Omega Shenron vs. Beerus

[NK1988]

So I like to always be a year behind a trend. I recall back when BOG first came out there were tons of Power Level talks and how SSJG compared to SSJ4 and how Omega might compare with this guy.

But which takes the title of Strongest Villain of Dragonball?

[Kuro]

...This is not going to end well.

But, to be fast about it. Bills laughstomps him.

[master of read]

the only way this is a fight is via power scaling and that's not what we do here.

but yeah, bills stomps him and everyone else in GT

[Dark Soul # 7]

Bills wins this rather easily.

He won't even need to put down his afternoon pre-dinner snack.

[master of read]

Bills wins this rather easily.

He won't even need to put down his afternoo pre-dinner snack.

he'll win and have time to spend with his wife and the rest of the pimp hand. its karaoke night and jim singing johnny cash all night.

[NK1988]

What are Beerus' feats? OS has several statements about his ability to destroy the galaxy/universe. Canonical, out-of-universe statements.

Plus he should have FTL moves. (Goku's Kamehameha pushing Baby from Earth to the Sun in a few seconds)

[Awesome-X]

So I like to always be a year behind a trend. I recall back when BOG first came out there were tons of Power Level talks and how SSJG compared to SSJ4 and how Omega might compare with this guy.

But which takes the title of Strongest Villain of Dragonball?

Shenron should be much stronger, DBGT takes place much later (I think 17 years or something after Buu) than the new DBZ movie which only takes place a few years after the Buu Saga. So, everyone while no doubt stronger than in the Buu Saga won't be vastly stronger. While base Goku in GT was around his SS3 (Buu Saga) self, making Goku at his weakest in GT equal to Goku at his strongest in Buu Saga.


So, going by that SS1 Goku (GT) should be able to stomp a hole in SS3 Goku (Buu). Nevermind SS2, SS3, or the far stronger SS4. DBGT while not very good, is far beyond the power of the DBZ era. (with the exception being a hypo SS2 & SS3 Vegito)


PS. Does anyone else think the SS4 form would have looked better if the fur was gold & the eyes were green like the other SS forms?

[Hazard]

OS has several statements about his ability to destroy the galaxy/universe. Canonical, out-of-universe statements.

Statements aren't feats.

[abmccray]

Shenron should be much stronger, DBGT takes place much later (I think 17 years or something after Buu) than the new DBZ movie which only takes place a few years after the Buu Saga. So, everyone while no doubt stronger than in the Buu Saga won't be vastly stronger. While base Goku in GT was around his SS3 (Buu Saga) self, making Goku at his weakest in GT equal to Goku at his strongest in Buu Saga.


So, going by that SS1 Goku (GT) should be able to stomp a hole in SS3 Goku (Buu). Nevermind SS2, SS3, or the far stronger SS4. DBGT while not very good, is far beyond the power of the DBZ era. (with the exception being a hypo SS2 & SS3 Vegito)


PS. Does anyone else think the SS4 form would have looked better if the fur was gold & the eyes were green like the other SS forms?

Goku now has SSJG power in regular SSJ form, and SSJ3 is useles. SSJG power is ridiculously more powerful than end of Z stuff. Like, a factor of ultimate curbstomp-y.

[Saitou Hajime]

Shenron should be much stronger, DBGT takes place much later (I think 17 years or something after Buu) than the new DBZ movie which only takes place a few years after the Buu Saga. So, everyone while no doubt stronger than in the Buu Saga won't be vastly stronger.

Toriyama said he chose the particular time period that BoG was set in because everyone was at their prime at that point.

[big_adventure]

Toriyama said he chose the particular time period that BoG was set in because everyone was at their prime at that point.

But Toriyama didn't write GT, so what happens there has nothing to do with Toriyama canon. Toriyama can say whatever he wants, really, but since he didn't do one whole series here, he simply cannot talk about it authoritatively.

If one goes by "expected" Dragonball powerscaling (somewhat of a no-no here, but not a flat-out full stop, especially where DB is concerned - note below), SSJ4 and Omega Shenron should be stronger than Beerus. As stated, there has been a ton of training by that point for Goku and Vegeta (at least), and their base and other forms are significantly stronger than end-of-Z. Add a full new transformation with the explicit power-multiplication that implies, and the fact that Omega Shenron was still above either of them individually, and the dragon ought to beat the kitty.

But...

Based on the actual feats on screen...

Beerus has some casual planet-busting, plus casual f&$€-stomping of SSJ3 Goku and the semi-casual f&$€-stomping of SSJ2-but-so-mad-he-explicitly-surpasses-SSJ3-Goku Vegeta. That leaves him above the actual feats for Omega Shenron.

Now, a couple of points:

1. Powerscaling is not a complete no-no for DB on this site. Here's an example: who's more powerful, Dragonball Master Roshi or Cell Saga Krillin? Well, Master Roshi moon-busted with a charged attack. Krillin never does anything on that level. But nobody on this site is going to argue that Cell Saga Krillin isn't ludicrously more powerful than Dragonball-era Roshi. You just need to temper X < Y < Z logic to some extent, and make sure you don't ignore the feats.

2. DBGT, being, charitably, pretty mediocre in how it treats some stuff and not being canon besides, will not get the benefit of the doubt in Rumbles, at least, it never has since I started on Rumbles. So BotG, being AT-blessed and -stamped, gets precedence in the minds of most fans of the material. And obviously Beerus (discounting horrifying Whis debates) is the most powerful non-fused person in AT's canon, so he's always going to get the benefit of the doubt over the "not-real" GT crowd.

[abmccray]

What utterly destroys GT's potential power scaling is the giant jump that Toriyama canon characters got in BoG.

In BoG they figured out how to access an entirely different type of ki (god ki) which is much more potent/powerful than what they were using before, and once they get the god powerup, they can access this at any time.

In GT, they're still using standard ki, as stated a few times, and are therefore limited by the application of it. They're missing the new powerup jump, and therefore, cant' use the same algorithm. Pre-Bog, by powerscaling, yes Omega Shenron should be around 10 jumps up from Buu or something, but now that they introduced god ki, even that is gone.

[Amibo_Amore]

Based on the actual feats on screen...
Beerus has some casual planet-busting, plus casual f&$€-stomping of SSJ3 Goku and the semi-casual f&$€-stomping of SSJ2-but-so-mad-he-explicitly-surpasses-SSJ3-Goku Vegeta. That leaves him above the actual feats for Omega Shenron.

Correct me if I'm wrong (I haven't watched GT in a while), but wasn't Omega Shenron beating the ever loving **** out of SSJ4 Goku and Vegeta, who are both well above a SSJ3?

[Hazard]

Correct me if I'm wrong (I haven't watched GT in a while), but wasn't Omega Shenron beating the ever loving **** out of SSJ4 Goku and Vegeta, who are both well above a SSJ3?

That would count for something if GT had done something good for its feats which it mostly didn't.

[abmccray]

Correct me if I'm wrong (I haven't watched GT in a while), but wasn't Omega Shenron beating the ever loving **** out of SSJ4 Goku and Vegeta, who are both well above a SSJ3?

Beerus flicks SSJ3 Goku with a finger and knocks him around Kai's planet to the ground, and KOs him with a casual pressure point tap. It's way out of the league of what Omega does to Goku.