chairs. Be on a team with ADULT not KIDS. Have a new fresh serious love interests who's not from his robin or titans days, then chill in his alantic city bludhaven for some downtime in between Globetrotting missions.

And mostly stop being treated like he's still a sidekick and not his own man! I shouldn't have look at dick and as an Adult and say the only thing thats different from when he was a Kid sidekick to now is that he's taller and has blue his costume.

I couldn't agree more, we have watched him grow up in front of our eyes: from boy wonder, to going out on his own as Nightwing to coming full cirlce and donning the mantle of Batman himself with his own Robin. The next natural step for Dick is full-time Justice League membership and I would actually take it a step further and have Dick as the main Batfamily rep on the Justice League, while Batman takes a backseat to focus on crime in Gotham. But Bruce would still answer the league's call when needed for crisis level events, kinda like how he semi-retired in the JL cartoon.

And yeah DC have failed to build a solid supporting cast/rogue's gallery around Dick as well, he has no iconic villains. Raptor is dead, William Cobb/Talon? Blockbuster? Or perhaps repurpose Hush as a adversary for Dick, since he was introduced DC have struggled to find anything to do for Hush, I liked the angle in Nightwing vs Hush that Tommy was jealous of how Dick had always been the closest to Bruce.

And is it me or is it a huge slap in the face to have Clark as the best man for the wedding over Dick?

[Restingvoice]

I wish I can say something, but I know where DC stands, I know where readers and reviewers stand, I already did my part by not supporting any titles, and I also feel continue complaining is just useless. I can't even protest to DC because the problem is fundamental. That they want to keep the League generation as long lasting as possible meaning everything else will be automatically pushed aside.

I just hope there are more people who realize how awful the situation, actually stop buying instead of collecting for the sake of whatever, so DC gets the message and the whole line can slowly die, or get better.

[adrikito]

BIG CBR MISTAKE:

https://www.cbr.com/deathstroke-vs-b...on-mastermind/

According CBR is Dick Grayson(not Tim Drake) the mastermind of deathstroke current events..