Wonder Woman #35 SPOILERS

[borntohula]

Anyone else who noticed this? There's probably more characters. Probably also settings and stuff.

Diana: Abandoned by Zeus. Hidden away so that Hera wouldn't kill her. Makes friends/family. Influences Hera. Raises an army to attack heaven.

First born: Abandoned by Zeus. Hidden away so that Zeus wouldn't kill him. Makes family/army. Influences Zeus. Raises an army and attacks heaven (twice).

Aleka: Hot headed red head from a "perfect" isolationist society. Is mean to Diana, because she likes her and can't express it any other way. Befriends Zola (a "victim" that doesn't want to be a burden and also got Olympian ties), who at one time rides Orion's A4 by herself. Is punished by Hera (reminded of that she was turned into a snake.). Last seen in a good way, dying while fighting for the amazons..

Orion: Hot headed red head from a "perfect" isolationist society. Is mean to Diana, because he likes her and can't express it any other way. Is a friend of Milan (a "victim" that doesn't want to be a burden and also got Olympian ties), who at one time rides Orion's A4 by himself. Is punished by Hera (reminded of that he's a dog, and should heel.). Last seen in a good way, joining in fighting for the amazons.

[numberthirty]

Anyone else who noticed this? There's probably more characters. Probably also settings and stuff.

Diana: Abandoned by Zeus. Hidden away so that Hera wouldn't kill her. Makes friends/family. Influences Hera. Raises an army to attack heaven.

First born: Abandoned by Zeus. Hidden away so that Zeus wouldn't kill him. Makes family/army. Influences Zeus. Raises an army and attacks heaven (twice).

Aleka: Hot headed red head from a "perfect" isolationist society. Is mean to Diana, because she likes her and can't express it any other way. Befriends Zola (a "victim" that doesn't want to be a burden and also got Olympian ties), who at one time rides Orion's A4 by herself. Is punished by Hera (reminded of that she was turned into a snake.). Last seen in a good way, dying while fighting for the amazons..

Orion: Hot headed red head from a "perfect" isolationist society. Is mean to Diana, because he likes her and can't express it any other way. Is a friend of Milan (a "victim" that doesn't want to be a burden and also got Olympian ties), who at one time rides Orion's A4 by himself. Is punished by Hera (reminded of that he's a dog, and should heel.). Last seen in a good way, joining in fighting for the amazons.

You never thought hidden children of Zeus = Post A.C. Minutemen?

[brettc1]

I do understand why you feel that way...Your post does help me better understand why you might not want the affair with Hippolyta to have led Zeus to seek a second chance, even if (hypothetically) the evidence would support that interpretation. Obviously my perspective is different, but I appreciate knowing yours

That would mean you have lived it. Possibly you have, but if not you may empathize but I dont think you can really understand

But it seems to me that a central, recurring theme in the Wonder Woman books since Marston has been the question of whether redemption is a possibility for everyone. Whether "redemption for all" is possible or not, it's a lovely idea--and perhaps it is loveliest when found in the midst of greatest ugliness. It's easy to cheer when Wonder Woman forgives the Baroness for what she did when she her daughter's life was being threatened by the Nazis, right? But when Diana offers a second chance to someone who we find truly disturbing, that might test our faith in the universal possibility of redemption.

That he manipulates his way into his second chance is something that I'm a little uncomfortable with, as I said above (in the second post on the thread, if I remember right). I expected Zeus' plan to be something Diana would resist, not help to complete. At the same time, though, I expect good writing to often leave me a little uncomfortable, and I can understand that "the good guys simply won, the bad guys simply lost" would have been a little simplistic for Azzarello.

Perhaps, but this story is still all about Zeus pulling the strings and everyone else dancing. The only difference is that he has traded super-powers. Instead of thunder and lightning he uses cuteness to get his way, since it is inevitable that Diana is not going to let a baby be hurt. Although there is plenty of evidence in the text to show that he can still take pretty good care of himself once he's born.

Another thing is that it all comes so easy for him. He doesn't have to own what he did or apologize - clearly he does not have the guts to do that. No, instead he just runs back to the womb literally rather than face what he is and the people he has used an hurt for centuries. His act of rebirth to me is not an attempt at becoming a better man as much as an act of despicable cowardice. He doesn't try to balance the scales, he dumps everything he has ever been and done onto his 'past self' and affects to be a completely different person that nobody can blame.

One might be tempted to think this was brave and selfless if it were not for all the other people his selfishness puts in danger. Zola/Athena, Hermes, Hippolyta, everyone the Firstborn kills, Hera, pretty much every single one of his children... the list goes on an on. What the hell did he think Hera was going to do when she found out about Hippolyta's affair? And yet he is so utterly churlish that he does not even tell his 'forbidden love' that is about to put the life of herself, her people and her daughter in dire danger.

He is, in short, completely loathsome. But we have to be nice to him because he has chubby cheeks and goes "Waaah" when he soils his pants.

Ugh!

Thanks. And I hope you were able to get some sleep. I was up late last night too. Insomnia sucks--perhaps we can agree on that, at least!

Perhaps.

[borntohula]

You never thought hidden children of Zeus = Post A.C. Minutemen?

Of course hehe Also the amazons now being the minutemen of Olympus, lions guarding the steps. Could also be argued that Orion = Remi Rome.

[raidensix]

So what was Athena's nickname?

Apollo = Sun
Artemis = Moon
Hermes = Messenger
Ares = War
Poseidon = Sea
Hades = Hell

Ares made an earlier quip about "Justice" but that should be Dike instead.

[Hawk80]

So what was Athena's nickname?

Apollo = Sun
Artemis = Moon
Hermes = Messenger
Ares = War
Poseidon = Sea
Hades = Hell

Ares made an earlier quip about "Justice" but that should be Dike instead.

I'll call her Minnie

[Silvanus]

So what was Athena's nickname?

Apollo = Sun
Artemis = Moon
Hermes = Messenger
Ares = War
Poseidon = Sea
Hades = Hell

Ares made an earlier quip about "Justice" but that should be Dike instead.

I think she's really Justice in Azz's mythos. Even though Dike was the personification of justice in the myths Athena, for the Athenians, was a kind of founder or patroness of Justice. In Athena's Justice: Athena, Athens and the Concept of jusice, Reebecca Futo Kennedy argues that

Athena.jpg

So, while it takes poetic license to ignore Dike and make Athena goddess of justice, I don't think it's an especially extravagant use of poetic license; it's not as if she wasn't associated with the concept of justice at all. Ares' quip, "No Justice, eh, Apollo?" reminded me in the Oresteia Athena and Apollo worked together to establish justice in Athens 9she as Orestes' judge and Apollo as his advocate or "attorney"); so I figured it would be particularly galling for him that she wouldn't recognize his succession as just.

[brettc1]

I think she's really Justice in Azz's mythos. Even though Dike was the personification of justice in the myths Athena, for the Athenians, was a kind of founder or patroness of Justice. In Athena's Justice: Athena, Athens and the Concept of jusice, Reebecca Futo Kennedy argues that

Athena.jpg

So, while it takes poetic license to ignore Dike and make Athena goddess of justice, I don't think it's an especially extravagant use of poetic license; it's not as if she wasn't associated with the concept of justice at all. Ares' quip, "No Justice, eh, Apollo?" reminded me in the Oresteia Athena and Apollo worked together to establish justice in Athens 9she as Orestes' judge and Apollo as his advocate or "attorney"); so I figured it would be particularly galling for him that she wouldn't recognize his succession as just.

Nothing of Orestes is actually mentioned in the book, of course.

Maybe this should be called The Leto Extrapolation.

[Awonder]

None of that is actually mentioned in the book, of course.

Maybe this should be called The Leto Extrapolation

Well played.

[Darius]

None of that is actually mentioned in the book, of course.

Maybe this should be called The Leto Extrapolation

She's Justice ... Issue 13

image.jpg

[Darius]

So what was Athena's nickname?

Apollo = Sun
Artemis = Moon
Hermes = Messenger
Ares = War
Poseidon = Sea
Hades = Hell

Ares made an earlier quip about "Justice" but that should be Dike instead.

It's more than a quip though. It's clear he's also naming Athena as Justice as well as taking a jab at Apollo. We see this type of double entrendre throughout Azzarello's writing.

[brettc1]

She's Justice ... Issue 13

image.jpg

I don't see Orestes name on that page anywhere

[Darius]

I don't see Orestes name on that page anywhere

But it's clear that Ares is naming Athena as Justice

[brettc1]

But it's clear that Ares is naming Athena as Justice

But nothing of Orestes is mentioned. Therefore we have no primary evidence to indicate that the events involving Athena and Orestes actually happened.

Hence - the Leto Extrapolation.

The Leto Extrapolation: An event which is suggested by a logical inference in relation to the written text and other source material, but which is neither absolutely confirmed or denied.

[Darius]

But nothing of Orestes is mentioned. Therefore we have no primary evidence to indicate that the events involving Athena and Orestes actually happened.

Hence - the Leto Extrapolation.

The Leto Extrapolation: An event which is suggested by a logical inference in relation to the written text and other source material, but which is neither absolutely confirmed or denied.

Ah, I see where the confusion lies ... I quoted the wrong post in my response! My bad